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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kansas State Basketball is hard => Topic started by: WillieWatanabe on January 17, 2011, 11:59:40 PM
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JohnGasaway
Leave Kansas State alone. They've failed to live up to expectations that were wrong to begin with. Not their fault.
:frown:
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god bless gasaway. hopefully pomeroy will take note and throw us a bone.
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god bless gasaway. hopefully pomeroy will take note and throw us a bone.
:pray:
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Gassaway called it from the start. Good for him.
I'll be blunt: Who did Kansas State charm this summer? No. 3 in the country? I can see No. 3 in the Big 12 -- maybe -- and Jacob Pullen can play for my team any day of the week. But shouldn't the third-best college team in the United States do more than simply hack and be hacked?
I'm open to persuasion, and certainly K-State will have a fantastic opportunity to change my mind right away. By Thanksgiving the Wildcats will have played Virginia Tech, Gonzaga and either Duke or Marquette. But right now I'm seeing an offense that couldn't hold onto the rock or make 3s against Big 12 defenses last season. It just doesn't say "No. 3 in the nation" to me.
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Gassaway called it from the start. Good for him.
I'll be blunt: Who did Kansas State charm this summer? No. 3 in the country? I can see No. 3 in the Big 12 -- maybe -- and Jacob Pullen can play for my team any day of the week. But shouldn't the third-best college team in the United States do more than simply hack and be hacked?
I'm open to persuasion, and certainly K-State will have a fantastic opportunity to change my mind right away. By Thanksgiving the Wildcats will have played Virginia Tech, Gonzaga and either Duke or Marquette. But right now I'm seeing an offense that couldn't hold onto the rock or make 3s against Big 12 defenses last season. It just doesn't say "No. 3 in the nation" to me.
I want to doubt these "numbers type guys" so much. But they're usually right on about most things. :frown:
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I want to doubt these "numbers type guys" so much. But they're usually right on about most things. :frown:
Yeah, I was chalking it up to Gasaway's hatred of Martin's "foul or be fouled" style of basketball. Gratned, we've made improvements in the hitting 3s department (for the most part), but we turn the ball over like crazy. Its hard enough to run offense when you aren't very good at it, even tougher when you waste the number of possessions that we do. Its only magnified by the fact that often a good pass for us is still a missed shot.
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I want to doubt these "numbers type guys" so much. But they're usually right on about most things. :frown:
Yeah, I was chalking it up to Gasaway's hatred of Martin's "foul or be fouled" style of basketball. Gratned, we've made improvements in the hitting 3s department (for the most part), but we turn the ball over like crazy. Its hard enough to run offense when you aren't very good at it, even tougher when you waste the number of possessions that we do. Its only magnified by the fact that often a good pass for us is still a missed shot.
I am going to need some numbers to support that. As a casual observer, I feel like we have shot about as bad as we could from outside. Certainly in conference play we have been awful.
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I am going to need some numbers to support that. As a casual observer, I feel like we have shot about as bad as we could from outside. Certainly in conference play we have been awful.
http://statsheet.com/mcb/beyondthearc/teams/kansas-state
Granted, we've been up and down, but the 37% we're shooting now is one of the better numbers for a K-State team in recent history. As you look at the charts, you can see the trends for threes from Huggs/Martin era is very consistent, while "fool's gold" Wooly and Asbury before him were all over the map.
Big 12 play has been 28.6%, 33.3%, 59.1%, and 18.8%, so yes we've been all over the map there and awful in our 2 road games. The data is limited right now, so we'll see how the season progresses, but if we want to win 8 or 9 games in the league we'll have to match our season average more often than not.
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We turn the ball over way way way way too much and commit too many fouls. Everything else is a minor problem compared to these two things.
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Our passing is no where near as crisp as it can be.
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Our passing is no where near as crisp as it can be.
Lots of our players do all kinds of lacksadasical stuff with the basketball. And Pullen for stretches will make great decisions on when to penetrate and then will have stretches of terrible penetration decisions. Those bad bunches (its usually 2 or 3 possessions in a 6 or 7 possession stretch) often lead to easy points for our opposition and lead to runs. Of course in the 2nd half against MU Sprads also had one of those strings so it must be getting contagious.
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Lots of our players do all kinds of lacksadasical stuff with the basketball. And Pullen for stretches will make great decisions on when to penetrate and then will have stretches of terrible penetration decisions. Those bad bunches (its usually 2 or 3 possessions in a 6 or 7 possession stretch) often lead to easy points for our opposition and lead to runs. Of course in the 2nd half against MU Sprads also had one of those strings so it must be getting contagious.
next board name.
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We turn the ball over way way way way too much and commit too many fouls. Everything else is a minor problem compared to these two things.
kind of agree. TO's and FTR are the biggest "issues". Overall, it's consistency. Our numbers look like they are equal, relatively speaking, compared to last year, however there are just huge swings to get us to our average. For example, last year, we had 22 games of >50% eFG (or about 73% of our games). This year we have 7 games (37% of our games). yet overall, last year we average through the course of the season a 50.8 eFG, this year it's 50.2.
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Lots of our players do all kinds of lacksadasical stuff with the basketball. And Pullen for stretches will make great decisions on when to penetrate and then will have stretches of terrible penetration decisions. Those bad bunches (its usually 2 or 3 possessions in a 6 or 7 possession stretch) often lead to easy points for our opposition and lead to runs. Of course in the 2nd half against MU Sprads also had one of those strings so it must be getting contagious.
next board name.
Would be perfect summary/name.
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Our passing is no where near as crisp as it can be.
95 seemed to be one of the better passers we have, but can't make a valid assessment from his minutes.
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But Gasaway was saying all of that stuff going into the tournament last year and was wrong. I also seem to remember him predicting big things for Baylor this year.
And despite last year's team having a propensity to turn the ball over, I don't think anyone foresaw how much worse it was going to be this year.
But whatever, I'm mostly still in denial about how downright mediocre to bad this team is.
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Seems like a lot of our turnovers are due to poor chemistry. Our ppg is low and we let teams go on stretches because we lose so many opportunities for even one shot in a posession.
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Seems like a lot of our turnovers are due to poor chemistry.
i bet poor handles, poor passing & kelly's incurable love of travelling have something to do with it.
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I blame lack of leadership for turnovers.
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We turn the ball over way way way way too much and commit too many fouls. Everything else is a minor problem compared to these two things.
kind of agree. TO's and FTR are the biggest "issues". Overall, it's consistency. Our numbers look like they are equal, relatively speaking, compared to last year, however there are just huge swings to get us to our average. For example, last year, we had 22 games of >50% eFG (or about 73% of our games). This year we have 7 games (37% of our games). yet overall, last year we average through the course of the season a 50.8 eFG, this year it's 50.2.
Offensive efficiency is the #1 problem with this team, mainly b/c of TOs and 2PT shooting and secondarily getting to the FT line. But when you waste more possessions with turnovers and miss more point blank shots, it makes sense to me that you will also draw fewer fouls. We have already had 9 games this year (out of 19) when our offensive efficieny is under 100. Last year we had 6 in 37 games. Martin year 2 we had 10 in 34 games, and Beasley year we had 7 in 33 games. It is hard to win when in nearly half of your games you are scoring less than 1 point per possession, no matter how well you play defensively.
And you are right, the numbers are a bit misleading b/c we have some good games and we have stretches in games where we play well, even in our losses. But when things go south they really go south, and then teams go on double digit runs against us. One of the things Martin's teams have always done well is avoiding those kinds of runs, mainly b/c when offense went south in the past we seemed to maintain defensive intensity and instead of 13-0 runs, we gave up a 7-0 run, which many times you can recover from. This year when offense goes south (and Martin teams will always have those moments), we don't maintain defensive intensity. Plus we are giving away more points off turnovers than in the past and not gaining as many and eventually all those things add up.
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really, the numbers don't look that similar anymore.