George Zimmerman is a piece of crap

[Emo EMAW]

Every time someone kills someone in self defense my point is made.  That happens a lot.

No it isn't.

Sure it is.  Someone kills someone, cops don't have the evidence to prosecute, point made.  While "murder" may have been committed by the letter of the law, you can't arrest without the evidence that would support a conviction.

How often does an unarmed teenager who isn't even trespassing on somebody's property killed in self defense?

Don't know, but...

Criminologist Gary Kleck estimates that 2.5 million Americans use guns to defend themselves each year. Out of that number, 400,000 believe that but for their firearms, they would have been dead.

Professor Emeritus James Q. Wilson, the UCLA public policy expert, says: "We know from Census Bureau surveys that something beyond 100,000 uses of guns for self-defense occur every year. We know from smaller surveys of a commercial nature that the number may be as high as 2 1/2 or 3 million. We don't know what the right number is, but whatever the right number is, it's not a trivial number."

So millions of times a year someone "defends" themselves with guns.  Of course someone doesn't die every time, but I'm betting lots do.  I also guarantee some of those were suspicious but not prosecuted.

http://townhall.com/columnists/larryelder/2012/07/26/yes_guns_kill_but_how_often_are_they_used_in_selfdefense/page/full

Those numbers are absurd.  Both of those clowns don't even pretend to support those assertions with actual data.. 

For a little context:  851 accidental gun deaths each year and 19,300 suicides with guns each year.  2.5 million times a year a gun is used to ward off a lowlife?  Give me a break.

It could a lot lower, sure.  But could be 100,000?  I think so.  That's a lot, IMO. 

[Rage Against the McKee]

Every time someone kills someone in self defense my point is made.  That happens a lot.

No it isn't.

Sure it is.  Someone kills someone, cops don't have the evidence to prosecute, point made.  While "murder" may have been committed by the letter of the law, you can't arrest without the evidence that would support a conviction.

How often does an unarmed teenager who isn't even trespassing on somebody's property killed in self defense?

Don't know, but...

Criminologist Gary Kleck estimates that 2.5 million Americans use guns to defend themselves each year. Out of that number, 400,000 believe that but for their firearms, they would have been dead.

Professor Emeritus James Q. Wilson, the UCLA public policy expert, says: "We know from Census Bureau surveys that something beyond 100,000 uses of guns for self-defense occur every year. We know from smaller surveys of a commercial nature that the number may be as high as 2 1/2 or 3 million. We don't know what the right number is, but whatever the right number is, it's not a trivial number."

So millions of times a year someone "defends" themselves with guns.  Of course someone doesn't die every time, but I'm betting lots do.  I also guarantee some of those were suspicious but not prosecuted.

http://townhall.com/columnists/larryelder/2012/07/26/yes_guns_kill_but_how_often_are_they_used_in_selfdefense/page/full

Those numbers are absurd.  Both of those clowns don't even pretend to support those assertions with actual data.. 

For a little context:  851 accidental gun deaths each year and 19,300 suicides with guns each year.  2.5 million times a year a gun is used to ward off a lowlife?  Give me a break.

It could a lot lower, sure.  But could be 100,000?  I think so.  That's a lot, IMO.

That is a lot. It could also be 1000. That's not a lot.

[Daddy Claxton]

Some people are so married to the idea of the great American justice system that they think a guy should get off after chasing, confronting, and eventually killing another person who was innocent of any wrongdoing whatsoever before being confronted by a hot-headed gun-toting vigilante. Sad, really.

I guess i fit in this category. I don't like the result here because i have my own assumptions as to what really happened, but I'm still glad prosecutors have to actually present credible evidence before putting someone in prison. Unfortunately that means the deck is sometimes stacked in favor of someone who deserves to be punished.

[michigancat]

Every time someone kills someone in self defense my point is made.  That happens a lot.

No it isn't.

Sure it is.  Someone kills someone, cops don't have the evidence to prosecute, point made.  While "murder" may have been committed by the letter of the law, you can't arrest without the evidence that would support a conviction.

How often does an unarmed teenager who isn't even trespassing on somebody's property killed in self defense?

Don't know, but...

Criminologist Gary Kleck estimates that 2.5 million Americans use guns to defend themselves each year. Out of that number, 400,000 believe that but for their firearms, they would have been dead.

Professor Emeritus James Q. Wilson, the UCLA public policy expert, says: "We know from Census Bureau surveys that something beyond 100,000 uses of guns for self-defense occur every year. We know from smaller surveys of a commercial nature that the number may be as high as 2 1/2 or 3 million. We don't know what the right number is, but whatever the right number is, it's not a trivial number."

So millions of times a year someone "defends" themselves with guns.  Of course someone doesn't die every time, but I'm betting lots do.  I also guarantee some of those were suspicious but not prosecuted.

http://townhall.com/columnists/larryelder/2012/07/26/yes_guns_kill_but_how_often_are_they_used_in_selfdefense/page/full

Those numbers are absurd.  Both of those clowns don't even pretend to support those assertions with actual data.. 

For a little context:  851 accidental gun deaths each year and 19,300 suicides with guns each year.  2.5 million times a year a gun is used to ward off a lowlife?  Give me a break.

here is Criminologist Gary Kleck's wikipedia picture:

[The Tonya Harding of Twitter Users Creep]

everyone but make it rain shutup

[MakeItRain]

If Martin Zimmerman felt he was in danger he, by law, can protect himself.

 

Goddamnit, I give you somewhat of a compliment and you go with an Emo argument. I said this before and I'll say it again, Martin was going home and trouble found him, Zimmerman was looking for trouble and he found it. Zimmerman following and then chasing Martin was the causative action.

[mocat]

it's like i'm talking to a brick wall here. move this SOB to the god forsaken PIT, for HEAVEN'S SAKES you guys

[steve dave]

it's like i'm talking to a brick wall here. move this SOB to the god forsaken PIT, for HEAVEN'S SAKES you guys

no, get past some of the dumbfucks and there is good conversation happening and it's not wholly political.

[Rage Against the McKee]

here is Criminologist Gary Kleck's wikipedia picture:

Holy cow. He probably accounted for 1 million self defenses last year alone. Maybe Emo's numbers are accurate.

[Pete]

OK, so this "stand your ground law" sounds kinda fishy.

If wikapedia is not lying to me, it seems the law is actually NOT good for the same sorts of people who seem to be in favor of it.

Another analysis of stand-your-ground laws by economists at Georgia State, using monthly data from the U.S. Vital Statistics, found a significant increase in homicide and injury among whites, especially white males.[8] They also analyzed data from the Health Care Utilization Project, which revealed significantly increased rates of emergency room visits and hospital discharges related to gun injuries in states which enacted these laws.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law

[mocat]

it's like i'm talking to a brick wall here. move this SOB to the god forsaken PIT, for HEAVEN'S SAKES you guys

no, behind some of the dumbfucks there is good conversation going on and it's not wholly political.

the pit is not political, don't kid yourself. it's just for people to argue until they're blue in the face (hands?) about stuff that brings you down.
not combo board material

[steve dave]

OK, so this "stand your ground law" sounds kinda fishy.

If wikapedia is not lying to me, it seems the law is actually NOT good for the same sorts of people who seem to be in favor of it.

Another analysis of stand-your-ground laws by economists at Georgia State, using monthly data from the U.S. Vital Statistics, found a significant increase in homicide and injury among whites, especially white males.[8] They also analyzed data from the Health Care Utilization Project, which revealed significantly increased rates of emergency room visits and hospital discharges related to gun injuries in states which enacted these laws.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law

yes, very awful law

[Emo EMAW]

Every time someone kills someone in self defense my point is made.  That happens a lot.

No it isn't.

Sure it is.  Someone kills someone, cops don't have the evidence to prosecute, point made.  While "murder" may have been committed by the letter of the law, you can't arrest without the evidence that would support a conviction.

How often does an unarmed teenager who isn't even trespassing on somebody's property killed in self defense?

Don't know, but...

Criminologist Gary Kleck estimates that 2.5 million Americans use guns to defend themselves each year. Out of that number, 400,000 believe that but for their firearms, they would have been dead.

Professor Emeritus James Q. Wilson, the UCLA public policy expert, says: "We know from Census Bureau surveys that something beyond 100,000 uses of guns for self-defense occur every year. We know from smaller surveys of a commercial nature that the number may be as high as 2 1/2 or 3 million. We don't know what the right number is, but whatever the right number is, it's not a trivial number."

So millions of times a year someone "defends" themselves with guns.  Of course someone doesn't die every time, but I'm betting lots do.  I also guarantee some of those were suspicious but not prosecuted.

http://townhall.com/columnists/larryelder/2012/07/26/yes_guns_kill_but_how_often_are_they_used_in_selfdefense/page/full

Those numbers are absurd.  Both of those clowns don't even pretend to support those assertions with actual data.. 

For a little context:  851 accidental gun deaths each year and 19,300 suicides with guns each year.  2.5 million times a year a gun is used to ward off a lowlife?  Give me a break.

It could a lot lower, sure.  But could be 100,000?  I think so.  That's a lot, IMO.

That is a lot. It could also be 1000. That's not a lot.

It's more than that.  Pretty shocking we don't have statistics for that stuff, though. 

[Kat Kid]

Hey Nuts Kicked.  Its more than that.  Ok?  It is pretty insane we don't have statistics that aren't completely made up to back him up on this point.  But come on.  You know it is more than 1,000 times a year that a guy with a gun is a complete hero and justifies having a gun with him and gets all the babes and buy a gun right over here because america.

[Emo EMAW]

Hey Nuts Kicked.  Its more than that.  Ok?  It is pretty insane we don't have statistics that aren't completely made up to back him up on this point.  But come on.  You know it is more than 1,000 times a year that a guy with a gun is a complete hero and justifies having a gun with him and gets all the babes and buy a gun right over here because america.

That's less than 3 times a day in a country with 300M people and just as many guns.  Sniff test brah.

[Rage Against the McKee]

Hey Nuts Kicked.  Its more than that.  Ok?  It is pretty insane we don't have statistics that aren't completely made up to back him up on this point.  But come on.  You know it is more than 1,000 times a year that a guy with a gun is a complete hero and justifies having a gun with him and gets all the babes and buy a gun right over here because america.

That's less than 3 times a day in a country with 300M people and just as many guns.  Sniff test brah.

The first figure you posted showed that nearly 1 in 100 Americans successfully defend themselves with a gun every single year.

[The Tonya Harding of Twitter Users Creep]

OK, so this "stand your ground law" sounds kinda fishy.

If wikapedia is not lying to me, it seems the law is actually NOT good for the same sorts of people who seem to be in favor of it.

Another analysis of stand-your-ground laws by economists at Georgia State, using monthly data from the U.S. Vital Statistics, found a significant increase in homicide and injury among whites, especially white males.[8] They also analyzed data from the Health Care Utilization Project, which revealed significantly increased rates of emergency room visits and hospital discharges related to gun injuries in states which enacted these laws.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law

jeff foxworthy wrote that law. im positive.

[Rage Against the McKee]

OK, so this "stand your ground law" sounds kinda fishy.

If wikapedia is not lying to me, it seems the law is actually NOT good for the same sorts of people who seem to be in favor of it.

Another analysis of stand-your-ground laws by economists at Georgia State, using monthly data from the U.S. Vital Statistics, found a significant increase in homicide and injury among whites, especially white males.[8] They also analyzed data from the Health Care Utilization Project, which revealed significantly increased rates of emergency room visits and hospital discharges related to gun injuries in states which enacted these laws.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law

jeff foxworthy wrote that law. im positive.

Hmmm.

If being stripped of your Constitutional right to defend yourself makes you more “safe” according to the government — you might live in a nation that was founded by geniuses but is run by idiots.

It looks like he might have at least been a co-author.

[Paul Moscow]

OK, so this "stand your ground law" sounds kinda fishy.

If wikapedia is not lying to me, it seems the law is actually NOT good for the same sorts of people who seem to be in favor of it.

Another analysis of stand-your-ground laws by economists at Georgia State, using monthly data from the U.S. Vital Statistics, found a significant increase in homicide and injury among whites, especially white males.[8] They also analyzed data from the Health Care Utilization Project, which revealed significantly increased rates of emergency room visits and hospital discharges related to gun injuries in states which enacted these laws.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law

jeff foxworthy wrote that law. im positive.

I thought it well stated here with regards to Stand Your Ground and the NRA's basic creation of it, (from Wash Post)

What’s insidious about Stand Your Ground laws is that in every jurisdiction that has them, these statutes tilt the balance of power in any street encounter in favor of the person who has a gun. That’s what happened in the Martin case. The law provides a perverse incentive for everyone to be armed.

[Kat Kid]

Hey Nuts Kicked.  Its more than that.  Ok?  It is pretty insane we don't have statistics that aren't completely made up to back him up on this point.  But come on.  You know it is more than 1,000 times a year that a guy with a gun is a complete hero and justifies having a gun with him and gets all the babes and buy a gun right over here because america.

That's less than 3 times a day in a country with 300M people and just as many guns.  Sniff test brah.

Should be crap tons of anecdotal news stories about it.  I mean at least 150/yr or so.  Kind of weird I hardly ever hear about them.  Since we have forgone any pretense about just going with our feelings here.

[EllRobersonisInnocent]

If Martin Zimmerman felt he was in danger he, by law, can protect himself.

 

Goddamnit, I give you somewhat of a compliment and you go with an Emo argument. I said this before and I'll say it again, Martin was going home and trouble found him, Zimmerman was looking for trouble and he found it. Zimmerman following and then chasing Martin was the causative action.

It was sarcastic, I had the  originally but changed it last second. I did appreciate the compliment though

[puniraptor]

The thing about this that grinds me is that there is just as much evidence that Trayvon was defending himself against George as the other way around, but only one of them gets to test their story against the burden of proof.

[K-S-U-Wildcats!]

OK, so this "stand your ground law" sounds kinda fishy.

If wikapedia is not lying to me, it seems the law is actually NOT good for the same sorts of people who seem to be in favor of it.

Another analysis of stand-your-ground laws by economists at Georgia State, using monthly data from the U.S. Vital Statistics, found a significant increase in homicide and injury among whites, especially white males.[8] They also analyzed data from the Health Care Utilization Project, which revealed significantly increased rates of emergency room visits and hospital discharges related to gun injuries in states which enacted these laws.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stand-your-ground_law

yes, very awful law

This law is not at issue in this case.

[SkinnyBenny]

Am I the only one who doesn't think this whole thing is interesting or remarkable in any way?

No.  That's why I'm mocking the crap out of it.  Should be a non-story, like Tebow.

Absolutely shouldn't be a non-story, btw.

[EllRobersonisInnocent]

The thing about this that grinds me is that there is just as much evidence that Trayvon was defending himself against George as the other way around, but only one of them gets to test their story against the burden of proof.

lol, that is just silly and not true