How good is Will Howard???

[deputy dawg]

The fact we didn't run more in that game was odd. It seemed to me like the weirdest coached Kstate game since Prince. Will wasn't the only one who had a terrible game, imo.

Not much mentioned about the very weird coaching - though someone did mention we didn't run as much as we could.  Giddens wasn't looking sharp, so I think the coaching staff put too little emphasis on the run.

[MadCat]

OSU runs a 3-3-5 as well don't they?  Wouldn't that be more susceptible to the run...maybe more play-action or RPO?  NOTE: I'm not a coach and I didn't put much analysis into the play calling either.

[BIG APPLE CAT]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

I mean, we’d put Will back in. I don’t think it’s as complex as the scenario you’ve concocted in your head is making it out to be. If we put in Avery and he’s worse than Will, then we put Will back in. Simple. Might that mess up his rhythm? Maybe, but the fact that we’re even having this conversation in the first place means his rhythm hasn’t been that good. We’ve lost two games we absolutely should’ve won. Is that all on Will? Of course not. But frankly we’re better than our 3-2 record.

SkiBe makes a good point and I did a little research on the rulebook...and unlike futbol, it is actually allowed for a player to come out of the game and then later go back in the game. One of those weird quirky oft confused rules.

[yoga-like_abana]

He ran out of gas on his longer run. Maybe should've spent more time conditioning and less NIL stuff 

[DQ12]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

Avery isn't as reliant on WRs to be good, imo.

Will averaged 10 yards a rush on Friday and is at 6 ypc on the year.

I know.  That doesn’t make what I said less true, though.  I don’t think it’s controversial to assume Avery is a better runner (faster and shiftier) than Will.  That’s one of the major things that made him an elite prospect.

We haven’t seen it, but I also assume Avery is probably more elusive in the pocket than Will is and would be more likely to extend plays.  Will hasn’t really been “creating for himself” in the pocket this year, which is inconvenient given how bad the pass blocking has been.  He’s likely banged up, but I think he was considerably better at moving around and escaping pressure last year.

[MakeItRain]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

I mean, we’d put Will back in. I don’t think it’s as complex as the scenario you’ve concocted in your head is making it out to be. If we put in Avery and he’s worse than Will, then we put Will back in. Simple. Might that mess up his rhythm? Maybe, but the fact that we’re even having this conversation in the first place means his rhythm hasn’t been that good. We’ve lost two games we absolutely should’ve won. Is that all on Will? Of course not. But frankly we’re better than our 3-2 record.

You think that's good for the long and short term for either of them? You'd think we've seen enough examples of quarterback shuffling, at K-State alone, to know it doesn't work. We literally just saw it on Friday night with Oklahoma State. Ell Roberson & Marc Dunn, the entire 2004 & 05 seasons, Jake Waters & Daniel Sams, Joe Hubener & Cody Cook, Alex Delton & Skylar Thompson. Those were all sister's situations where the coaches couldn't decide who the guy was, then when they finally did, we almost instantly got better.

[MakeItRain]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

I mean, we’d put Will back in. I don’t think it’s as complex as the scenario you’ve concocted in your head is making it out to be. If we put in Avery and he’s worse than Will, then we put Will back in. Simple. Might that mess up his rhythm? Maybe, but the fact that we’re even having this conversation in the first place means his rhythm hasn’t been that good. We’ve lost two games we absolutely should’ve won. Is that all on Will? Of course not. But frankly we’re better than our 3-2 record.

SkiBe makes a good point and I did a little research on the rulebook...and unlike futbol, it is actually allowed for a player to come out of the game and then later go back in the game. One of those weird quirky oft confused rules.

That's cute. I admittedly barely know jack crap about football, what I do know is that when it comes to playing time and preparation, the quarterback is unique in the sport when it comes to substitution patterns. If you want to act like our coaches are uniquely stupid by not treating the quarterbacks like corners and subbing them out every other play, like it's a video game, that's cool with me, it won't change the reality of the situation, but we can all have fun with snarky LOLs.

[michigancat]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

I mean, we’d put Will back in. I don’t think it’s as complex as the scenario you’ve concocted in your head is making it out to be. If we put in Avery and he’s worse than Will, then we put Will back in. Simple. Might that mess up his rhythm? Maybe, but the fact that we’re even having this conversation in the first place means his rhythm hasn’t been that good. We’ve lost two games we absolutely should’ve won. Is that all on Will? Of course not. But frankly we’re better than our 3-2 record.

You think that's good for the long and short term for either of them? You'd think we've seen enough examples of quarterback shuffling, at K-State alone, to know it doesn't work. We literally just saw it on Friday night with Oklahoma State. Ell Roberson & Marc Dunn, the entire 2004 & 05 seasons, Jake Waters & Daniel Sams, Joe Hubener & Cody Cook, Alex Delton & Skylar Thompson. Those were all sister's situations where the coaches couldn't decide who the guy was, then when they finally did, we almost instantly got better.

I mean we kind of did that last year even if it was injury-driven. And I'd say Roberson and Waters and Thompson ended up about as well as you could expect in the long term. Plus Cook and Bazooka were both seniors, weren't they?

[Kid In the Hall]

There's also a difference between toggling between two QBs because you can't decide and INTENTIONALLY playing two QBs and running plays specifically designed for the two QBs when they're in the game. The latter isn't always successful, but it certainly can be - see Florida's 2006 national title when Leak was the primary QB, but they brought in Tebow (true freshman) in regularly for specific game situations (mostly for the QB run game, which Leak was poor at).

In our case, Howard is playing poorly and, if we did that now, it'll obviously look like a move made because of that (that's why, had this coaching staff gameplanned all along with AJ, it wouldn't look that way now). Instead of taking the long view, the staff should have realized that when you have an elite talent like AJ, you get the kid on the field - even if it's only 10-15 plays a game. Screw a redshirt and 5 years - get the kid on the field.

Regardless, in my view, Will's got another 1-2 games to salvage himself as "the guy" and if he can't, burn it down and play Rubley, AJ, whomever. Because if Will plays at the level of what he played at vs. OSU, he no longer deserves to be "the guy" - the coaches will know it, the players will know it and even us dumb fans will know it.

[catastrophe]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

I mean, we’d put Will back in. I don’t think it’s as complex as the scenario you’ve concocted in your head is making it out to be. If we put in Avery and he’s worse than Will, then we put Will back in. Simple. Might that mess up his rhythm? Maybe, but the fact that we’re even having this conversation in the first place means his rhythm hasn’t been that good. We’ve lost two games we absolutely should’ve won. Is that all on Will? Of course not. But frankly we’re better than our 3-2 record.

You think that's good for the long and short term for either of them? You'd think we've seen enough examples of quarterback shuffling, at K-State alone, to know it doesn't work. We literally just saw it on Friday night with Oklahoma State. Ell Roberson & Marc Dunn, the entire 2004 & 05 seasons, Jake Waters & Daniel Sams, Joe Hubener & Cody Cook, Alex Delton & Skylar Thompson. Those were all sister's situations where the coaches couldn't decide who the guy was, then when they finally did, we almost instantly got better.

I mean we kind of did that last year even if it was injury-driven. And I'd say Roberson and Waters and Thompson ended up about as well as you could expect in the long term. Plus Cook and Bazooka were both seniors, weren't they?

We did it last year, but I don’t think there’s a clear case to be made that it benefitted us. It seemed like Howard was clearly the better QB.

Not that anyone should mind getting Avery in for a few packages here and there like Taysum Hill with New Orleans. That’s quite a bit different than covering for poor starting QB performance though.

[Stupid Fitz]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

I mean, we’d put Will back in. I don’t think it’s as complex as the scenario you’ve concocted in your head is making it out to be. If we put in Avery and he’s worse than Will, then we put Will back in. Simple. Might that mess up his rhythm? Maybe, but the fact that we’re even having this conversation in the first place means his rhythm hasn’t been that good. We’ve lost two games we absolutely should’ve won. Is that all on Will? Of course not. But frankly we’re better than our 3-2 record.

You think that's good for the long and short term for either of them? You'd think we've seen enough examples of quarterback shuffling, at K-State alone, to know it doesn't work. We literally just saw it on Friday night with Oklahoma State. Ell Roberson & Marc Dunn, the entire 2004 & 05 seasons, Jake Waters & Daniel Sams, Joe Hubener & Cody Cook, Alex Delton & Skylar Thompson. Those were all sister's situations where the coaches couldn't decide who the guy was, then when they finally did, we almost instantly got better.

I mean we kind of did that last year even if it was injury-driven. And I'd say Roberson and Waters and Thompson ended up about as well as you could expect in the long term. Plus Cook and Bazooka were both seniors, weren't they?

We did it last year, but I don’t think there’s a clear case to be made that it benefitted us. It seemed like Howard was clearly the better QB.

Not that anyone should mind getting Avery in for a few packages here and there like Taysum Hill with New Orleans. That’s quite a bit different than covering for poor starting QB performance though.

Maybe this is the bigger problem? The coaches not identifying the best QB. 

[MakeItRain]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

I mean, we’d put Will back in. I don’t think it’s as complex as the scenario you’ve concocted in your head is making it out to be. If we put in Avery and he’s worse than Will, then we put Will back in. Simple. Might that mess up his rhythm? Maybe, but the fact that we’re even having this conversation in the first place means his rhythm hasn’t been that good. We’ve lost two games we absolutely should’ve won. Is that all on Will? Of course not. But frankly we’re better than our 3-2 record.

You think that's good for the long and short term for either of them? You'd think we've seen enough examples of quarterback shuffling, at K-State alone, to know it doesn't work. We literally just saw it on Friday night with Oklahoma State. Ell Roberson & Marc Dunn, the entire 2004 & 05 seasons, Jake Waters & Daniel Sams, Joe Hubener & Cody Cook, Alex Delton & Skylar Thompson. Those were all sister's situations where the coaches couldn't decide who the guy was, then when they finally did, we almost instantly got better.

I mean we kind of did that last year even if it was injury-driven. And I'd say Roberson and Waters and Thompson ended up about as well as you could expect in the long term. Plus Cook and Bazooka were both seniors, weren't they?

No we didn't, last year. Adrian got hurt and Will took his job. They gave Adrian one game to prove that he could be the guy, he couldn't and it was over. Yes, with Ell, Jake, and Sky, once they were given the jobs they took over and thrived. K-State and Skylar got lucky as hell that Bill left in '18, he might have never made an NFL roster if Bill stayed here.

[MakeItRain]

There's also a difference between toggling between two QBs because you can't decide and INTENTIONALLY playing two QBs and running plays specifically designed for the two QBs when they're in the game. The latter isn't always successful, but it certainly can be - see Florida's 2006 national title when Leak was the primary QB, but they brought in Tebow (true freshman) in regularly for specific game situations (mostly for the QB run game, which Leak was poor at).

In our case, Howard is playing poorly and, if we did that now, it'll obviously look like a move made because of that (that's why, had this coaching staff gameplanned all along with AJ, it wouldn't look that way now). Instead of taking the long view, the staff should have realized that when you have an elite talent like AJ, you get the kid on the field - even if it's only 10-15 plays a game. Screw a redshirt and 5 years - get the kid on the field.

Regardless, in my view, Will's got another 1-2 games to salvage himself as "the guy" and if he can't, burn it down and play Rubley, AJ, whomever. Because if Will plays at the level of what he played at vs. OSU, he no longer deserves to be "the guy" - the coaches will know it, the players will know it and even us dumb fans will know it.

You know as well as I do that goes poorly way more than it does well. I want Avery to get touches but it doesn't feel like the smoothest QB operation right now. In this specific case we're a little stuck because the thing that, PRESUMABLY, Avery does best, is the thing that Will is doing best right now.

I do agree with your last paragraph and I'm a bit worried. If Will stinks on Saturday night, Avery's got to be the guy next week. I think it's very possible that either Will presses or he plays way too conservative, in the pass game, like Adrian did last year when he was clearly scared of throwing picks.

[michigancat]

If Will has an early INT this Saturday, I'd bench him.

What are you going to do if Avery comes in and looks like crap partially because he's had limited first team snaps in practice. He's been preparing like a backup then you're going to have him come in and clean someone else's mess.

If Will is going to be benched for Avery it needs to be because Will got hurt or the decision was made during the week so Avery and the entire offense can properly prepare, this isn't PlayStation. I keep hearing from people, who I'll take at their work that they know what they're talking about, that the receivers have not been good, that's gonna change with a quarterback who hasn't been prepared to run the offense?

I mean, we’d put Will back in. I don’t think it’s as complex as the scenario you’ve concocted in your head is making it out to be. If we put in Avery and he’s worse than Will, then we put Will back in. Simple. Might that mess up his rhythm? Maybe, but the fact that we’re even having this conversation in the first place means his rhythm hasn’t been that good. We’ve lost two games we absolutely should’ve won. Is that all on Will? Of course not. But frankly we’re better than our 3-2 record.

You think that's good for the long and short term for either of them? You'd think we've seen enough examples of quarterback shuffling, at K-State alone, to know it doesn't work. We literally just saw it on Friday night with Oklahoma State. Ell Roberson & Marc Dunn, the entire 2004 & 05 seasons, Jake Waters & Daniel Sams, Joe Hubener & Cody Cook, Alex Delton & Skylar Thompson. Those were all sister's situations where the coaches couldn't decide who the guy was, then when they finally did, we almost instantly got better.

I mean we kind of did that last year even if it was injury-driven. And I'd say Roberson and Waters and Thompson ended up about as well as you could expect in the long term. Plus Cook and Bazooka were both seniors, weren't they?

No we didn't, last year. Adrian got hurt and Will took his job. They gave Adrian one game to prove that he could be the guy, he couldn't and it was over. Yes, with Ell, Jake, and Sky, once they were given the jobs they took over and thrived. K-State and Skylar got lucky as hell that Bill left in '18, he might have never made an NFL roster if Bill stayed here.

Adrian started against Texas and Baylor - Will came off the bench against BU after Martinez got hurt

[pissclams]

perhaps will isn’t the problem.  have any of you considered that avery could be negatively influencing will? 

[wetwillie]

I won't stand for any Avery bashing on this blog site. Take it back.

[yoga-like_abana]

perhaps will isn’t the problem.  have any of you considered that avery could be negatively influencing will?

Maybe it's the influencer influencing them both?

[BIG APPLE CAT]

perhaps will isn’t the problem.  have any of you considered that avery could be negatively influencing will?

Every knucklehead on this blog knows that The Moon is what primarily affects the tides. Is it the only thing? No, of course not. The Sun is the gorilla in the room when it comes to mass. But that gorilla is a long ways away. The question is…who is the Moon and who is the Sun in that locker room?

And young man I suggest you take a long look in the mirror and make sure you’re prepared for the answer (bc at this exact moment I don’t think you are)

[DQ12]

perhaps will isn’t the problem.  have any of you considered that avery could be negatively influencing will?

perhaps this is what the owl was trying to tell us

[PurpleOil]

perhaps will isn’t the problem.  have any of you considered that avery could be negatively influencing will?

Every knucklehead on this blog knows that The Moon is what primarily affects the tides. Is it the only thing? No, of course not. The Sun is the gorilla in the room when it comes to mass. But that gorilla is a long ways away. The question is…who is the Moon and who is the Sun in that locker room?

And young man I suggest you take a long look in the mirror and make sure you’re prepared for the answer (bc at this exact moment I don’t think you are)

Deep thoughts with The Deep.

[stunted]

RECORD WATCH

In the secondary, the Red Raiders like to play man coverage and have a lot of length as well. The secondary is also very aggressive and will look to make plays on the ball.

might break the single game interception record

[wetwillie]

What's the record for INT's + Fumbles?

[michigancat]

well, the single game interception record is 7 held by Lynn Dickey:

https://www.huskermax.com/game/1970-kansas-state-football/

I doubt Will has a combined 8 turnovers against Texas Tech Saturday.

[michigancat]

well, the single game interception record is 7 held by Lynn Dickey:

https://www.huskermax.com/game/1970-kansas-state-football/

I doubt Will has a combined 8 turnovers against Texas Tech Saturday.

old time press conferences were a hoot





https://www.newspapers.com/image/313622423/?fcfToken=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJmcmVlLXZpZXctaWQiOjMxMzYyMjQyMywiaWF0IjoxNjk3MTQ1NzgzLCJleHAiOjE2OTcyMzIxODN9.Tv_w0jDz-UBspLQjkS7p0weAmjvcUUddcBfWIby6bt8

[Kid In the Hall]

Klein today:

"I think we've got a good plan for Avery moving forward this week, but obviously Will (Howard) will be the main guy."

Guess we'll find out what that means...