fred peete

[sys]

in zen's ridiculous thread about player transfers, peete's name came up.  i wanted to opine, but didn't want to contribute to that thread.

peete's WORST trait, not his best trait, was that he was a playmaker.  or at least he thought he was.  he was a great defender, a very good rebounder, and he shot fairly well from outside.  however he was horrible on the drive.  in conference play he actually hit a significantly higher percentage from 3 than from inside the arc.  .390 vs .347.  he did get to the line fairly well, and hit a fairly decent % while there, but not enough to make up for shooting as many 2 point shots as he did at a 35% clip.  actually, i think you could argue that part of the reason ksu lost a few winnable games last year is that peete shot too many shots that massey and martin could have taken.

i am not arguing that peete would not have helped this team.  he would have been great as the 2 instead of harris, and if he could have improved his shot selection from his first year, which many juco players do, he could have been a very valuable scorer as well as joining with wright to provide an imposing defensive backcourt.

it might also interest people to go back and look at wright vs peete stats.  they are pretty similar statistics wise in many respects.  assists, turnovers, rebounds, etc.

[ksu_FAN]

Yeah, Wright was basically the replacement for Peete.  Peete has a better offensive game, but Wright was overall a better defender.  Probably pretty much a wash in the end IMO.

If Wright has been a little better on offense he would've had a great shot at Newcomer of the Year.

[michigancat]

The bottom line is Peete was our best returing player, best defender, and best rebounder.  Peete gave Wooly wins, kept games close, and gave him ammo for Wooly's "young talent" defense.

I will agree that he had poor shot selection on drives - he anticipated the foul that didn't come way too often.  I think this would have improved this season, perhaps enough to save JW's job.  I don't think Peete cost us nearly as many games as he won for us.

[BarryMcCockner]

The bottom line is Peete was our best returing player, best defender, and best rebounder.

Better than Cartier?  No way, you'll never convince me.

[slucat]

He was probably the best all round player. If Peete were here this season, we've got at least 2 if not 3 more wins...

[BarryMcCockner]

He shot 37 pecent on the season and led the team in turnovers.  He was the best player for the other team on numerous nights, forcing tons of bad shots and commiting heinous turnovers.  He might have won a couple of games for us, but he would have lost at least that many that we won.

[michigancat]

He shot 37 pecent on the season and led the team in turnovers. He was the best player for the other team on numerous nights, forcing tons of bad shots and commiting heinous turnovers. He might have won a couple of games for us, but he would have lost at least that many that we won.

Which games did he lose?

Without looking, I would give him credit for the Wyoming and aTm wins.

[kougar24]

Rusty, you think Peete was better than Cartier?

[michigancat]

Rusty, you think Peete was better than Cartier?

At the end of last year?  Without a doubt.  Cartier was still potential.

[opcat]

in zen's ridiculous thread about player transfers, peete's name came up.  i wanted to opine, but didn't want to contribute to that thread.

peete's WORST trait, not his best trait, was that he was a playmaker.  or at least he thought he was.  he was a great defender, a very good rebounder, and he shot fairly well from outside.  however he was horrible on the drive.  in conference play he actually hit a significantly higher percentage from 3 than from inside the arc.  .390 vs .347.  he did get to the line fairly well, and hit a fairly decent % while there, but not enough to make up for shooting as many 2 point shots as he did at a 35% clip.  actually, i think you could argue that part of the reason ksu lost a few winnable games last year is that peete shot too many shots that massey and martin could have taken.

i am not arguing that peete would not have helped this team.  he would have been great as the 2 instead of harris, and if he could have improved his shot selection from his first year, which many juco players do, he could have been a very valuable scorer as well as joining with wright to provide an imposing defensive backcourt.

it might also interest people to go back and look at wright vs peete stats.  they are pretty similar statistics wise in many respects.  assists, turnovers, rebounds, etc.

You can opine all you want.  Nothing ridiculous about it.  You think transfers aren't  out of the question with our history ?   


 

[knealio]

Peete had skills for sure.  But his turnovers jut pissed me off nite after nite.  And his shot selection to an extent.  I think he said that the main reason he wanted to transfer was a chance to play the point, wasn't it?  He will never be a solid point guard, that much was obvious to me.

It would of been nice to see how much better he could of become after being in the system for a complete year.  He seemed to leave school after one year at the other schools he bolted from(I think KSU was number 3).  He was a gamer for sure, much better than Harris is.  Lance hurts the team big time when he doesn't look for his shot.  Saturday vs. the J-Hawkers was a prime example of how he disappears from a game.

[sys]

"Which games did he lose? Without looking, I would give him credit for the Wyoming and aTm wins."

using a slightly simplified analysis, and restricting myself to just the conference stats:

peete shot 95 2 point attempts, making them at a .347 clip.  if we simplfy things slightly to assume that those possessions could have been transfered to other attempts without altering the shooting percentages of the others involved (peete .390 from 3, massey .538 from 2, martin .478 from 2) then we can come up with an idea of how much peete hurt the team by shooting so poorly and so often from inside the arc.

i ignored the effect of free throws, as it becomes a good bit more complicated and would only very slightly alter the results for massey and martin.  the effect would be much more dramatic against peete's own 3 attempts, but still i don't think it is worth the effort to try and include them.

if peete had passed to other players or shot a 3 pt attempt himself rather than shooting a single 2 point attempt, KSU would have scored:

2.83 more points/game if peete had shot all 3s
2.27 more points/game if massey had shot all of peete's 2 point attempts
1.56 more points/game if martin had shot all of peetes's 2 point attempts

without looking at individual games, i think 1.6 to 2.8 more points in each game would have changed the outcome in a few of those games.

[kougar24]

You guys are putting way too much thought into this. He's gone. Let it go.