KSUFans Archives
Sports => Frank Martin's OOD sponsored by the "Angriest Fans in America" => Topic started by: michigancat on March 27, 2006, 07:30:00 AM
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I have been looping the press conference while I work all day, every day. I have to go check out the 2007 recruiting board damn near every hour. When is the last time we landed a top-10 recruit out of highschool? Ever? I mean, for decades we considered a top-100 guy a freaking homerun. Now we are on the top of the list for 4 top-10 guys, and a couple of top 50s...IN THE SAME FUQING CLASS?!?!?!
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Next year could indeed be a special recruiting class. However, I think we need to be careful not to get our expectations to the point where we assume Top 20 kids in every class. Huggins has averaged one Top 100 HS kid per class over the last 9 years, and only had one class even close to what we might see next year with 2 Top 20 kids. He's more adept at getting the Top JUCO players and getting the most out of HS kids probably in the Top 200 or so. I'll be very excited to watch next year's class, but I hope K-State fans don't get too used to it. It is possible he'll be able to recruit more top HS kids b/c he's in a bigger conference than he was with Conf USA, but I think we'll see a similar formula over the long haul to what Huggins did at UC.
I agree Rusty, this is all a bit surreal still. It won't seem real until we see them take the court next year in all likelyhood.
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Heck, I'm excited that McDonald's AA's will just be considering K-State.
I'd be thrilled if Huggins recruits as well as he did at Cincy.
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I agree Rusty. I just think there are some K-State fans that think we're going to be on 2 or 3 Top 100 players each year with Huggins and I don't think that will be the case. I have no doubt he'll be able to recruit here similar to what he did at Cinci and that's what I expect.
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If we can get a couple of these guys in the 07 class, that will be huge.
If he gets a top-100 guy most years, we'll usually have a couple top 100 players on any given team....throw in his JuCO recruits (waaaaay better than what we're accustomed too), and you'll have some pretty salty teams.
...then, throw in the coaching aspect...
:beerchug:
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Next year could indeed be a special recruiting class. However, I think we need to be careful not to get our expectations to the point where we assume Top 20 kids in every class. Huggins has averaged one Top 100 HS kid per class over the last 9 years, and only had one class even close to what we might see next year with 2 Top 20 kids. He's more adept at getting the Top JUCO players and getting the most out of HS kids probably in the Top 200 or so. I'll be very excited to watch next year's class, but I hope K-State fans don't get too used to it. It is possible he'll be able to recruit more top HS kids b/c he's in a bigger conference than he was with Conf USA, but I think we'll see a similar formula over the long haul to what Huggins did at UC.
I agree Rusty, this is all a bit surreal still. It won't seem real until we see them take the court next year in all likelyhood.
One top 100 high school recruit a year???
Abdul Hererra 87th-scout
Eric hicks, Armein Kirkland, and Chadd moore were all top 100 recruits and were in the same class. James white transfered to UC and was a top 10 recruit, but I don't know if you wanna count that since he transfered
Vincent banks was mr. basketball in georgia and was ranked in the top 100.
Roy Bright was ranked in the top 25
Tyree evans was ranked in the top 100 by some
Devan Downy was ranked in the top 40 by most
Dermarr Johnson was a McD. All american and ranked number 1 in his class
Field Williams was Mr. basketball in Texas and Top 100 recruit
Rod Flowers was a top 100 recruit
Steve Logan
Ruben Patterson
and that is mostly only through 2001-2002. Huggins has signed a lot of top talent. I could go on but I'm sick of looking it all up.
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Thanks tmac.
Also, you got beat down, FAN. :)
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I'm basing that information (1 Top 100 player per year) off of the classes from 1998 through 2005. It is based on the site linked below which takes all the major recruiting rankings and compiles them to give a more accurate picture IMO of the Top 100; sort of a "consensus Top 100".
http://home.nc.rr.com/rsci/
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Here's what I got from that:
1998 #51 Eugene Land
1999 NA
2000 #13 Kenny Satterfield, #17 Demarr Johnson
2001 #32 Jason Maxiel
2002 #55 Eric Hicks, #70 Chadd Moore
2003 NA
2004 #32 Roy Bright
2005 #50 Devan Downey, #72 Tyree Evans
That's what I was going off of for my statement. Granted, this doesn't include the many top JUCO players.
I'm not saying Huggins is a bad recruiter by any means, just saying he doesn't bring in McDonald's All-Americans every year, and if we get two Top 10 kids next year, I'm not going to expect that every year b/c that hasn't been the norm at Cinci. Huggins is a great coach and recruiter though, no doubt in my mind.
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Every ranking site is different though. Rivals may have a kid in the top 100 but another might now, I went and checked all of those and found them ranked in one recruiting service, If they were ranked in one I didn't check the others. I have been a long UC fan though, and can guarantee he averages more than 1 top 100 player a year. The ones I listed before are just a few. I am starting to remember more and more as I type, such as Melvin Levitt, and Kenyon Martin were actually ranked in the top 100 before college now that I think of it. If you want, I can find more, but most recruiting sites only keep records to 2002.
And the Juco players that huggs gets are always very highly rated. Not that it even matters because performance on the court is far more important that a ranking. A player could be ranked high in high school but is a total bust in the ncaa because of the much more intense competition. Its nice getting those high profile recruits but they don't always end up being as good as they are supposed to. Satterfield was a prized recruit and I felt once we got him that he was overrated and made a huge mistake in going to the pros early.
I think once he proves that he can make KSU a Tourney team and has a couple good seasons, that he will get better recruits than he did at UC. The university of Cincinnati is not exactly in the best part of the city, and Huggins even said UC's location makes it difficult to recruit. I live in Kansas and have been to manhattan plenty of times. Once he builds the program up he will get just as good of recruits, if not better than he did at UC. KSU is an attractive place, and its size will help keep recruits out of trouble. Cincinnati had too many
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I agree that recruiting rankings are extremely subjective. I like that site b/c it takes rivals, Gibbons, hoopscoop, etc and puts them all together and basically averages them out. We've had several kids the last few years ranked by one service or another, but I usually put a little more stock in a kid that has been ranked by several or all recruiting rankings. No doubt, you'll know much more than I as a Cinci fan, this was in no way meant to discredit Coach Huggins, just saying that his past wasn't loaded with McDonald's All-Americans or 3 or 4 Top 100 kids a year. There is a lot of hype with the possibilities for next year's class, I just don't think K-State fans should get in the habit of expecting that every year, but no doubt we should expect very good classes every year. I agree that recruiting to Manhattan and being part of the Big 12 may aid Coach in recruiting as well. I think Coach Huggins will be great for K-State and that K-State will be great for Coach Huggins. I'm looking forward to the new era.
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Here's what I got from that:
1998 #51 Eugene Land
1999 NA
2000 #13 Kenny Satterfield, #17 Demarr Johnson
2001 #32 Jason Maxiel
2002 #55 Eric Hicks, #70 Chadd Moore
2003 NA
2004 #32 Roy Bright
2005 #50 Devan Downey, #72 Tyree Evans
That's what I was going off of for my statement. Granted, this doesn't include the many top JUCO players.
I'm not saying Huggins is a bad recruiter by any means, just saying he doesn't bring in McDonald's All-Americans every year, and if we get two Top 10 kids next year, I'm not going to expect that every year b/c that hasn't been the norm at Cinci. Huggins is a great coach and recruiter though, no doubt in my mind.
I can't believe I forgot J. Max. Anyways. yeah, I now what your talking about, he hasn't signed a lot of MCdonalds all americans, but that is a very hard thing to do. Although, like i said, I really don't think rankings are not as important and usually do not depict how good a player is going to be at a college level. And UC is a difficult place to recruit to due to it being in a bad part of town. KSU will be a very good team and a big 12 contender because he is a great coach, like you said. Can't wait tilll next season. :beerchug:
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What I got out of that was that Cartier Martin and Dez Willingham were the only top 100 players that Wooldridge ever got. And Dez is now playing for SMU.
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Yeah, they were the only consensus guys. Hart was on there as well, but he came via JUCO and OU. Hayden just missed out on the Top 100 there.
Harris, Stewart, Allen, and Yearby all got on at least one Top 100 list.
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Yeah, they were the only consensus guys. Hart was on there as well, but he came via JUCO and OU. Hayden just missed out on the Top 100 there.
Harris, Stewart, Allen, and Yearby all got on at least one Top 100 list.
Yearby was never on a top 100 list. And please give me a link to Harris/Stewart/Allen on a top 100 list.
Thanks.
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http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/viewrank.asp?SID=910&Year=2004&ra_key=273
Allen was preseason rivals 150 but dropped after his season.
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I'm not seeing top 100. :ku:
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Harris was #90 for Gibbons. Yearby finished in Gibbon's Top 60. Stewart was 106 for hoopscoop, 127 for rivals. Allen was 81 for hoopscoop and 134 for rivals.
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Whoops.
Greg swaim loves Clent. He discovered him or something.
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Believe it or not:
"Deilvez was one of those guys that fell under the radar screen," said acclaimed recruiting analyst Bob Gibbons of the All-Star Report. "He really came on his senior year and proved to be one of the best players in the country. He will be on my final list of the top 60 players in the nation that is due out next month."
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Yearby finished in Gibbon's Top 60.
Ahh yes. The phantom top 60 finish for Yearby :jerkoff:
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Bob Gibbons must be a horrible evaluator of talent.
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Gibbons had George Hill in his Top 100 and Mark Young in his Top 20 and I think even Donnie Wallace in his Top 100, so I tend to agree with you Rusty.
Allen did slip out of those rankings at the end I see. Wasn't sure about that one.
Guys, we all agree on one thing, our recruiting is going to get better and our basketball team is going to get better. I was just saying some of these guys weren't exactly out of nowhere recruits (like Hughes). Under Wooly, we had better than midmajor recruiting, but not good enough to really compete for the upper half of the Big 12, of course if some of those guys had stayed, who knows. Doesn't matter now, we've got one of the top coaches in the Big 12 and the country in Manhattan.
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ur right, it doesn't really matter because the basketball team is going to be a billion times better with huggs. Here are a few some of the recruiting classes that Jarr, from the UC board compiled.
Couldn't go back and see the rankings of the players after 99 but many of them were top 100 players. before 99 too. Not that this list even matters, but oh well.
2005
Evans(top 100)
Downey(top 100)
Herrerra(top 100)
Coleman
Tilford
McGowan
Ronald Allen
2004
Banks(top 100)
Jihad(top 10 JUCO)
Bright(top 100)
2003
Whaley (top 10 JUCO)
Williams(top 10 JUCO)
White (former top 100)
Pilgrim(top 100)
Souleymane
2002
Hicks (top 100)
Moore(top 100)
Kirk(top 100)
Tony Bobbit(top 10 JUCO)
Kareem Johnson
2001
Max (top 100)
Barker(top 10 JUCO)
Hollman
Hubbard
2000
Field(top 100)
IMac(top 10 JUCO)
Jones(top 10 JUCO)
Davis(top 10 JUCO)
Flowers
1999
Demarr (top 100)
Satt(top 100)
Stokes(top 100)
Grove
1998
Mikeal
Logan
Little
Land
Tate
Alvin Mitchell
1997
Horton
Aaron McGhee
Wasnt there some JUCO PF in this class
Myrick
1996
Kenyon Martin
Baker
Patterson
Charles Williams
1995
Fletcher
Levitt
1994
Brannen
Fortson
Long
Legree
1993
Flint
Wingfield
Burton
1992
Rodrick Monroe? Have no idea about this class
Durden
1991
Nelson
Martin
Van Exel
Blount
1990
Buford
Jones
89
Tarrance Gibson
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i agree with the general premise that ksu fans have unrealistic expectations for huggins recruiting (actually, i find myself already annoyed by the generally clueless wabash brandnew bandwagoners. i wonder what that says about me).
but i also think it is reasonable to postulate that huggins can do a better job recruiting at ksu than at ucinn. at ucinn, he basically had just the bball program to sell. and he was doing almost against the wishes of the admin. at ksu, he has a more appealing overall product (assuming the schedule and tv exposure both are dramatically improved), and will have a great deal more admin support.
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At UC's standpoint now. With all the brand new facilities and move to the big east( which Huggins made possible for the program), Huggins would have a much easier time recruiting to UC now than he did before, but that didn't work out so all I can say is what if. I do agree with you though. KSU can be very attractive and I think the football and basketball can finally feed off one anothers success and make K state a very powerful program. But we'll have to see. Can't make big assumptions like that yet, but it does seem very promising.
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tmac,
i agree. pehaps i should have clarified, that i was referencing recruiting to ucinn over his entire span there. i am aware that ucinn made some substantial improvements over his time there. as well as, of course, their recent admission into the big east.
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Thanks for the info tmac. A lot of very good players on that list.
I agree, that compared to his time at Cinci, he might be able to recruit better at K-State. However, with Cinci now in the Big East, I think their recruiting will see a bump as well.
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Sys, you were right on. I think the addition of Huggs and even Mike anderson to Mizzou, even though I hate mizzou, will draw many big time recruits and make the big 12 much more of a threat come tourney time than they have in the past. Kansas and lately Texas have really been the only consistent threat to go far in the tourney each year, but I think much more teams will be getting in than in the past, and the better coaching and players are going to make big 12 teams legit to do some damage in march. Even Iowa States coach from Northern Iowa will do some damage. He is a very good coach. I think you will see some of the lower ranked big 12 teams become threats for the title. Because I honestly haven't been that impressed with Kansas. They will always be a dangerous team and bill self is a hell of a recruiter, but he just doesn't seem to be able to put it all together. I do think he is a very good coach though but not dominant like roy williams. I've also been real disappointed in Oklahoma. I think they've been overrated the past couple years, but I really haven't payed much attention to them to be able to back it up with facts. In conclusion, I think the under the radar teams in the big 12 are going to make pushes to the top.
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Right on, its just gonna be nice to see a basketball team people in Kansas get excited for other than ku, because I have hated ku my entire life! To think I almost decided to go to college there, I had to slap myself a few times for that. I'll be up at KSU next year and can't wait, I've been in the $hit hole of Kansas (Liberal) For the past 3 months finishing up my Associates Degree, and went to Hutchinson CC before that. Can't wait to get out of here!