KSUFans Archives
Sports => Snyder's Electronic Cyber Space World => Topic started by: tmramrod91 on June 03, 2007, 10:27:45 PM
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Considering the posters here are actually rational and dont always see things with purple colored glasses, i pose this question.....
On a scale of 1-10, with 10 being the second coming of Bill Snyder, How much confidence do you have that RP will put KSU football back in its rightful position?
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8-9 we will never have another bill snyder
but we can have our first ron prince and even if he wins a national championship it wont be the same
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What do you mean by rightful postion? If you mean back to being a top 10 team every year then I would say a 3 or a 4. If you mean a top 25 program then I will say around a 7.
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rightful position=consistent top 25 team that flirts with the top 10 on occasion
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I'm on board as a solid 4, ramrod.
Now, should the top talent in KS and otherwise decide to commit to Captain Prince, I reserve the right to bump that up. If Prince does show that he truly is a great recruiter, my estimation will be admittedly low.
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Considering the posters here are actually rational and dont always see things with purple colored glasses
You must have made a wrong turn somewhere.
What do you mean by rightful postion?
The worst program in the country.
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8. I've liked him a lot since the day he was hired and I'm pretty confident he can get us to being a consistent Top 25 team.
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6; but I'm remaining hopeful
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A sure way to gauge your confidence is to picture the scenario of betting your last $10 on their success.... With that in mind, how likely are you to actually make that bet.
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Last time I bet against us I lost a lot of money (Texas game).
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rightful position=consistent top 25 team that flirts with the top 10 on occasion
3, Ron strikes me as a great guy and a great representative of the university but to date I'm underwhelmed by his ability to recruit the athletes he's going to need to compete in the Big XII. By the time RP is finished in Manhattan, it's far more likely the program will look more like the bad old days than the machine Snyder built.
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Snyder sucked some sweaty wiener in his last 4 recruiting efforts as well, hence the decline of our record. Hopefully guys like Sims and Liu will pan out a little better than Travis Triplett and Woowoo Woolridge. Time will tell. It's a little early to make declarations about Prince -- we haven't really seen enough yet to know.
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Snyder sucked some sweaty wiener in his last 4 recruiting efforts as well
If so, he sucked sweaty wiener in all of his recruiting efforts.
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lol
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Is consistent top 25 and occasional top 10 really our rightful place?
I think RP will consistently be between 5-7 and 8-4. I don't think he'll be outside of those records many years, if any.
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Is consistent top 25 and occasional top 10 really our rightful place?
I think RP will consistently be between 5-7 and 8-4. I don't think he'll be outside of those records many years, if any.
It only is if you expect it to be!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thumbsup: :ksu: :thumbsup: :ksu: :thumbsup: :ksu: :thumbsup: :ksu:
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Is consistent top 25 and occasional top 10 really our rightful place?
I think RP will consistently be between 5-7 and 8-4. I don't think he'll be outside of those records many years, if any.
QFT
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I see Prince as a guy who is going to go anywhere between 6-6 and 8-4, maybe a 9-3 year....I see a lot of the years like this past one where we lose a game we probably shouldn't (pick between Baylor and ku) and win one we probably shouldn't (Texas). Because of that he'll be around for a while because fans will consistently think "next year is our year" due to winning that one game we shouldn't have won the previous year. Recruiting will be like it has...pick up one, maybe two studs, probably offer a lot of kids "first" who then proceed to go to another school.
All that said, given Ron's personality and desire to get the KSU name out there, if somehow KSU struck the jack pot for college football coaches twice in a row....it will be an entirely better, more entertaining run than Snyder's run.
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Because of that he'll be around for a while because fans will consistently think "next year is our year" due to winning that one game we shouldn't have won the previous year.
Hopefully KSU fans will have learned their lesson waiting on ol' neck brace to have his breakthrough year.
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Because of that he'll be around for a while because fans will consistently think "next year is our year" due to winning that one game we shouldn't have won the previous year.
Hopefully KSU fans will have learned their lesson waiting on ol' neck brace to have his breakthrough year.
The only difference is that I think Prince will having winning or .500 conference records and go to bowl games (post season). After a while though, it won't be enough, but that will take some time and probably ADTW leaving.
Ron Prince = Gary Gibbs.
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I think bowl games (any) 3 out of 4 years should be plenty for a KSU football coach to keep his job.
And Ron went way beyond anything Wooly did in just one year.
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Wooly always showed us just enough to keep our hopes up. His teams would hammer a top 25 squad then drop 2-3 that they should have won easily. In the end it would become apparent that we just didn't have the athletes we needed to compete. Remind anyone of the '06 football season?
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Right now I will go with a 5, I think he is trying to recruit good/top/elite talent and that was something that Snyder really didn't do in his last few years. If Prince takes us to a BCS game about every 4 or 5 years and a Big 12 Championship game about every 3 I will be really happy.
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Wooly always showed us just enough to keep our hopes up. His teams would hammer a top 25 squad then drop 2-3 that they should have won easily. In the end it would become apparent that we just didn't have the athletes we needed to compete. Remind anyone of the '06 football season?
Which games should KSU have "won easily" last season?
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Wooly always showed us just enough to keep our hopes up. His teams would hammer a top 25 squad then drop 2-3 that they should have won easily. In the end it would become apparent that we just didn't have the athletes we needed to compete. Remind anyone of the '06 football season?
Which games should KSU have "won easily" last season?
For that matter, what top 25 teams did Wooly "hammer"? Texas? but that wasn't a hammering.
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4 - I have seen nothing yet that makes me feel good but seen some that makes me feel bad. So far he looks like a much better coach than Big Game Callahan and some others but recruiting is a concern of mine.
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Wooly always showed us just enough to keep our hopes up. His teams would hammer a top 25 squad then drop 2-3 that they should have won easily. In the end it would become apparent that we just didn't have the athletes we needed to compete. Remind anyone of the '06 football season?
Which games should KSU have "won easily" last season?
For that matter, what top 25 teams did Wooly "hammer"? Texas? but that wasn't a hammering.
Iowa in 2000. MU in 2001. OSU in 2002.
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If Prince takes us to a BCS game about every 4 or 5 years and a Big 12 Championship game about every 3 I will be really happy.
I would take that in a heartbeat.
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Wooly always showed us just enough to keep our hopes up. His teams would hammer a top 25 squad then drop 2-3 that they should have won easily. In the end it would become apparent that we just didn't have the athletes we needed to compete. Remind anyone of the '06 football season?
Which games should KSU have "won easily" last season?
For that matter, what top 25 teams did Wooly "hammer"? Texas? but that wasn't a hammering.
Iowa in 2000. MU in 2001. OSU in 2002.
Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! Very reminiscent of KSU/UT in football last year which was, of course, followed by the ku & bowl fiascos.
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If Prince takes us to a BCS game about every 4 or 5 years and a Big 12 Championship game about every 3 I will be really happy.
I would take that in a heartbeat.
That has a 5% chance of happening.
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After last year about a 5. We beat Texas but that was a bit flukey. This year will realy tell me how good of coach and judge of talent prince is. Competing in the big XII is no easy task. I see prince taking a big jump in playing a tougher non-con scedhule. This will attract some big name recruits who want to play against the big boys. We shall see how it works out. He is bold and daring, but then so is my bar-b-que sauce.
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If Prince takes us to a BCS game about every 4 or 5 years and a Big 12 Championship game about every 3 I will be really happy.
I would take that in a heartbeat.
That has a 5% chance of happening.
SO there IS a Chance!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:ksu: :ksu: :ksu: :ksu: :ksu: :ksu: :ksu: :katpak: :katpak: :katpak: :katpak: :katpak: :katpak: :katpak: :katpak: :katpak:
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Wooly always showed us just enough to keep our hopes up. His teams would hammer a top 25 squad then drop 2-3 that they should have won easily. In the end it would become apparent that we just didn't have the athletes we needed to compete. Remind anyone of the '06 football season?
Which games should KSU have "won easily" last season?
For that matter, what top 25 teams did Wooly "hammer"? Texas? but that wasn't a hammering.
Iowa in 2000. MU in 2001. OSU in 2002.
Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! Very reminiscent of KSU/UT in football last year which was, of course, followed by the ku & bowl fiascos.
st
Not really. Kind of an apples and oranges comparison. Anyone that used those games as justification for keeping Wooly around in years 4, 5, or 6 was a moron (if such a person existed). Those games really didn't say anything about Wooly that his overall records couldn't discredit.
When I'm evaluating Prince's first season, I'm just looking at overall and conference records. 7-5, 4-4 is more than acceptable for a firyear coach coming off back-to-back last place finishes. Looking any deeper into which games were won/lost and the MOV is kind of dumb.
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Wooly always showed us just enough to keep our hopes up. His teams would hammer a top 25 squad then drop 2-3 that they should have won easily. In the end it would become apparent that we just didn't have the athletes we needed to compete. Remind anyone of the '06 football season?
Which games should KSU have "won easily" last season?
For that matter, what top 25 teams did Wooly "hammer"? Texas? but that wasn't a hammering.
Iowa in 2000. MU in 2001. OSU in 2002.
Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! Very reminiscent of KSU/UT in football last year which was, of course, followed by the ku & bowl fiascos.
I completely forgot about those wins, but Wooly never made a post season, never was even .500 in conference, and had an above .500 overall record twice.
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One year = Bowling.
RP =sucks. :rolleyes:
Great thread. :tongue:
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RP+two time last place finishers+young players=bowl team Nice job Coach! Looking forward, with confidence, to more success!
:ksu: :dancin: :ksu: :dancin: :ksu:
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Wooly always showed us just enough to keep our hopes up. His teams would hammer a top 25 squad then drop 2-3 that they should have won easily. In the end it would become apparent that we just didn't have the athletes we needed to compete. Remind anyone of the '06 football season?
Which games should KSU have "won easily" last season?
For that matter, what top 25 teams did Wooly "hammer"? Texas? but that wasn't a hammering.
Iowa in 2000. MU in 2001. OSU in 2002.
Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner! Very reminiscent of KSU/UT in football last year which was, of course, followed by the ku & bowl fiascos.
st
Not really. Kind of an apples and oranges comparison. Anyone that used those games as justification for keeping Wooly around in years 4, 5, or 6 was a moron (if such a person existed). Those games really didn't say anything about Wooly that his overall records couldn't discredit.
When I'm evaluating Prince's first season, I'm just looking at overall and conference records. 7-5, 4-4 is more than acceptable for a firyear coach coming off back-to-back last place finishes. Looking any deeper into which games were won/lost and the MOV is kind of dumb.
I have no complaints about 7-5 / 4-4 in Prince's first year. I have complaints about what is going to happen soon. :flush:
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Recruiting. Last year was awesome. If he was some white coach that looked smart, every one would be saying he was the best "X's and O's" coach in america after what he did last year.
I worry about recruiting. We are not winning recruiting battles.
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If he was some white coach that looked smart, every one would be saying he was the best "X's and O's" coach in america after what he did last year.
Please tell me you're kidding. You believe he's a great Xs and Os coach? Really? Enlighten me.
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If he was some white coach that looked smart, every one would be saying he was the best "X's and O's" coach in america after what he did last year.
Please tell me you're kidding. You believe he's a great Xs and Os coach? Really? Enlighten me.
I don't mean to speak for fatty, but I think he's referring to the well known "fact" that all white head coaches are smart and all black head coaches are good recruiters.
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Taking a crap 2-6 big 12 team (that lost by 28 points to Iowa State, 39 to Texas Tech, and 23 to Oklahoma) and BARELY beat ku and Mizzou, and bringing us back to 4-4 beating two southern division opponents (which KSU had not done since 2002) and defeating a top 5 team at home for the FIRST TIME EVER.
If Prince goes .500 in big 12 play the rest of his career, I'll be happy.
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Zacker nailed it.
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People are quicker to jump on a white coach's bandwagon.
Ex: IIRC, people thought John L. Smith was the crap after his 8-5 season at Michigan State.
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If Venables had the year Prince just had........ :love: :love:
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Prince has a very Wooly feel to me right now. I'm guessing 8 wins in a season is the best we will ever see from Prince and company. My confidence in Prince getting us to any sort of consistent national success is about a 3 right now.
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Prince has a very Wooly feel to me right now. I'm guessing 8 wins in a season is the best we will ever see from Prince and company.
That's hilarious considering his first season brought 7 wins.
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If Prince goes .500 in big 12 play the rest of his career, I'll be happy.
If that is the expectation for Prince then I hope his career is about 3 years long.
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Zacker nailed it.
OK. I was hoping that's what you meant.
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I have 110% confidence in Prince.
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If Venables had the year Prince just had........ :love: :love:
Ron Prince would get fired with Mike Stoops' three year record.
Prince has a very Wooly feel to me right now. I'm guessing 8 wins in a season is the best we will ever see from Prince and company. My confidence in Prince getting us to any sort of consistent national success is about a 3 right now.
If 6 wins was the best we'd see from Prince, then he'd be Wooly like.
I agree w/ fatty on the .500 in conference play. That means you're competitive and going to bowl games year in and year out.
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If Prince goes .500 in big 12 play the rest of his career, I'll be happy.
If that is the expectation for Prince then I hope his career is about 3 years long.
Okay, let me take that back. He has Mike Leach success I'll be content.
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OT: But does anyone else find it kind of LOL, that last year was our 2002 schedule, and the two teams we lost to in 2002, we beat in 2006. LOL, if someone had told you in 2002 that 4 years later we would lose to Baylor and ku, you would have said..."Get out of here! LOL!"
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I agree with others that a lot of people are looking too much into who we beat this game and lost to in another game. You should only look at the full body of work of 7-6 4-4 and a bowl game and not try and over analyze every game. The record is good considering where we were at and I think that is what he should be judged on.
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Prince always harps on building depth up and down the roster, and when you look at WR last season, it was pretty pathetic. Jordy kept having to come out and play hurt, especially once Moreira fractured that vertebra. It wasn't like we had some hotshot or even warmshot redshirt freshman or soph. WR ready to roll out and get minutes. We had NO ONE. Just walkon Gonzo. Then once Figurs went out (thanks to dumb&*$@! play by McKinney), it was time for other teams to just man up on WRs and bring up both safeties, then send the cavalry on every play because we had no one who could get open. Wilson, Purvis, and Brown were not ready.
It's amazing how a lack of quality depth at one position can shut down everything you try to do. Even if we had a decent OL, they couldn't have blocked everyone ku and Rutgers were sending.
Lack of experience at WR is another reason I'm not terribly optimistic going in to next season. :ohno:
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Such low standards. No one wants to consistently compete for championships?
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I agree with others that a lot of people are looking too much into who we beat this game and lost to in another game. You should only look at the full body of work of 7-6 4-4 and a bowl game and not try and over analyze every game. The record is good considering where we were at and I think that is what he should be judged on.
Actually you should look at the full body of work and consider not only the W/L record but how the team played in those games. The team, particularly on defense and particularly in the last half of the season, really played very poorly. I really didn't like what I saw happening on the field and my thoughts about Prince's likely success going forward are based almost entirely on that.
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Lack of experience at WR is another reason I'm not terribly optimistic going in to next season. :ohno:
Experience is not nearly as important as the bodies you have. We had no one last year beyond Nelson, Figurs, and Moriera and all 3 were hurt at times (as you mentioned).
But we will be trotting out some serious horses at the WR position this year.
If all we had this year was Lamark, Hogan, Pierce, and Murphy, I would take that over what we went through last year.
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I agree its important to look at the whole picture when evaluating RP. If at the beginning the season you woulda said ksu will go .500 in conference and go to a bowl game 90% of us woulda taken that in a heartbeat. He beat OSU (a very good team in a brutal division) and UT (national power). But, its hard not to have your confidence shaken when your team gets blown out by Baylor and ku (and every other loss).
He was a first year coach and I fully expected him to get outcoached more than a handful of times. I think the next 2 yrs should tell us all we need to know about RP. My guess is he'll win some games he's not supposed to and lose some he's supposed to win.
And....I agree with others, biggest concern is the recruiting front at this point in time.
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I agree with others that a lot of people are looking too much into who we beat this game and lost to in another game. You should only look at the full body of work of 7-6 4-4 and a bowl game and not try and over analyze every game. The record is good considering where we were at and I think that is what he should be judged on.
Actually you should look at the full body of work and consider not only the W/L record but how the team played in those games. The team, particularly on defense and particularly in the last half of the season, really played very poorly. I really didn't like what I saw happening on the field and my thoughts about Prince's likely success going forward are based almost entirely on that.
By last half of the season, I'm assuming you mean the last two games. That is hardly half the season. ku was a terribly coached game injuries or not. This was the only game that really raised any red flags. Rutgers was way too good for us and a terrible match-up at the same time. That was all there was to it. We didn't stand a chance, IMO, unless we could have played it at home. But again, the 7-6 4-4 in year one with what he inherited was very good I think. I would probably be more analytical into each and every game as his tenure progresses and he gets his guys in that really want to play in his system.
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I agree with others that a lot of people are looking too much into who we beat this game and lost to in another game. You should only look at the full body of work of 7-6 4-4 and a bowl game and not try and over analyze every game. The record is good considering where we were at and I think that is what he should be judged on.
Actually you should look at the full body of work and consider not only the W/L record but how the team played in those games. The team, particularly on defense and particularly in the last half of the season, really played very poorly. I really didn't like what I saw happening on the field and my thoughts about Prince's likely success going forward are based almost entirely on that.
By last half of the season, I'm assuming you mean the last two games. That is hardly half the season. ku was a terribly coached game injuries or not. This was the only game that really raised any red flags. Rutgers was way too good for us and a terrible match-up at the same time. That was all there was to it. We didn't stand a chance, IMO, unless we could have played it at home. But again, the 7-6 4-4 in year one with what he inherited was very good I think. I would probably be more analytical into each and every game as his tenure progresses and he gets his guys in that really want to play in his system.
IMO the d was bad after the louiseville game but we're changing systems so it should be better now
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I agree with others that a lot of people are looking too much into who we beat this game and lost to in another game. You should only look at the full body of work of 7-6 4-4 and a bowl game and not try and over analyze every game. The record is good considering where we were at and I think that is what he should be judged on.
Actually you should look at the full body of work and consider not only the W/L record but how the team played in those games. The team, particularly on defense and particularly in the last half of the season, really played very poorly. I really didn't like what I saw happening on the field and my thoughts about Prince's likely success going forward are based almost entirely on that.
By last half of the season, I'm assuming you mean the last two games. That is hardly half the season. ku was a terribly coached game injuries or not. This was the only game that really raised any red flags. Rutgers was way too good for us and a terrible match-up at the same time. That was all there was to it. We didn't stand a chance, IMO, unless we could have played it at home. But again, the 7-6 4-4 in year one with what he inherited was very good I think. I would probably be more analytical into each and every game as his tenure progresses and he gets his guys in that really want to play in his system.
IMO the d was bad after the louiseville game but we're changing systems so it should be better now
Agreed. The offense was spotty but the defense fell apart early in the season and never really recovered. I'm not sure how much of that was coaching, how much talent (or lack thereof), how much injuries, etc. I was on the Tibesar bandwagon very early so I do expect some improvement this year but I don't think we're recruiting at a level that will allow the program to move beyond mediocrity.
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If Prince goes .500 in big 12 play the rest of his career, I'll be happy.
If that is the expectation for Prince then I hope his career is about 3 years long.
Okay, let me take that back. He has Mike Leach success I'll be content.
are you allowing compensation for Leach b/c hes in a tougher division? b/c if we never go to a big 12 championship game again i will not be content.
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If Prince goes .500 in big 12 play the rest of his career, I'll be happy.
If that is the expectation for Prince then I hope his career is about 3 years long.
Okay, let me take that back. He has Mike Leach success I'll be content.
are you allowing compensation for Leach b/c hes in a tougher division? b/c if we never go to a big 12 championship game again i will not be content.
Prepare to not be content (w/ any coach) for a long f'ing time.
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If Prince goes .500 in big 12 play the rest of his career, I'll be happy.
If that is the expectation for Prince then I hope his career is about 3 years long.
Okay, let me take that back. He has Mike Leach success I'll be content.
are you allowing compensation for Leach b/c hes in a tougher division? b/c if we never go to a big 12 championship game again i will not be content.
Prepare to not be content (w/ any coach) for a long f'ing time.
SSP.
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Mike Leach is 31-25 in big 12 play, has won a holliday bowl, been to a cotton bowl, beaten OU and Texas during his tenure and pretty much dominates TT's main rivals aTm.
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Mike Leach is 31-25 in big 12 play, has won a holliday bowl, been to a cotton bowl, beaten OU and Texas during his tenure and pretty much dominates TT's main rivals aTm.
Plus he's bat crap crazy.
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Under Snyder...since 1996 (10 years)...during a very successful run (even from at national level) KSU only went to 3 big 12 title games, winning one. Why the expectation that Prince should be going to a Big 12 title game half the time is beyond me.
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Under Snyder...since 1996 (10 years)...during a very successful run (even from at national level) KSU only went to 3 big 12 title games, winning one. Why the expectation that Prince should be going to a Big 12 title game half the time is beyond me.
Good points, but if Snyder had those teams in today's north, he'd be there almost every year.
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Under Snyder...since 1996 (10 years)...during a very successful run (even from at national level) KSU only went to 3 big 12 title games, winning one. Why the expectation that Prince should be going to a Big 12 title game half the time is beyond me.
Good points, but if Snyder had those teams in today's north, he'd be there almost every year.
If any team during that time had the team they had then, now, they'd win the north. Seneca Wallace would've lead ISU to b2b title games. I guess the North is so equally retarded now that every team could "expect" to get to the title game, but at some point, the North will have to be a competent, tough division.
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I agree with others that a lot of people are looking too much into who we beat this game and lost to in another game. You should only look at the full body of work of 7-6 4-4 and a bowl game and not try and over analyze every game. The record is good considering where we were at and I think that is what he should be judged on.
Actually you should look at the full body of work and consider not only the W/L record but how the team played in those games. The team, particularly on defense and particularly in the last half of the season, really played very poorly. I really didn't like what I saw happening on the field and my thoughts about Prince's likely success going forward are based almost entirely on that.
By last half of the season, I'm assuming you mean the last two games. That is hardly half the season. ku was a terribly coached game injuries or not. This was the only game that really raised any red flags. Rutgers was way too good for us and a terrible match-up at the same time. That was all there was to it. We didn't stand a chance, IMO, unless we could have played it at home. But again, the 7-6 4-4 in year one with what he inherited was very good I think. I would probably be more analytical into each and every game as his tenure progresses and he gets his guys in that really want to play in his system.
IMO the d was bad after the louiseville game but we're changing systems so it should be better now
Agreed. The offense was spotty but the defense fell apart early in the season and never really recovered. I'm not sure how much of that was coaching, how much talent (or lack thereof), how much injuries, etc. I was on the Tibesar bandwagon very early so I do expect some improvement this year but I don't think we're recruiting at a level that will allow the program to move beyond mediocrity.
I don't think it was so much the defense that was bad as it was the offense in a lot of these games.
Baylor - they scored 17 points and it was the stagnant offense that lost the game. A lot of offensive players got fired from their starting roles. We were a team in complete transition half way through it.
Okla St. - defense was pretty good considering OSUs offensive weapons, especially late when it counted. 24 pts
Nebraska - we held Nebraska to 21 points and they didn't have much success throwing the ball. Offense was completely out manned up front that caused the lopsided loss.
Missouri - not very good defense but it was multiple offensive turnovers to start the second half that led to 3? easy gimme scores on way to give up 41 pts.
Iowa St. - 10 pts, solid defense
Colorado - defense did well for the entire game except for a lapse in the 2nd half. 21 pts, not too bad on the road
Texas - defense did good outside the first drive of the game(Colt wasn't even in). Again, Texas received 2 breakdowns from the special teams and a Freeman INT to set up 3? very short scoring drives. 42 pts
Kansas - awful defense, awful offense 39? pts
Rutgers - awfule defense, awful offense 35 pts
What I see is a terrible offense way more than a terrible defense. It mostly comes back to a poor Oline and poor QB decision making. What really stood out on defense was people flying toward the ball and creating a lot of turnovers, something we never saw a lick of in 04 and 05. The point totals are a little higher than what you would like but Prince inherited no lynch mob. I'm not trying to paint a picture that the defense was awesome, because they have a long way to go(rush defense), but we were better defensively than you are giving them credit for. If you really analyze it, it was almost always on the offense in our losses.
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Bullfn, Best analysis I have seen yet. I agree that while the defense was not a national caliber great statistal power, we did limit scoring in most games. Thos games that the offense 1) showed up and 2) didn't shoot itself in the foot with turnovers are the one we won. I for one expect a big change on offense. mainly due to better reads by the QB. We really didn't have a good QB for most of last year with the exception of two games (Sorry Josh).
Defensively, ..Man I don't know. New scheme, new coordinator, new players. Play two games and get back to me.
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Under Snyder...since 1996 (10 years)...during a very successful run (even from at national level) KSU only went to 3 big 12 title games, winning one. Why the expectation that Prince should be going to a Big 12 title game half the time is beyond me.
i dont expect to go to the title game all the time but fatty said he'd be satisfied with leach who has never been. id like to go again sometime and in the north i dont see why thats not possible. also the north was much tougher when snyder was around. if we had the teams now that snyder had back then we'd be in the title game pretty much every year.
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Defensively last year:
Secondary: Solid
DL: Suckage
LB: Suckage (most of the time)
Offensively...who knew what team was gonna show up. It was no Ron Hudson led offense I know that.
This year Secondary will be top 3-4 in the big 12. As for stopping the run, that could get interesting. I'm willing to give Tisebar some time though. Thank God Brandon Cox is a little girl and we can put 8 guys in the box to stop the run.
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I have 110% confidence in Prince.
Then shouldn't your answer be 11? :poundon:
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OSU - Gave up touchdown drives of 64 and 80 yards, plus a FG drive of 60 yards.
NU - Gave up touchdown drives of 80, 80 and 72 yards.
MU - Gave up touchdown drives of 99, 87, 52 and 62 yards, plus a FG drive of 78 yards.
ISU - Gave up a touchdown drive of 74 yards.
CU - Gave up touchdown drives of 64, 80 and 67 yards.
Texas - Gave up touchdown drives of 80, 75 and 84 yards, and a 1 play 33 yard drive.
ku - Only one long scoring drive, a FG drive of 50 yards. This performance is fully on the crap offense.
Rutgers - Gave up touchdown drives 79 and 68 yards, plus a FG drive of 44 yards.
After September, our defense gave up at least 3 very long scoring drives in every game, except ku. The offense committed plenty of turnovers, setting up short fields, but the defense was putting us 20+ points in the hole from long drives.
And that doesn't include all the sustained non-scoring drives that significantly altered field position to the benefit of the other team.
If you really want to get sick, look at the number of 30+ yard plays that defense gave up.
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I agree that while the defense was not a national caliber great statistal power, we did limit scoring in most games.
Not exactly, we were barely average in scoring defense last year. For the record here are last year's defensive rankings:
Rushing Defense #78
Passing Defense #53
Total Defense #70
Scoring Defense #66
Pass Eff. Def. #59
Sacks #6
Tackles for Loss #18
3rd Down Eff. Def. #50
4th Down Eff. Def. #99
Mediocre against the pass, mediocre against the run, mediocre in holding the other team's scoring down, fair to poor at making plays when we need them. See a trend there?
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Other things to keep in mind also is how long was our defense on the field during each game, number of snaps they were on the field for etc. If an offense is really bad, even a good defense can get worn down and start giving up drives they otherwise might not. I don't know the stats but I'll bet it isn't pretty. Our offense usually went three and out or moved the ball quick and scored. I've always thought that an offense's goal should be to score and take as much time as they possibly can to do it. Then you have an efficient football team while making the other team less efficient. This also takes their offense out of rhythm while keeps your offense in rhythm. I think this is why a good ground game is important to be successful. That's also why Mike Leach will never win the Big 12. His offensive philosophy puts to much strain on their not so great defense. JMO
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I'd say I've got a confidence factor of about 6 for Prince -- I expect about 6-7 wins / season from him (but hope for 8-9).
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2...he is the biggest piece of sh*t i have ever met, the reason he is good :loly: at recruiting is because he is a liar and tells people what they want to hear. once they buy in he goes back to what he wants and being an as*h*le.
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2...he is the biggest piece of sh*t i have ever met, the reason he is good :loly: at recruiting is because he is a liar and tells people what they want to hear. once they buy in he goes back to what he wants and being an as*h*le.
Dude, you need to post more.
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yah it sure is...but i do have some good stories that i am going to bust loose in a while about the state of KSUFB, in my opinion
I can't wait!
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yah it sure is...but i do have some good stories that i am going to bust loose in a while about the state of KSUFB, in my opinion
I can't wait!
I saw the same thing. This guy knows the scoop.
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Which disgruntled player is powerof10?
Evridge!
Sup Allan!
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T-Gunn is another possibility.
I'm willing to bet that coach is a "liar" to players that suck.
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I'm willing to bet that coach is a "liar" to players that suck.
You clearly don't have a dog in this fight.
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Michael Vick, on the other hand, does.
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Mexico? Is that you? :loly:
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Positives:
Beat Texas (major win on ABC)
Got bid to bowl (extra practice)
Negatives:
Lost to all 3 of our rivals (none of the games were close)
Offensive philosophy (swing pass, no consistent run game) will not likely produce big results in the North
Exercised less than good people/P.R. skills in chasing off Evridge, Shorty, Robert and others closely associated with KSU FB
Frankly, the guy who follows a legend will rarely be the long term answer. My money (if I had any) would be on Prince ending up as an NFL assistant in 3 years after Freeman uses up his eligibility.
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Prince takes a program, headed in the wrong direction, and goes bowling. A group of freshman are thrown into the fire and produce good results. That was a good year! IMHO the negativity stems from the loss in Larryville and the decision by AE to leave. AE won't leave this year :D and the sqwaks will be defeathered at BSFS! :ksu: All will be right with the world. Especially after we win the North! :ksu:
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I can tell you this is not a former player. Thats as far as i will reveal my identity.
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Other things to keep in mind also is how long was our defense on the field during each game, number of snaps they were on the field for etc. If an offense is really bad, even a good defense can get worn down and start giving up drives they otherwise might not. I don't know the stats but I'll bet it isn't pretty. Our offense usually went three and out or moved the ball quick and scored. I've always thought that an offense's goal should be to score and take as much time as they possibly can to do it. Then you have an efficient football team while making the other team less efficient. This also takes their offense out of rhythm while keeps your offense in rhythm. I think this is why a good ground game is important to be successful. That's also why Mike Leach will never win the Big 12. His offensive philosophy puts to much strain on their not so great defense. JMO
I understand the theory you're putting out there, but the scoring drives I listed are split pretty evenly between first and second halves. Also, when you let teams consistently go on long drives, the defense plays a direct role in swinging the time of possession to the opponent.
No amount of trashing the offense can get around the fact that the defense straight sucked after September. New scheme, new coaches, lots of new players, it wasn't a surprise. The surprise was how well they played in some of the earlier games.
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As a defensive coach and former defensive player, I never will blame the offense for the defense being on the field too long. The only reason the defense is on the field is that they didn't get a stop on 3rd down. That , my friend, is never the fault of the offense!
Offensively, there are things that must be fixed and I think they will be fixed. Anyone who can look at last year and conclude we are not headed in the right direction, doesn't know football. When you consider how young the team was and all the internal BS they overcame, you'd think we'd have more believers in the fan base.
Yes we stunk things up against baylor and our rivals. But we beat OSU who was favored. We beat Colorado who was favored and a rode game. We beat ISU and they were favored. And yes we beat Texas, who was second in the conference to OU. Oh and did I mention, we were picked to finish last in the north.
I guess overcoming all that can be construed as negative, if you are from Lawrence or Lincoln. But if you're cat fan who wants to dump on your own team, check your motives.
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Other things to keep in mind also is how long was our defense on the field during each game, number of snaps they were on the field for etc. If an offense is really bad, even a good defense can get worn down and start giving up drives they otherwise might not. I don't know the stats but I'll bet it isn't pretty. Our offense usually went three and out or moved the ball quick and scored. I've always thought that an offense's goal should be to score and take as much time as they possibly can to do it. Then you have an efficient football team while making the other team less efficient. This also takes their offense out of rhythm while keeps your offense in rhythm. I think this is why a good ground game is important to be successful. That's also why Mike Leach will never win the Big 12. His offensive philosophy puts to much strain on their not so great defense. JMO
I understand the theory you're putting out there, but the scoring drives I listed are split pretty evenly between first and second halves. Also, when you let teams consistently go on long drives, the defense plays a direct role in swinging the time of possession to the opponent.
No amount of trashing the offense can get around the fact that the defense straight sucked after September. New scheme, new coaches, lots of new players, it wasn't a surprise. The surprise was how well they played in some of the earlier games.
I still think that generally the offense was far worse than the defense last season and they were more responsible for the losses we had.
Not subtracting ST or defensive points these were our scoring totals:
24 vs Illinois State(2? ST TDs)*
45 vs FAU(1? ST TD)
23 vs Marshall(1? ST TD)
6 vs Louisville
3 vs Baylor
31 vs OK State(2 ST TDs)*
3 vs Nebraska
21 vs Missouri(Def. TD + garbage time TD)
31 vs Iowa St.(1 Def. TD)
35 vs Colorado
45 vs Texas(wow)
20 vs Kansas(1 ST TD)
10 vs Rutgers(1 ST TD)
*Thank god for our ST!
The offense generated only 16 or more points in 6 of 13 games. The defense wasn't great but come on, the offense was worse and was the main cause of most of the losses. UL,BU,NU,MU,ku,RUT could all be looked upon the offense for either not scoring(UL,BU,NU), not moving the ball at all(RUT) or turning it over way too many times(MU,ku).