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Messages - HeinBallz

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1
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Another school shooting
« on: April 03, 2013, 03:38:18 PM »
Would meth exist if pot, DMT or other drugs had been legal?  Bath salts? 

What will the black market provide if tighter regulations are enforced on something, which happens to be a very low percentage of the things that do harm.

2
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 03:10:24 PM »
I don't believe in God as a designer.  If he/she were a designer, the human body would have been developed in a much more efficient manner.  Why do we need an appendix?  Why is the eye such an inefficient means of viewing the world around us?  Why do our systems fail?  Why do cells mutate and cause cancer?

I do have answers for these, but they're personal beliefs that I won't post for fear (legitimate or not) of being mocked. I am getting the feeling that we just need to have a late night turntable session soon so we can discuss this in a more personal setting.

I won't mock you, bro.

I know you won't. It's others that I'm worried about.

Why would you worry?  People can mock if they want to; won't change anything unless you let it.  Embrace your vulnerability.

Ftr, I personally would never initiate any mocking. Nor would I partake.

3
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 12:06:03 PM »
There's no reason to be a dick. Especially when you can't even comprehend my post.  I won't accuse you of being so intellectually insecure that you need to belittle and lash out of people...  But if the shoe fits.

Anyway, How do you explain empathy?  Do I have empathy only because if I don't, I might be condemned to a fiery eternity in hell by some authoritative figure?  Do you have a conscious?  Do you think it's exclusive to Christians?

1. It's the nature of goEMAW to be a dick during arguments. It's in jest.
2. It's funny because in general (not as much in this thread, but definitely earlier in this thread) it's pretty common to make fun of deists. I thought it'd be funny to go the opposite way. I have been refraining this entire time, but figured when you didn't seem to comprehend my post that it would be a good time to break it out.
3. I believe if we are made in God's image, it would be human nature to have empathy for others. I do not believe it is exclusive to Christians, or even deists, as I had plenty of empathy for others when I was an atheist and have lots of atheist friends who are great people and care about the well being of others.
1. I'm aware of the atmosphere within goEMAW. But your timing made you appear small and insecure.  Do what you want; but my response was not a defensive act, more of a friend placing a hand on your shoulder letting you know everyone could see your balls hanging out.

2. I don't think you understand what rusty was suggesting if you couldn't accept my response.  And who said I was an atheist?

3.  I can accept being made in gods image.  But I have an extremely different perspective on what god is. 

4
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 11:28:37 AM »
So you're saying it's human nature to have morals?

I think most morals could be explained as ways the species tries to advance.

I've read some people trying to make a case for that. They were pretty bad explanations. Do you have anything you've read you could link or care to explain this stance any further?

Homosexuality.  Considered immoral by most religions. In nature however, sometimes essential. Some amphibians physically change gender in times of low population and will engage in same sex relationships in times of high populations. 

What in the world are you talking about? I'm asking why people in all societies, even atheists, consider some certain things to be immoral. Things like lying and stealing are all considered bad. I haven't heard a good reason why this would be the case if there wasn't a God. My question was does michigancat (or you, if you can grasp the concept of this post) have an explanation for why people want to be good/fair to others even when it doesn't benefit themselves.


There's no reason to be a dick. Especially when you can't even comprehend my post.  I won't accuse you of being so intellectually insecure that you need to belittle and lash out of people...  But if the shoe fits.

Anyway, How do you explain empathy?  Do I have empathy only because if I don't, I might be condemned to a fiery eternity in hell by some authoritative figure?  Do you have a conscious?  Do you think it's exclusive to Christians?


5
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 11:15:16 AM »
So you're saying it's human nature to have morals?

I think most morals could be explained as ways the species tries to advance.

I've read some people trying to make a case for that. They were pretty bad explanations. Do you have anything you've read you could link or care to explain this stance any further?

Homosexuality.  Considered immoral by most religions. In nature however, sometimes essential. Some amphibians physically change gender in times of low population and will engage in same sex relationships in times of high populations.


... Almost as if it were by intelligent design.

6
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 11:12:01 AM »
So you're saying it's human nature to have morals?

I think most morals could be explained as ways the species tries to advance.

I think rusty and I are on the same page here.  He's just better at summarizing my long convoluted thoughts into a succinct single sentence.

7
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 11:10:01 AM »
So you're saying it's human nature to have morals?

It's within all nature - it's the natural balance of things.  There will be times of immorality within society, but like a free market; these are self correcting.

I should clarified, I believe they're self balancing without the external manipulator of some authoritative figure threatening violence or punishment.

8
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 11:00:03 AM »
I think it's interesting what people perceive as bad or evil - especially by those that believe in an afterlife.  Why is death so bad?

9
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 10:51:30 AM »
So you're saying it's human nature to have morals?

It's within all nature - it's the natural balance of things.  There will be times of immorality within society, but like a free market; these are self correcting.

10
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Another school shooting
« on: April 03, 2013, 10:15:46 AM »
  tons of easy and inconspicuous activities are illegal.

And how's that working out?

11
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Another school shooting
« on: April 03, 2013, 10:14:30 AM »
Who the eff is effortlessly molding lead in their basement?

I can give you the names of three different rednecks in butler county alone that have been making their own fishing lures for years.  Making a mold and melting a metal with a super low melting point isn't rocket science.

fishing lures seem slightly different than bullets.

And your point is?  This solution being argued would affect nearly every gun owner but could only hope to impact an extremely small percentage of psychopaths.  By definition, a psychopath is capable/willing/motivated and usually intelligent enough to do something "mildly inconvenient" or even something "really really hard" to accomplish something.

I know, I know.  [bleeding heart] we have to do something! [bleeding heart]

Sometimes stopping insanity is something. Much of the gun legislation already on the books - as well as the newly proposed legislation - qualifies for insanity.

12
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 09:56:58 AM »
since this is now a fun muffin Q&A, i've always wondered why jesus had to die "for our sins".  if god is all powerful, can't he just be like "bros, you guys are cleaned of sin now" and skip killing his son that is also himself?

eagerly awaiting the answer, it's something i've been stuck on for a while.

Sin is like an insurmountable debt that must be paid.  Jesus did not commit any sin, therefore He is eligible to bear our sin in our place.

Sin like any other debt must be paid i.e. punished, otherwise God would not be just. If he just handed out forgiveness and everyone was clean, without the penalty being paid- justice would not be carried out. In the old testament, the system of atoning for sin is that sin would be transferred into an animal (goat or lamb). And then it would be sacrificed. but this process had to be done continuously. The priest would have to atone for the sins of the people in this way over and over.
 
Jesus, the 'Lamb' of God, was the ultimate sacrifice for sin.  He absorbed sin, into himself and laid his life down as the perfect atoning sacrifice. because he is God, this sacrifice was good enough to be perfect and absorb the punishment for sin, fully, finally and forever.  And then in Jesus's resurrection the victory over sin was/is completed.

Not trolling - serious question.  Do you feel obligated to convert someone or preach to or anything like that if a person, such as myself, doesn't believe in hell or sin, but still sees value in the bible from a historical perspective.  And really only sees "sin" as something that really doesn't bring fulfillment to your life - therefore it's a waste of time. 

I mean, I would imagine in your eyes, I'm guilty of the sin of not worshipping and maybe occasionally lustful or prideful - but for the most part, my moral compass would not interfere with anything or anyone within society including yourself. 


13
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 03, 2013, 09:26:02 AM »
Got some time to kill?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guXirzknYYE&feature=player_detailpage#t=523s

I saw this several years ago.  Although I enjoyed it; It irritated the crap out of me with the Horus / Jesus assertions it made.  Only because I know Horus was a god that spanned several dynasties and had several different stories depending on what dynasty you were referring to.  There were several different accounts as to who his mother/brother/children were.  Even completely different names used to refer to Horus. Sure, point out the similarities between Jesus and all other gods...  But don't say Jesus is exactly the same story of an Egyptian god that has very little information/stories that don't completely contradict themselves from others bits of info.

14
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 02, 2013, 07:15:53 PM »
I don't know how to ask this without sounding condescending, but I'd honestly like to ask how atheists think the universe was created.

I don't think humans will ever find the answer to this question with definite proof. Science's best hypothesis is that it was created from 1 small point and has been expanding for the last 13+ billion years and will continue to do so. Now what was the cause of this action? I have no clue, a god like being is definitely a possibility, not likely in my opinion but a possibility none the less.

But as SD asked... if god did it, who created god?


I don't know how to ask this without sounding condescending, but I'd honestly like to ask how atheists think the universe was created.

I'd ask religious types how God was created

If God exists I doubt he is bound by space and time like the universe is.

Like I said earlier - the convictions of your average creationist are no more or less well founded than that of an atheist. 

When it comes down to it; the argument is "you can't prove it so" vs. "you can't prove it isn't so".   So I'll maintain my perspective of it being a ridiculous question that serves no other purpose other than dividing people. 

15
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 02, 2013, 06:05:57 PM »
I don't know how to ask this without sounding condescending, but I'd honestly like to ask how atheists think the universe was created.

I don't think humans will ever find the answer to this question with definite proof. Science's best hypothesis is that it was created from 1 small point and has been expanding for the last 13+ billion years and will continue to do so. Now what was the cause of this action? I have no clue, a god like being is definitely a possibility, not likely in my opinion but a possibility none the less.

But as SD asked... if god did it, who created god?

16
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 02, 2013, 06:05:04 PM »
I don't know how to ask this without sounding condescending, but I'd honestly like to ask how atheists think the universe was created.

Not that I identify as an atheist, but of the speakers I've heard and blogs I've read, the general consensus is the Big Bang was caused by something science has not yet explained, however - they believe it was not caused by a god or intelligent creator.

The scientific community will never offer the conclusion of 'god did it.'

Not because god didn't do it.

But because in science, that can't be a legitimate explainable answer. They'll seek a 'natural', reductive materialistic answer and believe that over a God answer even if their own is more exotic.

Hence the ATHEISM. 

17
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 02, 2013, 06:02:58 PM »
Again - how does the existence of free will prove or disprove god?  Please explain this to me.

It doesn't

Thought so....   Guess people can stop talking about it then, right?

18
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 02, 2013, 05:27:59 PM »
Again - how does the existence of free will prove or disprove god?  Please explain this to me.

19
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Another school shooting
« on: April 02, 2013, 05:13:00 PM »
Who the eff is effortlessly molding lead in their basement?

I can give you the names of three different rednecks in butler county alone that have been making their own fishing lures for years.  Making a mold and melting a metal with a super low melting point isn't rocket science.

20
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 02, 2013, 05:08:59 PM »
Really no different of any argument I've heard arguing that it was an intelligent creator.  Atheist have just as much conviction in their belief structure as most creationists.

21
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 02, 2013, 05:07:00 PM »
I don't know how to ask this without sounding condescending, but I'd honestly like to ask how atheists think the universe was created.

Not that I identify as an atheist, but of the speakers I've heard and blogs I've read, the general consensus is the Big Bang was caused by something science has not yet explained, however - they believe it was not caused by a god or intelligent creator. 

22
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Another school shooting
« on: April 02, 2013, 08:08:25 AM »
So are killing sprees.

23
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Another school shooting
« on: April 02, 2013, 12:35:47 AM »
I think the point everyone is missing with the rubber bullets, is it would take very little effort to replace the rubber with lead you molded yourself.  There is no reason to mix your own gun powder.


24
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 01, 2013, 09:29:28 PM »
So... I'm confused.  Is free will arguing for a God, or against?

 And a serious question I posed earlier; how do you define god?  A mystic intelligent creator as described in the Bible that created you specifically and knew you personally before you were born? 

  Or a power we cannot comprehend that did nothing more than ignite a Big Bang sending the waves of energy that could only, by sheer statistical reason, create some form of life through the infinite possibilities from the infinite amounts of matter, possibly on the level of spitting in a Petri dish?  And all existence of a soul could be attributed simply to basic laws of conservation of energy... 

25
The New Joe Montgomery Birther Pit / Does God Exist?
« on: April 01, 2013, 07:10:11 PM »
Devils advocate:  how do the local Christians feel about the arguments that early Christianity was sun worshipping and a lot of the stories about Jesus can be tied to astrological events.  These same events also being the basis for why so many other gods/saviors were: "being born to a virgin on December 25th" or "their birth being accompanied by a star in the east that lead three kings to the place of birth"  "significance of having 12 apostles" or a "resurrection shortly after spring equinox after being dead for 3 days" etc etc?

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