So, no one on our

[CHONGS]

If they needed 50 yds for a first down, our defense would have  managed a way to give them 51.

[wetwillie]

If they needed 50 yds for a first down, our defense would have  managed a way to give them 51.

and if they only got 44 and the refs signaled first down, our coaching staff wouldn't notice it.

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Coaching staff, not the assistants, GA's or anyone noticed the eff up with the chains that gave OSU a first down? 

5 million plus worth of coaches don't  notice that huge screw up?

In the post game Snyder said he was given an explanation but couldn't remember what it was. I interpret this to mean what he was told was complete bullshit, but since the big xii fines any coach that says anything slight about the refs, he said he couldn't remember.

Obviously this destroys the talking point that the staff "didn't do anything" or "didn't know", so feel free to disregard this and carry on.

[Trim]

No dumb dumb, they wouldn't have a fourth down decision because they would have adjusted the route to get past the sticks.

What are you talking about?  It was a 23 yards for a first down.  If anything, Mason Rudolf would have needed to hold on to the ball that much longer, 2 plays after he had been sacked for a loss.  Did you not watch him wilt under pressure in Austin last week?

That was the best play he could make, which meant it would have been 4th and 4 at our 39, which meant Gundy would have decided to risk not making a 1st down and giving us time to march 50 yards to put Cantele in field goal range.  Gundy would not have taken that risk.

It was not 23 yards for a first down to anyone that mattered.  It was 23 yards on tv and with your yellow line and in a perfect world that's how far away the official 1st down marker would've been from the LOS.  But that set of downs was played with everyone on the field working under the position that getting to that orange thing that's just past our 40 would be a first down.  OSU played their 3rd down to get the necessary 18 yards, and we defended them from doing so in a shitty fashion.

[Functianalyst]

No dumb dumb, they wouldn't have a fourth down decision because they would have adjusted the route to get past the sticks.

What are you talking about?  It was a 23 yards for a first down.  If anything, Mason Rudolf would have needed to hold on to the ball that much longer, 2 plays after he had been sacked for a loss.  Did you not watch him wilt under pressure in Austin last week?

That was the best play he could make, which meant it would have been 4th and 4 at our 39, which meant Gundy would have decided to risk not making a 1st down and giving us time to march 50 yards to put Cantele in field goal range.  Gundy would not have taken that risk.

It was not 23 yards for a first down to anyone that mattered.  It was 23 yards on tv and with your yellow line and in a perfect world that's how far away the official 1st down marker would've been from the LOS.  But that set of downs was played with everyone on the field working under the position that getting to that orange thing that's just past our 40 would be a first down.  OSU played their 3rd down to get the necessary 18 yards, and we defended them from doing so in a shitty fashion.

Exactly and if the chains had been where they were supposed to be, Gundy and Yurcich would not have put Rudolph in a situation to have another melt down like last week, especially after we had sacked him 2 plays earlier. 

To move the chains, OSU knew it would require Mason Rudolph having to take more steps back to deliver the ball down the field.  I suspect they would have tried to get manageable yardage on 3rd down (similar to the play before getting the first down) , then deciding whether to punt or go for a field goal.  Claiming they would have adjusted to go further down the field after Rudolph's mishaps last week was not going to be an option.

[Trim]

Claiming they would have adjusted to go further down the field after Rudolph's mishaps last week was not going to be an option.

But they were playing KSU this week.

[Functianalyst]

Claiming they would have adjusted to go further down the field after Rudolph's mishaps last week was not going to be an option.

But they were playing KSU this week.

Not sure where you guys are from, but here in Tulsa everyone was asking if Mason Rudolph had hurt his hand during the Texas game.  It became so bad that J.W Walsh had to come in and finish the game.  When it was discovered that Rudolph was okay and simply had a meltdown, greater concerns arose that he crumbled under pressure.  OSU fans were holding their breath and the coaches were going to protect Rudolph.  I am pretty sure they would have called a more manageable play especially after he had been sacked 2 plays earlier.   

[Trim]

Claiming they would have adjusted to go further down the field after Rudolph's mishaps last week was not going to be an option.

But they were playing KSU this week.

Not sure where you guys are from, but here in Tulsa everyone was asking if Mason Rudolph had hurt his hand during the Texas game.  It became so bad that J.W Walsh had to come in and finish the game.  When it was discovered that Rudolph was okay and simply had a meltdown, greater concerns arose that he crumbled under pressure.  OSU fans were holding their breath and the coaches were going to protect Rudolph.  I am pretty sure they would have called a more manageable play especially after he had been sacked 2 plays earlier.   

I'm from Seattle but I have a television and I'm a mod at the preeminent EMAW sports bbs and we've all been talking about how manageable it is to complete passes to the guy being defended by Morgan Burns.

[AndrewVonLintel]

1. Chain Gang makes blunder

2. Officials don't catch it.

3. K-State Staff doesn't catch it.

4. I am not sure what our secondary was thinking. They looked liked they were protecting the correct yard line but they are not real great so I am not sure   

Personally I  put the blame on the K-State Coaching Staff particularly the Defensive Staff.

[MakeItRain]

Coaching staff, not the assistants, GA's or anyone noticed the eff up with the chains that gave OSU a first down? 

5 million plus worth of coaches don't  notice that huge screw up?

In the post game Snyder said he was given an explanation but couldn't remember what it was. I interpret this to mean what he was told was complete bullshit, but since the big xii fines any coach that says anything slight about the refs, he said he couldn't remember.

Obviously this destroys the talking point that the staff "didn't do anything" or "didn't know", so feel free to disregard this and carry on.

If they would have noticed
1. They would have gotten the officials attention when it happened
2. Would have insisted that they got it right
3. The officials would have huddled and fixed it because our coaches would have insisted on them recheck in
4. Snyder would have remembered whatever bullshit excuse he was given because he would have been furious; attention to detail yada yada yada

[michigancat]

Who gives a crap

[wetwillie]

Who gives a crap

cats fans

[Trim]

He's probably mixed up and it's that somebody asked HIM about it at halftime and now he can't remember the explanation because he didn't have one.

[MakeItRain]

Who gives a crap

You came in here bub

[michigancat]

Bub!

[Cire]

[420seriouscat69]

Bub!

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Coaching staff, not the assistants, GA's or anyone noticed the eff up with the chains that gave OSU a first down? 

5 million plus worth of coaches don't  notice that huge screw up?

In the post game Snyder said he was given an explanation but couldn't remember what it was. I interpret this to mean what he was told was complete bullshit, but since the big xii fines any coach that says anything slight about the refs, he said he couldn't remember.

Obviously this destroys the talking point that the staff "didn't do anything" or "didn't know", so feel free to disregard this and carry on.

If they would have noticed
1. They would have gotten the officials attention when it happened
2. Would have insisted that they got it right
3. The officials would have huddled and fixed it because our coaches would have insisted on them recheck in
4. Snyder would have remembered whatever bullshit excuse he was given because he would have been furious; attention to detail yada yada yada

I realize this thread has evolved beyond conjecture, but it is unimaginable for that crew of referees to execute the 4 step sequence you outlined above without rough ridin' up at least one step. If anything, they would have placed the ball at the other wrong 45.

[MakeItRain]

Coaching staff, not the assistants, GA's or anyone noticed the eff up with the chains that gave OSU a first down? 

5 million plus worth of coaches don't  notice that huge screw up?

In the post game Snyder said he was given an explanation but couldn't remember what it was. I interpret this to mean what he was told was complete bullshit, but since the big xii fines any coach that says anything slight about the refs, he said he couldn't remember.

Obviously this destroys the talking point that the staff "didn't do anything" or "didn't know", so feel free to disregard this and carry on.

If they would have noticed
1. They would have gotten the officials attention when it happened
2. Would have insisted that they got it right
3. The officials would have huddled and fixed it because our coaches would have insisted on them recheck in
4. Snyder would have remembered whatever bullshit excuse he was given because he would have been furious; attention to detail yada yada yada

I realize this thread has evolved beyond conjecture, but it is unimaginable for that crew of referees to execute the 4 step sequence you outlined above without rough ridin' up at least one step. If anything, they would have placed the ball at the other wrong 45.

You really think that if the coaching staff were sure the officials were wrong about the down and distance LHC Bill Snyder couldn't convince them to huddle and talk about it and then not remember what was said to him that would have convinced him that he was wrong and not them?

I think the most likely scenario is that on third down an offensive coach in the box said something to the effect of "hey is the distance right, I could have sworn they needed more yards after the sack?" Bill then asks the line judge, he says something dismissive without checking with someone else and they moved on.

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the refs don't stop the game and huddle up every time a coach asks a question.

[Cartierfor3]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the refs don't stop the game and huddle up every time a coach asks a question.

They have the authority to confer with each other and get the call right at any time. If our sideline was insistant enough, they would've fixed it, or at least we would've gone bananas and made a scene and stuff. The point people were making is we have like 100 people and none of them managed to notice the mistake

[MakeItRain]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the refs don't stop the game and huddle up every time a coach asks a question.

Well if your scenario is true, the coaches knew but they couldn't get the referees to confer, then they all need to immediately retire.

[Cartierfor3]

yeah if they tried to get the refs to huddle up, and they refuse, throw a tantrum until they do.

[Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)]

Yeah, we should have a tantrum guy who throws a fit every time we don't like a spot. One who throws really good tantrums that forces refs to exercise their authority to confer.  Maybe give him a flare gun or flame thrower or something pyrotechnic.

[Cartierfor3]

Yeah, we should have a tantrum guy who throws a fit every time we don't like a spot. One who throws really good tantrums that forces refs to exercise their authority to confer.  Maybe give him a flare gun or flame thrower or something pyrotechnic.

it wasn't a bad spot. do you understand the sequence? a bad spot is a guy falls down at the 32 and they put the ball at the 31