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TITLETOWN - A Decade Long Celebration Of The Greatest Achievement In College Athletics History => Kstate cat football: Overlords of Iowa State (no big deal) => Topic started by: SkinnyBenny on November 05, 2016, 06:15:37 PM

Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 05, 2016, 06:15:37 PM
Vs. ISU:
Ball on our own 1/2 yard-line. Drop back ~6 yards into the end zone to hand off to Charles Jones, who is promptly tackled. Safety.




Vs. OSU:
--We have the ball in the 3rd quarter in their own red zone, down on about their 6. It's 2nd and 1. Instead of just powering straight ahead with #FamilyFullback or Ertz, we again drop about 5 yards back to hand it off. Tackled in the backfield. [Something inconsequential happens on 3rd down I think.] Then we decide on 4th and 4 or so that it's a good time to gamble and fake the field goal. Slow, plodding, basic fake comes nowhere near getting a first down.

--Late with like 7 or 8 minutes left in the game, up 9 points, and we're past midfield in their territory. We have 4th and 1. Instead of just powering straight ahead with #FamilyFullback or Ertz, we punt. Two plays later, they throw an 82-yard touchdown pass.



Now you list your faves.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Big Sam on November 05, 2016, 06:19:33 PM
Becoming utterly predictable in short yardage during the 4th quarter allowing OSU to sell out up the middle.  Playing not to lose gets a bit painful at times, for you know what is going to happen.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 05, 2016, 06:23:12 PM
Not figuring out how to recruit  or develop a legit P5 QB.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 05, 2016, 06:24:05 PM
Not covering wrs 20 yards down the field.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 05, 2016, 06:24:39 PM
The PringleCat
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 05, 2016, 06:25:35 PM
Not covering wrs 20 yards down the field.

Oh man, we got burned on that over the middle pass play so many times lol
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Steffy08 on November 05, 2016, 06:35:48 PM
Time for a change
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 05, 2016, 07:03:34 PM
Ooh, what about last year when we were beating #2 TCU at half by 18 points, so obviously we should've just Collin Klein 2010 Texas'd the Horned Frogs and ran the ball effortlessly for the entire second half, but INSTEAD!!! we decided to have Bazooka Joe air it out for the entire 3rd and 4th quarters? Because that's what they won't expect us to do! Because we're bad at it! They'll never expect it.  (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAWJdXJvngU&t=0m27s)

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: KSNimrod on November 05, 2016, 07:09:16 PM
Time for a change indeed. 


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Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Skipper44 on November 05, 2016, 07:26:07 PM
Not figuring out how to recruit  or develop a legit P5 QB.
we have the best QBs $3 million+ can find in Kansas, Iowa and western Missouri
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Steffy08 on November 05, 2016, 07:28:57 PM
Of all the crap that pisses me off about today--and there is a lot-allowing a receiver to get ten yards behind our rough ridin' soft defense when we are up nine and there is about nine minutes left.....that takes the cake for me.  It was the only way we could lose, and we did it.  And it would be one thing if we were blitzing like hell---but no we weren't.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on November 05, 2016, 07:33:36 PM
Too much to list. Nearly every defensive and offensive decision.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 05, 2016, 07:42:47 PM
I agree that the pair of short yardage decisions were ultimately the difference for our offense. That 2nd and 1 with a huge loss was a body shot and the 3rd and 1 leading to the punt was the death blow.

Defensively its not as easy to tell, but clearly we had some huge breakdowns to give up 10 yards a play over the course of an entire game. That's just getting destroyed. You have to play a little defense to win and even with the offensive miscues, I still put this loss more on the inability of the defense even with the pair of INTs.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: steve dave on November 05, 2016, 07:55:33 PM
Not figuring out how to recruit  or develop a legit P5 QB.

this would actually salve all of my chapped ass
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: steve dave on November 05, 2016, 07:57:10 PM
I should say I like a lot about ertz. makes good decisions. fast. stuff like that. just the noodliest noodle arm. maybe it's broke, I don't know. like bazooka at least overthrew those wide open long routes. underthrowing them ever single time is infuriating.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 05, 2016, 07:58:41 PM
I should say I like a lot about ertz. makes good decisions. fast. stuff like that. just the noodliest noodle arm. maybe it's broke, I don't know. like bazooka at least overthrew those wide open long routes. underthrowing them ever single time is infuriating.
I have no idea how he hasn't had more interceptions with that noodle of an arm. With so many laughably bad throws you'd think more would end up with the other team.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: CatMission on November 05, 2016, 08:01:12 PM
I am sick of the "we've got to figure out how to ride the hot hand" crap about the RBs because as soon as we find one, we pull them or go back to QB run. The 4th and 1 punt in the 4th quarter was set up by a Barnes run for 8 or 9 and then Ertz on 2nd and 3rd for nothing.


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Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 05, 2016, 08:03:53 PM
I should say I like a lot about ertz. makes good decisions. fast. stuff like that. just the noodliest noodle arm. maybe it's broke, I don't know. like bazooka at least overthrew those wide open long routes. underthrowing them ever single time is infuriating.
I have no idea how he hasn't had more interceptions with that noodle of an arm. With so many laughably bad throws you'd think more would end up with the other team.

That miss on the throw to Pringle was rough. Pringle ran a great route and was 5 yards by his man and he still should have caught it, but the ball was way under thrown.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Sandstone Outcropping on November 05, 2016, 08:12:17 PM
The PringleCat
Nothing else in our offense was working at that point in the game. Why not take a chance in that situation? PringleCat seemed like a worthwhile gamble, IMHO.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Ich.Gewinne on November 05, 2016, 08:13:00 PM
eff you DC's et al and your rough ridin' terrible defense. It does not work. Period.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: steve dave on November 05, 2016, 08:17:13 PM
I am sick of the "we've got to figure out how to ride the hot hand" crap about the RBs because as soon as we find one, we pull them or go back to QB run. The 4th and 1 punt in the 4th quarter was set up by a Barnes run for 8 or 9 and then Ertz on 2nd and 3rd for nothing.


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here's the thing about our RBs, they're all kinda good. I don't remember ever having so many kinda good options. we usually have like one and some trash. we just don't stick with them. we run designed ertz option run thing, or some shitty pass play and blow ourselves up. and then when we need 3 yards we go out of the gun in a slow developing run and get stopped. just run our kinda good RBs behind our somehow kinda good OL (great job here coaching staff btw) and get yards. But we get ertz either underthrowing some crap or slowly developing some QB thing or doing the delayed handoff 4 yards deep and I lose my crap.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: steve dave on November 05, 2016, 08:17:56 PM
I used some pretty HFBIQ terminology there so PM if you need some explanation of wtf I just typed
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sys on November 05, 2016, 08:20:56 PM
i thought they did a good job except for calling passing plays that were neither needed or desired.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 05, 2016, 08:36:30 PM
No one mentioned that awful fake fg?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: steve dave on November 05, 2016, 08:38:00 PM
i thought they did a good job except for calling passing plays that were neither needed or desired.

YEP
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 05, 2016, 08:40:31 PM
I should say I like a lot about ertz. makes good decisions. fast. stuff like that. just the noodliest noodle arm. maybe it's broke, I don't know. like bazooka at least overthrew those wide open long routes. underthrowing them ever single time is infuriating.

He air mailed every deep throw before he herniaed his shoulder. His shoulder seems fine though he had really good zip on his passes today, too good, he seems to not have a change up on short routes.

I should say I like a lot about ertz. makes good decisions. fast. stuff like that. just the noodliest noodle arm. maybe it's broke, I don't know. like bazooka at least overthrew those wide open long routes. underthrowing them ever single time is infuriating.
I have no idea how he hasn't had more interceptions with that noodle of an arm. With so many laughably bad throws you'd think more would end up with the other team.

That miss on the throw to Pringle was rough. Pringle ran a great route and was 5 yards by his man and he still should have caught it, but the ball was way under thrown.

I hit him in the facemask
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 05, 2016, 08:43:59 PM
No one mentioned that awful fake fg?

Oh man, what a bad sequence. From 2nd and 1 at the 6 to that terrible display. The pick 6 just a couple plays later probably took away from how awful it was.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: steve dave on November 05, 2016, 08:45:38 PM
he's under thrown shitloads of passes this year. maybe hurt, maybe bad arm, maybe bad decisions on how much to put on it. I don't know. whatever it is if he's going to keep doing that (which I'm making an educated guess he will given the evidence) we need to abandon those routes. I like a lot about what he does but that part is no bueno. I've said that for weeks.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: steve dave on November 05, 2016, 08:47:38 PM
that fake field goal was infuriating because we didn't just line up and go for it. OSU's defense sucks crap. that's not our best play there. armchair qb commenting on a play that didn't work disclaimer.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 05, 2016, 08:49:39 PM
Lochbiler (?sp) had a great day kicking the ball, not sure how that translates into getting an 11 yard rush though.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 05, 2016, 08:52:00 PM
that fake field goal was infuriating because we didn't just line up and go for it. OSU's defense sucks crap. that's not our best play there. armchair qb commenting on a play that didn't work disclaimer.

Relatively speaking, OSU's defense isn't bad, probably Top 3 in the Big 12.

I agree, just line up and run a play there if you are going to fake it. I mean, I'm sure running out your back up kicker who has already missed a PAT and barely made a FG is a pretty good tip off that a fake might be coming.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 05, 2016, 08:55:41 PM
he's under thrown shitloads of passes this year. maybe hurt, maybe bad arm, maybe bad decisions on how much to put on it. I don't know. whatever it is if he's going to keep doing that (which I'm making an educated guess he will given the evidence) we need to abandon those routes. I like a lot about what he does but that part is no bueno. I've said that for weeks.
Bill is still infatuated with Waters/Lockett. He can't adapt an offense to his personnel any more.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BostonPancake on November 05, 2016, 08:57:31 PM
I wonder if the utter failure of the fake FG played a part in the decision to not go for it on 4th down.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 05, 2016, 08:58:29 PM
he's under thrown shitloads of passes this year. maybe hurt, maybe bad arm, maybe bad decisions on how much to put on it. I don't know. whatever it is if he's going to keep doing that (which I'm making an educated guess he will given the evidence) we need to abandon those routes. I like a lot about what he does but that part is no bueno. I've said that for weeks.
Bill is still infatuated with Waters/Lockett. He can't adapt an offense to his personnel any more.

We ran the ball 56 times and threw 18 passes today and like 2 were more than 10 yards.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Whale on November 05, 2016, 08:59:11 PM
https://mobile.twitter.com/DScottFritchen/status/795062869087789056

Welp

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Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 05, 2016, 08:59:43 PM
he's under thrown shitloads of passes this year. maybe hurt, maybe bad arm, maybe bad decisions on how much to put on it. I don't know. whatever it is if he's going to keep doing that (which I'm making an educated guess he will given the evidence) we need to abandon those routes. I like a lot about what he does but that part is no bueno. I've said that for weeks.
Bill is still infatuated with Waters/Lockett. He can't adapt an offense to his personnel any more.

We ran the ball 56 times and threw 18 passes today and like 2 were more than 10 yards.
Well, yeah. So I'm wrong.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 05, 2016, 09:02:46 PM
I mean, it sounds crazy to type "fifty six" as a legit number for rushing attempts. And to be as successful as we were at it, often gouging OSU with offtackle zone and zone read. It was fun to watch when it was clicking, it didn't matter who was at RB. Jones steps out of bounds and doesn't see the field until the last drive and was averaging 12 yards per carry. No matter, Barnes comes in and gets big runs too.

We absolutely need to develop some sort of passing game, but to see this offensive line and running game develop has been encouraging to me.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: steve dave on November 05, 2016, 09:05:21 PM
The fact that we ran a ton and had huge success doing so isn't a convincing argument to me that the times we threw were valid.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Big Sam on November 05, 2016, 09:36:14 PM
No one mentioned that awful fake fg?

Because we are doing our best to try and forget about it.  It was so effing awful that, at at least I, cannot believe it actually happened.  Makes me want to consider seriously hard drugs so that I drift off and nothing else matters anymore.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: DOD Take 2 on November 05, 2016, 11:58:59 PM
I am sick of the "we've got to figure out how to ride the hot hand" crap about the RBs because as soon as we find one, we pull them or go back to QB run. The 4th and 1 punt in the 4th quarter was set up by a Barnes run for 8 or 9 and then Ertz on 2nd and 3rd for nothing.


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here's the thing about our RBs, they're all kinda good. I don't remember ever having so many kinda good options. we usually have like one and some trash. we just don't stick with them. we run designed ertz option run thing, or some shitty pass play and blow ourselves up. and then when we need 3 yards we go out of the gun in a slow developing run and get stopped. just run our kinda good RBs behind our somehow kinda good OL (great job here coaching staff btw) and get yards. But we get ertz either underthrowing some crap or slowly developing some QB thing or doing the delayed handoff 4 yards deep and I lose my crap.

I hate when we use the FB only formation in 3rd and short. It telegraphs we are running Ertz since Dimel isn't in a position to get the ball. Especially today when all we did was run.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 06, 2016, 12:00:08 AM
No one mentioned that awful fake fg?

Other than in the original post?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: DOD Take 2 on November 06, 2016, 12:01:19 AM

--Late with like 7 or 8 minutes left in the game, up 9 points, and we're past midfield in their territory. We have 4th and 1. Instead of just powering straight ahead with #FamilyFullback or Ertz, we punt. Two plays later, they throw an 82-yard touchdown pass

Barnes got a first down on that run. The ref spotted him 2 yards short though. Should've never had the 3rd and 1
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pett on November 06, 2016, 12:03:34 AM
The PringleCat

No kidding. I assume Dana drew that gem up in a meeting this morning
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 06, 2016, 07:34:44 AM

--Late with like 7 or 8 minutes left in the game, up 9 points, and we're past midfield in their territory. We have 4th and 1. Instead of just powering straight ahead with #FamilyFullback or Ertz, we punt. Two plays later, they throw an 82-yard touchdown pass

Barnes got a first down on that run. The ref spotted him 2 yards short though. Should've never had the 3rd and 1

Good to know, but irrelevantvto the discussion, actually.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 06, 2016, 08:06:19 AM
I'm confused as to the roll of our safeties in this defense.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: PowercatPat on November 06, 2016, 08:24:56 AM

--Late with like 7 or 8 minutes left in the game, up 9 points, and we're past midfield in their territory. We have 4th and 1. Instead of just powering straight ahead with #FamilyFullback or Ertz, we punt. Two plays later, they throw an 82-yard touchdown pass

Barnes got a first down on that run. The ref spotted him 2 yards short though. Should've never had the 3rd and 1

Good to know, but irrelevantvto the discussion, actually.

Well, the coaches could've decided to challenge it. That was one of the worst spots I've ever seen.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: KSUBrian on November 06, 2016, 08:49:19 AM

--Late with like 7 or 8 minutes left in the game, up 9 points, and we're past midfield in their territory. We have 4th and 1. Instead of just powering straight ahead with #FamilyFullback or Ertz, we punt. Two plays later, they throw an 82-yard touchdown pass

Barnes got a first down on that run. The ref spotted him 2 yards short though. Should've never had the 3rd and 1

Good to know, but irrelevantvto the discussion, actually.

Well, the coaches could've decided to challenge it. That was one of the worst spots I've ever seen.

This.  B12 continue to show how bad they suck.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: KSUBrian on November 06, 2016, 08:53:58 AM
he's under thrown shitloads of passes this year. maybe hurt, maybe bad arm, maybe bad decisions on how much to put on it. I don't know. whatever it is if he's going to keep doing that (which I'm making an educated guess he will given the evidence) we need to abandon those routes. I like a lot about what he does but that part is no bueno. I've said that for weeks.
Bill is still infatuated with Waters/Lockett. He can't adapt an offense to his personnel any more.
Evidence that Bill isn't really in control anymore.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: KSUBrian on November 06, 2016, 08:54:57 AM
https://mobile.twitter.com/DScottFritchen/status/795062869087789056

Welp

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More evidence.  He can't explain a decision he didn't make.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 06, 2016, 08:56:27 AM

--Late with like 7 or 8 minutes left in the game, up 9 points, and we're past midfield in their territory. We have 4th and 1. Instead of just powering straight ahead with #FamilyFullback or Ertz, we punt. Two plays later, they throw an 82-yard touchdown pass

Barnes got a first down on that run. The ref spotted him 2 yards short though. Should've never had the 3rd and 1

I noticed this as well.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 06, 2016, 09:26:17 AM
2nd to last play of the game, we called a play that led to our receiver being tackled at the 1. We had 0 timeouts. If we hadn't gotten a penalty for O-PI we would've ended the game without throwing to the endzone
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cartierfor3 on November 06, 2016, 09:31:35 AM
Ooh, what about last year when we were beating #2 TCU at half by 18 points, so obviously we should've just Collin Klein 2010 Texas'd the Horned Frogs and ran the ball effortlessly for the entire second half, but INSTEAD!!! we decided to have Bazooka Joe air it out for the entire 3rd and 4th quarters? Because that's what they won't expect us to do! Because we're bad at it! They'll never expect it.  (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fAWJdXJvngU&t=0m27s)

Garth
 :lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 06, 2016, 09:38:12 AM
2nd to last play of the game, we called a play that led to our receiver being tackled at the 1. We had 0 timeouts. If we hadn't gotten a penalty for O-PI we would've ended the game without throwing to the endzone

I think that was more of the player not being aware of where he was on the field than the call. We've run rub plays against man in the endzone plenty of times before.

The play that really hurt on that final drive was the outside run to Jones that got blown up and forced us to waste a TO. Of course, that outside zone scheme had gotten us big chunks earlier in the game for both Jones and Barnes so I understood it, but when it got destroyed and we lost yards it took an additional running play our of our hands because we had to waste one of our two timeouts.

Also, this was a game where truly wasting a TO in a late play clock situation came back to hurt us. If we had an additional timeout and a chance to call another run play at the 4 with 10 seconds left I truly think we win the game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: #LIFE on November 06, 2016, 09:39:26 AM
I hope they can finally put to bed the "Snyder teams don't beat themselves" bullshit. We have twice this year and nearly did in 2 others
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on November 06, 2016, 09:42:02 AM
If Bill decides to retire, I hope he announces sooner that later. I don't want a May announcement and have absolutely zero coaching options.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 06, 2016, 09:42:04 AM
The sequence where we chose not to call a timeout with the clock running and gundy waiting till right before the snap to call one made him look much smarter than our coach
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 06, 2016, 10:28:08 AM
I'm confused as to the roll of our safeties in this defense.

Run support, they are non existent in defending the pass. Also OSU kept running at Willis because it seems they only have him bee lining at the QB, always.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 06, 2016, 10:34:00 AM
2nd to last play of the game, we called a play that led to our receiver being tackled at the 1. We had 0 timeouts. If we hadn't gotten a penalty for O-PI we would've ended the game without throwing to the endzone

I think that was more of the player not being aware of where he was on the field than the call. We've run rub plays against man in the endzone plenty of times before.

The play that really hurt on that final drive was the outside run to Jones that got blown up and forced us to waste a TO. Of course, that outside zone scheme had gotten us big chunks earlier in the game for both Jones and Barnes so I understood it, but when it got destroyed and we lost yards it took an additional running play our of our hands because we had to waste one of our two timeouts.

Also, this was a game where truly wasting a TO in a late play clock situation came back to hurt us. If we had an additional timeout and a chance to call another run play at the 4 with 10 seconds left I truly think we win the game.

That OPI call was a complete make up call because the fourth down conversion was incredibly egregious and it happened in front of the OSU bench and I'm sure their coaches were going nuts.

Also the issue with the Jones zone play at that spot is that it was incredibly obvious that we were running there and OSU totally sold out on that. I'd be interested to see the location of their safeties on that play and how many they had in the box. I think a misdirection of sorts would have been awesome there, like the WR end around we ran earlier.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: HELLHAMMER on November 06, 2016, 10:57:50 AM
#1 hiring oscar Weber and #2 LHC Bill Snyder not knowing when he is no longer relevant (i.e. just rough ridin' retire) are the two worst coaching decisions in the recent past.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Panjandrum on November 06, 2016, 11:04:50 AM
Why was Dozier 1:1 with Washington on that 82 yd TD?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on November 06, 2016, 11:19:35 AM
Why was Dozier 1:1 with Washington on that 82 yd TD?

Because our DC is a dumbass.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 06, 2016, 01:38:36 PM
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Powercat84 on November 06, 2016, 04:08:57 PM
Did anyone else notice that Barnes clearly made enough yardage on 2nd and 4 for a first down on our ill-fated 4th and 1 drive?  No replay and no discussion.  Then 3rd and 1 gets stuffed and we tuck our balls and punt... Watch the play...   Am I off base?   :Chirp:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 06, 2016, 06:11:16 PM
I'm confused as to the roll of our safeties in this defense.

Run support, they are non existent in defending the pass.

Seems like an ill-advised strategy in the big12
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: PIPE on November 06, 2016, 07:24:33 PM
Did anyone else notice that Barnes clearly made enough yardage on 2nd and 4 for a first down on our ill-fated 4th and 1 drive?  No replay and no discussion.  Then 3rd and 1 gets stuffed and we tuck our balls and punt... Watch the play...   Am I off base?   :Chirp:

Nope, you are not off base at all. The ref starts walking in from the sideline where the ball should have been but marks it back a yard when he gets there. That still doesn't excuse our dumbass coaching staff to go with a qb sneak on the next play and not going for it on 4th
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: KSUBrian on November 07, 2016, 12:19:04 AM
If Bill decides to retire, I hope he announces sooner that later. I don't want a May announcement and have absolutely zero coaching options.

More likely a July retirement with Sean as the only option.  But Currie has that covered with Jerry Kill in the wings.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: bones129 on November 07, 2016, 12:41:10 AM
If Bill decides to retire, he needs to announce now for recruiting and, more importantly, for the HC choice. IMO opinion , Coach needs to turn the program  over to someone like BV.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Nature Boy on November 07, 2016, 09:47:52 AM
For better or worse, I shape the lives of America's youth one math class at a time, so I'm not always able to stay current with what's been posted on the board...forgive me if this is a total repeat.  A theory:

Bill, John and BV have already worked out a deal to make BV the head coach in waiting next year as well as DC.  This would have been done sooner, but BV wanted to give himself the opportunity to be a coach on a NC team, which another year of DeShaun Watson potentially gives him this year.  This would explain why Hayes was brought back despite evidence suggesting he wanted to retire after last year.  BV will take over the D next year, bring with him an offensive mind capable of putting together a game plan that doesn't completely boggle the mind, and Bill will ride off into the sunset with a team capable of making some noise nationally next year.

Holes:  John Currie may not be capable of actually pulling this off.  Bill may be too delusional/egotistical/old to realize it's time to call it a day.  BV gets an offer he can't refuse from somewhere else.

What else am I missing?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 07, 2016, 10:06:03 AM
Bill needs to gtfo this season and take all of his loser assistants with him.

Here's another terrible coaching decision: keeping Delton on the bench.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 07, 2016, 10:11:56 AM
Here's another terrible coaching decision: keeping Delton on the bench.

The offense is getting better and better and Ertz is a major reason why. For those that can't see that, I don't know what to tell you, but you aren't paying much attention.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 07, 2016, 10:36:14 AM
this stat right here sums up our season
Alex Barnes   27   210   7.8   27   
Jesse Ertz   109   192   1165   56.8   6.07

bolded is yards per carry vs yards vs attempt
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 07, 2016, 10:50:37 AM
this stat right here sums up our season
Alex Barnes   27   210   7.8   27   
Jesse Ertz   109   192   1165   56.8   6.07

bolded is yards per carry vs yards vs attempt

_FAN made the point about them turning Ertz into Klein. The guy was a passer in a spread offense when he came here, he's now essentially a wishbone quarterback.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 07, 2016, 10:53:11 AM
this stat right here sums up our season
Alex Barnes   27   210   7.8   27   
Jesse Ertz   109   192   1165   56.8   6.07

bolded is yards per carry vs yards vs attempt

_FAN made the point about them turning Ertz into Klein. The guy was a passer in a spread offense when he came here, he's now essentially a wishbone quarterback.
and i think he is (or could be) a very good runner, we have talked about this. I'm just not sure why we need him to throw if we have ball carriers rushing for more yards on average than he throws for on average.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 07, 2016, 10:58:30 AM
this stat right here sums up our season
Alex Barnes   27   210   7.8   27   
Jesse Ertz   109   192   1165   56.8   6.07

bolded is yards per carry vs yards vs attempt

_FAN made the point about them turning Ertz into Klein. The guy was a passer in a spread offense when he came here, he's now essentially a wishbone quarterback.
and i think he is (or could be) a very good runner, we have talked about this. I'm just not sure why we need him to throw if we have ball carriers rushing for more yards on average than he throws for on average.

He's slowly but surely getting better at throwing the ball down field, now the receivers at least have a shot at catching them. I thought this game was his worst at throwing short and intermediate routes. Also people are going to be pissed but I think he's the starter until he leaves, barring injury, no matter the staff in place.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on November 07, 2016, 11:02:26 AM
The guy was a passer in a spread offense when he came here

This is so hard to believe given his arm
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 07, 2016, 11:10:04 AM
this stat right here sums up our season
Alex Barnes   27   210   7.8   27   
Jesse Ertz   109   192   1165   56.8   6.07

bolded is yards per carry vs yards vs attempt

_FAN made the point about them turning Ertz into Klein. The guy was a passer in a spread offense when he came here, he's now essentially a wishbone quarterback.
and i think he is (or could be) a very good runner, we have talked about this. I'm just not sure why we need him to throw if we have ball carriers rushing for more yards on average than he throws for on average.

He's slowly but surely getting better at throwing the ball down field, now the receivers at least have a shot at catching them. I thought this game was his worst at throwing short and intermediate routes. Also people are going to be pissed but I think he's the starter until he leaves, barring injury, no matter the staff in place.
i guess you could be right, injuries aside i could see that. i do however doubt that actually happens
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 07, 2016, 11:31:15 AM
The guy was a passer in a spread offense when he came here

This is so hard to believe given his arm

High school football is a whole lot slower than college ball.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 07, 2016, 12:00:25 PM
this stat right here sums up our season
Alex Barnes   27   210   7.8   27   
Jesse Ertz   109   192   1165   56.8   6.07

bolded is yards per carry vs yards vs attempt

_FAN made the point about them turning Ertz into Klein. The guy was a passer in a spread offense when he came here, he's now essentially a wishbone quarterback.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/Ertz-Klein.png)

His throwing will improve (like Klein's) and I don't think his shoulder being dinged helps.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 07, 2016, 12:20:05 PM
Fine, I'll revise it to: not finding some way in which to utilize Delton. Using him instead of the PringleCat is an obvious place to start. I do think Ertz has been pretty good, but my god...his passing is BARELY up to D-1 standards right now. Assuming he's still sketti arm'd or something because he floats noodle-armed moonballs to guys who are 15 yards downfield. His "long bombs" and even his "medium bombs" against Okie State legitimately cost us points numerous times, because instead of leading our receivers when they had their coverage beat downfield, he threw behind the receivers and they subsequently had to slow down to make the catch and were ultimately tackled.


That being said, there are other threads for whining about QBs, so I'll get it back on track:

--In the entirety of last season and to some degree before it, our defensive backs would routinely give 8 yards of cushion on 3rd and 6. Or 10 yards of cushion on 3rd and 8. Or 5 yards on 3rd and 3. This could be on the players for not having an awareness of where the first down marker is, or it could be on the coaches calling the coverages. Either way, it happened so often that it clearly falls on the coaches to make better decisions about either coverages or personnel who can know where the first down marker is.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: POWL on November 07, 2016, 12:24:29 PM
i strongly feel that D1 coordinators should know where the 1st down marker is......... :facepalm:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on November 07, 2016, 02:55:21 PM
Ertz is hurt, that's why he can't throw.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on November 07, 2016, 03:03:36 PM
Ertz is hurt, that's why he can't throw.
He's been hurt all season?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Katdaddy on November 07, 2016, 03:10:11 PM
Ertz is hurt, that's why he can't throw.
Who can tell me of one of our starting QB's that made it thru a whole season without a shoulder injury?  eff I already know the answer, no one!  :curse:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Steffy08 on November 07, 2016, 03:40:24 PM
Last year, when it was fourth and one against TCU, the rumor was that Snyder called TO to talk about whether to go for it, that Snyder was inclined to go for it, and that he asked Dimel if he had a good play for the situation, and that Dimel responded "no" (over the protestations of Andre Coleman).

I wonder if something like that happened again on Saturday.  Anybody hear anything?  In the press conference this Saturday, Snyder gave an extremely weird answer to the question of why he didn't go for it.  It almost seemed like Snyder was about ready to start crying, and he was so frustrated that he started tapping his hand on the podium.  I wonder if Snyder was pissed that Dimel didn't have a play ready to go (perhaps also pissed about the 3 and 1 call), but that Snyder was boxed in from talking about the situation because of his loyalty to his assistants.

Perhaps Snyder is as frustrated with Dimel and Hayes as is everybody else, and  he is conflicted about firing his assistant coaches but on the other hand does not want to go out like this.

 :dunno:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Emo EMAW on November 07, 2016, 03:52:17 PM
Someone needs to pull Bill aside and make him watch Scarface and hope he doesn't fall asleep before the ending.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: hatingfrancis on November 07, 2016, 03:59:04 PM
Last year, when it was fourth and one against TCU, the rumor was that Snyder called TO to talk about whether to go for it, that Snyder was inclined to go for it, and that he asked Dimel if he had a good play for the situation, and that Dimel responded "no" (over the protestations of Andre Coleman).

I wonder if something like that happened again on Saturday.  Anybody hear anything?  In the press conference this Saturday, Snyder gave an extremely weird answer to the question of why he didn't go for it.  It almost seemed like Snyder was about ready to start crying, and he was so frustrated that he started tapping his hand on the podium. I wonder if Snyder was pissed that Dimel didn't have a play ready to go (perhaps also pissed about the 3 and 1 call), but that Snyder was boxed in from talking about the situation because of his loyalty to his assistants.

Perhaps Snyder is as frustrated with Dimel and Hayes as is everybody else, and  he is conflicted about firing his assistant coaches but on the other hand does not want to go out like this.

 :dunno:

Yeah.  Definitely had to be one of those two situations that got him pissed off.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on November 07, 2016, 04:25:08 PM
I just want our players to play well and our coaches to coach well.. Is that too much to ask for??
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Steffy08 on November 07, 2016, 04:28:42 PM
Last year, when it was fourth and one against TCU, the rumor was that Snyder called TO to talk about whether to go for it, that Snyder was inclined to go for it, and that he asked Dimel if he had a good play for the situation, and that Dimel responded "no" (over the protestations of Andre Coleman).

I wonder if something like that happened again on Saturday.  Anybody hear anything?  In the press conference this Saturday, Snyder gave an extremely weird answer to the question of why he didn't go for it.  It almost seemed like Snyder was about ready to start crying, and he was so frustrated that he started tapping his hand on the podium. I wonder if Snyder was pissed that Dimel didn't have a play ready to go (perhaps also pissed about the 3 and 1 call), but that Snyder was boxed in from talking about the situation because of his loyalty to his assistants.

Perhaps Snyder is as frustrated with Dimel and Hayes as is everybody else, and  he is conflicted about firing his assistant coaches but on the other hand does not want to go out like this.

 :dunno:

Yeah.  Definitely had to be one of those two situations that got him pissed off.

I didn't say it had to be one of those that got him pissed off...I just threw that out there as a possibility.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on November 07, 2016, 06:22:49 PM
Ertz is hurt, that's why he can't throw.
He's been hurt all season?


Since OU AT least

Did he go to the locker room against Stanford?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: That_Guy on November 07, 2016, 09:14:12 PM
For better or worse, I shape the lives of America's youth one math class at a time, so I'm not always able to stay current with what's been posted on the board...forgive me if this is a total repeat.  A theory:

Bill, John and BV have already worked out a deal to make BV the head coach in waiting next year as well as DC.  This would have been done sooner, but BV wanted to give himself the opportunity to be a coach on a NC team, which another year of DeShaun Watson potentially gives him this year.  This would explain why Hayes was brought back despite evidence suggesting he wanted to retire after last year.  BV will take over the D next year, bring with him an offensive mind capable of putting together a game plan that doesn't completely boggle the mind, and Bill will ride off into the sunset with a team capable of making some noise nationally next year.

Holes:  John Currie may not be capable of actually pulling this off.  Bill may be too delusional/egotistical/old to realize it's time to call it a day.  BV gets an offer he can't refuse from somewhere else.

What else am I missing?

Realizing that we're K-State and this is just a pipe-dream and all it ever will be. I believe Venables could be the coach that can take us to the next level, but there are too many fans that are okay and happy with mediocrity.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: troubledscribe on November 07, 2016, 09:45:29 PM
In NCAA 2014 I never punt.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: delerioustyme on November 08, 2016, 12:11:14 AM
For better or worse, I shape the lives of America's youth one math class at a time, so I'm not always able to stay current with what's been posted on the board...forgive me if this is a total repeat.  A theory:

Bill, John and BV have already worked out a deal to make BV the head coach in waiting next year as well as DC.  This would have been done sooner, but BV wanted to give himself the opportunity to be a coach on a NC team, which another year of DeShaun Watson potentially gives him this year.  This would explain why Hayes was brought back despite evidence suggesting he wanted to retire after last year.  BV will take over the D next year, bring with him an offensive mind capable of putting together a game plan that doesn't completely boggle the mind, and Bill will ride off into the sunset with a team capable of making some noise nationally next year.

Holes:  John Currie may not be capable of actually pulling this off.  Bill may be too delusional/egotistical/old to realize it's time to call it a day.  BV gets an offer he can't refuse from somewhere else.

What else am I missing?

BV already had the chance to be on a NC team, 2000 OU.  That wasn't the reason why he isn't here as coach in waiting, because there is no coach in waiting status. 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2016, 05:37:06 AM
Ertz is hurt, that's why he can't throw.
He's been hurt all season?


Since OU AT least

Did he go to the locker room against Stanford?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sure did
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on November 08, 2016, 11:56:08 AM
Fitz bringing the hammer over at GoPowercat.com

KEY NO. 1: SCHEME FOR PRESSURE

Trying to keep Oklahoma State quarterback Mason Rudolph uncomfortable in the pocket was the key and the results are clearly stated in the postgame statistics. K-State had just one sack of Rudolph, who completed 29 of 38 passes for 457 yards and five touchdowns. The idea of sitting back in zone is not only failing miserably, but doing so in epic fashion.

POSTGAME GRADE: F

KEY NO. 2: POUND THE ROCK

K-State averaged 6.2 yards per carry on 56 rushes. It totaled 345 rushing yards, which should be good enough to win the game, but it wasn't. Why? Because on a fourth down in the fourth quarter, LHC Bill Snyder lacked the faith that his running game could pick up a single yard. The message was clear to everyone involved: K-State can run the ball — freshman Alex Barnes is a dominant force in the backfield when he's allowed to play — but the coaches don't have enough belief in the running game to trust it.

POSTGAME GRADE: C

KEY NO. 3: FIX SPECIAL TEAMS

K-State's special teams remain a shadow of their former self. Sure, the return game was solid, but an injury to kicker Matthew McCrane put Ian Patterson in a position to kick extra points and field goals. Patterson missed his first PAT, leaving K-State a point behind on the scoreboard all day. He did line drive a 43-yard field goal through the uprights, but it didn't build any trust in Patterson's ability. So, facing a fourth-and-4 at the OSU 10 early in the third quarter, instead of trying a 27-yard field goal, the K-State coaches called for a fake field goal. Holder Mitch Lochbihler, a punter, took the snap and was tackled for no gain. It was a baffling call because it fooled no one and put the ball in the hands of a punter to run the ball.

POSTGAME GRADE: D

KEY NO. 4: STAY THE COURSE, COACHES

K-State didn't attack on defense, instead it sat back in soft coverage and was ravaged.

Offensively, the coaches appeared to get bored with running the ball, even after a game-opening 11-play drive of all runs covered 75 yards for a touchdown.

And then there was that memorable fourth-and-1 punt that decided the game.

K-State's coaching advantage is clearly gone.

POSTGAME GRADE: F

FINAL ANALYSIS

This isn't a great K-State team, but this was a game it should have won. But the players didn't fail. The coaches failed them.

FITZ'S PREDICTION: KANSAS STATE 31, OKLAHOMA STATE 30

ACTUAL FINAL SCORE: OKLAHOMA STATE 43, KANSAS STATE 37

FITZ'S POSTGAME GRADE: D
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 08, 2016, 12:10:52 PM
Fitz was spot-on there, actually
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 08, 2016, 12:15:38 PM
Yep, dead on. Again I'll state if McCrane was out because of injury he clearly did not agree. And if he was unavailable I have no idea why the coaches allowed him to fully dress out, helmet and all.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 08, 2016, 12:30:21 PM
Good stuff from Fitz.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2016, 12:36:09 PM
Kind of weird to cite Alex Barnes as our stud RB
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on November 08, 2016, 01:46:35 PM
He is a confirmed stud tho
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 08, 2016, 01:53:51 PM
Kind of weird to cite Alex Barnes as our stud RB
if he was a starter we are talking 1k yds already
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheHamburglar on November 08, 2016, 02:04:58 PM
For better or worse, I shape the lives of America's youth one math class at a time, so I'm not always able to stay current with what's been posted on the board...forgive me if this is a total repeat.  A theory:

Bill, John and BV have already worked out a deal to make BV the head coach in waiting next year as well as DC.  This would have been done sooner, but BV wanted to give himself the opportunity to be a coach on a NC team, which another year of DeShaun Watson potentially gives him this year.  This would explain why Hayes was brought back despite evidence suggesting he wanted to retire after last year.  BV will take over the D next year, bring with him an offensive mind capable of putting together a game plan that doesn't completely boggle the mind, and Bill will ride off into the sunset with a team capable of making some noise nationally next year.

Holes:  John Currie may not be capable of actually pulling this off.  Bill may be too delusional/egotistical/old to realize it's time to call it a day.  BV gets an offer he can't refuse from somewhere else.

What else am I missing?

I don't buy the BV brings in a different OC.  If Bill agrees to step down this year, it's because he's blessed the succession plan.  For him to bless the succession plan, everyone not retiring retains their jobs.  Otherwise, he stays.  He's not going to bless a plan where BV fires Dimel.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheHamburglar on November 08, 2016, 02:08:45 PM
Yep, dead on. Again I'll state if McCrane was out because of injury he clearly did not agree. And if he was unavailable I have no idea why the coaches allowed him to fully dress out, helmet and all.

My gut tells me he has an injury that allowed him to go thru pregame with Sean watching and Sean didn't feel like he was strong enough to play.  McCrane disagreed, then really disagreed after the missed XP.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 08, 2016, 02:46:25 PM
Kind of weird to cite Alex Barnes as our stud RB



Also:

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on November 08, 2016, 02:58:47 PM
fwiw, Jerry Kill was on the sidelines straight up saying he would have Barnes in at RB all the time if he were coach
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on November 08, 2016, 03:02:22 PM
I thought barnes looked much faster than I ever thought he'd be saturday, good sign.  He's clearly physical enough.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Gooch on November 08, 2016, 03:14:46 PM
fwiw, Jerry Kill was on the sidelines straight up saying he would have Barnes in at RB all the time if he were coach
Unfortunately he probably going to get to make that decision.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2016, 03:17:52 PM
I mean, Barnes is fine but he definitely isn't a standout among the top 4 RB's.

Is he?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WackyCat08 on November 08, 2016, 03:19:06 PM
Barnes has a way bigger body than I anticipated. I always think he's dimel taking the carry. Kind of exciting.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WackyCat08 on November 08, 2016, 03:20:03 PM
fwiw, Jerry Kill was on the sidelines straight up saying he would have Barnes in at RB all the time if he were coach
Also, Kill recruited him, so that makes sense.

https://n.rivals.com/content/prospects/maple/156892
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kim carnes on November 08, 2016, 03:38:28 PM
Allow me to help you guys out, all of our RBs suck
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on November 08, 2016, 04:03:13 PM
Allow me to help you guys out, all of our RBs suck

Calm down there, Chicken Little.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: delerioustyme on November 08, 2016, 09:48:37 PM
I mean, Barnes is fine but he definitely isn't a standout among the top 4 RB's.

Is he?

Barnes is our strongest, biggest, and fastest back we have.  Yes, I said fastest.  He is head and shoulders the best RB we have and he is only a redshirt freshman. 

I'm not sure, but has he had a negative play? 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 08, 2016, 09:49:17 PM
I mean, Barnes is fine but he definitely isn't a standout among the top 4 RB's.

Is he?

Barnes is our strongest, biggest, and fastest back we have.  Yes, I said fastest.  He is head and shoulders the best RB we have and he is only a redshirt freshman. 

I'm not sure, but has he had a negative play? 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!
Good to know!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pissclams on November 08, 2016, 10:23:36 PM
based upon data supplied by poster delerioustyme, it sounds like this barnes kid is a standout rb
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Skipper44 on November 08, 2016, 10:49:18 PM
But can he pick up a blitz so ertz can underthrow Pringle 25 yards down field
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2016, 11:20:35 AM
I mean, Barnes is fine but he definitely isn't a standout among the top 4 RB's.

Is he?

Barnes is our strongest, biggest, and fastest back we have.  Yes, I said fastest.  He is head and shoulders the best RB we have and he is only a redshirt freshman. 

I'm not sure, but has he had a negative play? 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!

Fastest? If he is it isn't by much. People get frustrated by Jones because he isn't a big play RB. I don't think Alex is either.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on November 09, 2016, 11:30:29 AM
I like rotating silmon/barnes and think of them as almost interchangeable warmack is a nice change of pace tho and I think he is our quickest and most shifty back.
CJ can come in on screen passes and blocking assignments
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pissclams on November 09, 2016, 12:05:21 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Skipper44 on November 09, 2016, 12:07:06 PM
how great would it be to see us run the ol' wishbone in Waco? 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 09, 2016, 12:24:14 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 09, 2016, 12:27:32 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.

This year and 2014 the #1 QB was very clear.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2016, 12:30:03 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.

That isn't true at all, we just haven't had a starting QB this board was willing to accept. Waters was absolutely, 100% our every down starting QB, both years, as is Ertz now. I guess you can say we didn't last year but the guy they named the started got hurt the first offensive play of the year.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SEK_EMAW on November 09, 2016, 12:30:41 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.

This year and 2014 the #1 QB was very clear.

And last year was pretty clear too, until injury, no?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2016, 12:31:42 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.

This year and 2014 the #1 QB was very clear.

In '13 Sams only played in Wildcat type plays and when Waters got hurt.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 09, 2016, 12:32:33 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.

This year and 2014 the #1 QB was very clear.

And last year was pretty clear too, until injury, no?

Yeah, it would have been.

MIR's point about 2013 is valid (Waters was pretty clear) but I still take Snyder's "Daniel should play more" comments that the staff was at least having some level of debate.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 09, 2016, 12:33:23 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.

This year and 2014 the #1 QB was very clear.

And last year was pretty clear too, until injury, no?

Hubener got pulled for lack of effectiveness more than once, including the bowl game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 09, 2016, 12:34:18 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.

This year and 2014 the #1 QB was very clear.

In '13 Sams only played in Wildcat type plays and when Waters got hurt.

or when Lockett was hurt
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: purrkatz on November 09, 2016, 01:22:59 PM
how great would it be to see us run the ol' wishbone in Waco?

Are you Brooks Barta!?!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pissclams on November 09, 2016, 01:28:27 PM
the coaches aren't worried about player attrition based upon lack of playing time so it's not like they're worried on that front

maybe they recognize that the talent gap isn't so large that playing player a and b and c isn't a risk to the team's success
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 09, 2016, 02:43:55 PM
I know injuries are a part of football, but our quarterbacks being ground into dust as part of our gameplan/playcalling qualifies as terrible longterm decision making on the part of our coaches.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on November 09, 2016, 02:46:18 PM
why can't snyder's coaching staff solidify playing time at the offensive skill positions

arguing who our best back of our top 4 backs is after 9 games is hilario

We haven't had one true starting quarterback for an entire season since Colleien Klein left in 2012. Think about that.

This year and 2014 the #1 QB was very clear.

And last year was pretty clear too, until injury, no?

Hubener got pulled for lack of effectiveness more than once, including the bowl game.
Think he was saying Ertz was the clear #1 last year before going down
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 09, 2016, 03:14:27 PM
I know injuries are a part of football, but our quarterbacks being ground into dust as part of our gameplan/playcalling qualifies as terrible longterm decision making on the part of our coaches.

I put this in another thread but it fits here and I firmly believe it. Maybe not 30 carries, but Ertz still needs to be a big part of our offense. QB run game and option is a major part of what makes this offense go; 10-12 option runs and 8-10 QB power/leads is a must.

I agree that there are ways to reduce Ertz's carries, but the threat of QB run game (especially read option which he seems very good at) is a reason why some of the RB runs are so effective. Also, I've been very impressed with Ertz's ability to make people miss and his burst. He's not especially fast, but he's a very effective runner, shoulder injury or no. Its not like a QB with a shoulder injury is some new development with a Snyder QB.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Whale on November 09, 2016, 09:51:20 PM
Connecting on the occasional home run play would reduce the need for him to run it 30 times a game.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: delerioustyme on November 10, 2016, 12:27:58 AM
I mean, Barnes is fine but he definitely isn't a standout among the top 4 RB's.

Is he?

Barnes is our strongest, biggest, and fastest back we have.  Yes, I said fastest.  He is head and shoulders the best RB we have and he is only a redshirt freshman. 

I'm not sure, but has he had a negative play? 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!

Fastest? If he is it isn't by much. People get frustrated by Jones because he isn't a big play RB. I don't think Alex is either.

Yes, fastest and strongest.  People get frustrated with Jones because he is slow, dances and moves laterally too much.  Barnes has not lost a single yard all year.  He has good vision, runs down hill and runs over defenders.   Over 7 yards a carry is absolutely ridiculous. 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: POWL on November 10, 2016, 10:22:01 AM
Connecting on the occasional home run play would reduce the need for him to run it 30 times a game.

Sent from my SM-G900T using Tapatalk

Ertz's arm is currently barely above KSU Cat Grant Gregory.    :dubious:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2016, 12:26:05 PM
I mean, Barnes is fine but he definitely isn't a standout among the top 4 RB's.

Is he?

Barnes is our strongest, biggest, and fastest back we have.  Yes, I said fastest.  He is head and shoulders the best RB we have and he is only a redshirt freshman. 

I'm not sure, but has he had a negative play? 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!

Fastest? If he is it isn't by much. People get frustrated by Jones because he isn't a big play RB. I don't think Alex is either.

Yes, fastest and strongest.  People get frustrated with Jones because he is slow, dances and moves laterally too much.  Barnes has not lost a single yard all year.  He has good vision, runs down hill and runs over defenders.   Over 7 yards a carry is absolutely ridiculous. 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!

I like Alex, he was great to my kids last week BTW, but these stats as a comparison is ridiculous. Jones has 98 carries, Barnes has 27. I'm pretty comfortable saying that if Barnes had 98 carries he wouldn't be averaging 7.8 ypc and would have a few rushes for loss.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ChiCat on November 10, 2016, 12:47:44 PM
If you have a back averaging 7.8 ypc, he isn't getting the ball enough.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on November 10, 2016, 01:24:56 PM
He should have more but he is a freshman.

i'd bet he gets a great workload down the stretch except for passing downs.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 10, 2016, 02:40:22 PM
If you have a back averaging 7.8 ypc, he isn't getting the ball enough.

Oh I agree, just taking exception to the comparison
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: delerioustyme on November 10, 2016, 05:50:18 PM
If you have a back averaging 7.8 ypc, he isn't getting the ball enough.

Oh I agree, just taking exception to the comparison

I understand that he has less carries, but the fact that he doesn't have a negative play yet is pretty amazing and I am certain that Jones wasn't averaging anywhere near 7 ypc after his first 27 or any string of 27 carries within his 98. 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: delerioustyme on November 10, 2016, 06:20:08 PM
And here is another couple of stats on Barnes.  Not only does he have yet to have a negative play, but he has yet to gain less than 2 yards on a run.  Of his 27 carries, all but 7 of them were 5 yards or more.  20 out of 27 rushes are 5 yards or more.  He is averaging 7.8 ypc.  Jones averaged 10 last game going 7-70 with half of that coming off of one run of 35. 


Damn!  He trippin' so hard fans are gonna think he done fell off!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 17, 2017, 10:02:09 PM
Time to fire this badboy back up. Here are just a few from the Vandy game:


----In the 3rd quarter of a closely contested, extremely low-scoring game in which we were struggling to move the ball, we finally put together a good drive and get well into field goal range. It's 3rd and 11 (I think), we're on the right hash, and we decide to run a shovel pass that moves a few yards forward and not close to a first down. Field goal time.

...Oh crap, on that 3rd down we accidentally ran a play that didn't even come close to going to the strong side of the field to center the ball (or even put it on the left hash) for our right-footed kicker! Oh well, right footed kicker, right hash, weird angle...what could go wrong? Oh damn, we missed the field goal by a foot. To the right. HEY MORONS, HOW ABOUT ON THIRD DOWN YOU CALL A PLAY ON THAT GOES TO THE SIDE OF THE FIELD THAT, IF IT FAILS, WILL AT LEAST SORT OF CENTER THE BALL FOR OUR RIGHT-FOOTED FIELD GOAL KICKER? (or put it on the left hash, which is significantly easier for a right-footed kicker than kicking from the right hash?)


----Every single time we ran an option, it went for 14 or more yards. We ran it twice all game. Probably should throw long bombs instead. On a night where either our quarterback can't see/hit an open man, or, when he does, they can't catch it.

----SOOOOO many plays were called (in the first half especially) where Ertz had to throw all the way across the field to try to pick up like three rough ridin' yards. See previous point about accuracy/catching.

----I know our idiot coaches are notorious for never knowing how to ride the hot hand, but Jesus Christ. How obvious was it that Justin Silmon should've carried more in that second half? Nah, nah, it's cool, we should just keep trying to have Jesse Ertz try the repeated Collin Klein battering ram offense instead, even though that isn't working.

Dimel is an idiot and I'm like TCU 2015 levels of pissed off after this one.



Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 17, 2017, 10:18:38 PM
Oh, and our clock management at the end of the game was completely laughable. Zero urgency, which I put on the coaches, and a couple times when we either should've called time out but didn't, or called time out after letting a bunch of time run off the clock.

No idea because I was at the game...did our coaches even notice/raise a stink to the refs when, around 2:40 left in the 4Q, a play went out of bounds and they still ran :20 off the clock before the next snap? Probably not because they are all olds.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheHamburglar on September 17, 2017, 10:35:07 PM
Oh, and our clock management at the end of the game was completely laughable. Zero urgency, which I put on the coaches, and a couple times when we either should've called time out but didn't, or called time out after letting a bunch of time run off the clock.

No idea because I was at the game...did our coaches even notice/raise a stink to the refs when, around 2:40 left in the 4Q, a play went out of bounds and they still ran :20 off the clock before the next snap? Probably not because they are all olds.

Clock starts back up after spotting after going out of bounds when it's not under 2 minutes in a half.  Same timing rules as a first down.  They changes that rule before the 2011 season.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 18, 2017, 06:43:12 AM
Ahh. Well that's probably what it was then. Dunno how I missed that, but :clac:

Still horrendous clock management at the end, though.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 18, 2017, 06:50:13 AM
They stopped us with a minute left inside the 15. There was plenty of time, we were clearly playing for the tie and overtime.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: mocat on September 18, 2017, 06:53:36 AM
Oh, and our clock management at the end of the game was completely laughable. Zero urgency, which I put on the coaches, and a couple times when we either should've called time out but didn't, or called time out after letting a bunch of time run off the clock.

No idea because I was at the game...did our coaches even notice/raise a stink to the refs when, around 2:40 left in the 4Q, a play went out of bounds and they still ran :20 off the clock before the next snap? Probably not because they are all olds.

Clock starts back up after spotting after going out of bounds when it's not under 2 minutes in a half.  Same timing rules as a first down.  They changes that rule before the 2011 season.
That is a dog crap rule
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on September 18, 2017, 07:02:56 AM
Naw it's good
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Spracne on September 18, 2017, 10:01:11 AM
Oh, and our clock management at the end of the game was completely laughable. Zero urgency, which I put on the coaches, and a couple times when we either should've called time out but didn't, or called time out after letting a bunch of time run off the clock.

No idea because I was at the game...did our coaches even notice/raise a stink to the refs when, around 2:40 left in the 4Q, a play went out of bounds and they still ran :20 off the clock before the next snap? Probably not because they are all olds.

Clock starts back up after spotting after going out of bounds when it's not under 2 minutes in a half.  Same timing rules as a first down.  They changes that rule before the 2011 season.
That is a dog crap rule

And did anyone notice that they forgot to call the two-minute warning! Incredible!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 18, 2017, 11:28:44 AM
Oh, and our clock management at the end of the game was completely laughable. Zero urgency, which I put on the coaches, and a couple times when we either should've called time out but didn't, or called time out after letting a bunch of time run off the clock.

No idea because I was at the game...did our coaches even notice/raise a stink to the refs when, around 2:40 left in the 4Q, a play went out of bounds and they still ran :20 off the clock before the next snap? Probably not because they are all olds.

Clock starts back up after spotting after going out of bounds when it's not under 2 minutes in a half.  Same timing rules as a first down.  They changes that rule before the 2011 season.
That is a dog crap rule

And did anyone notice that they forgot to call the two-minute warning! Incredible!

:D buds :cheers:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on September 18, 2017, 11:29:31 AM
Oh, and our clock management at the end of the game was completely laughable. Zero urgency, which I put on the coaches, and a couple times when we either should've called time out but didn't, or called time out after letting a bunch of time run off the clock.

No idea because I was at the game...did our coaches even notice/raise a stink to the refs when, around 2:40 left in the 4Q, a play went out of bounds and they still ran :20 off the clock before the next snap? Probably not because they are all olds.

Clock starts back up after spotting after going out of bounds when it's not under 2 minutes in a half.  Same timing rules as a first down.  They changes that rule before the 2011 season.
That is a dog crap rule

It was a rule constituted for TV. In the mid to late aughts, when spread offenses were really starting to take hold, games were taking 4+ hours and it was creating a real problem for TV. I remember a couple of times back then where the 2:30 ABC kickoff would last until or past the 7:00 kickoff.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 18, 2017, 11:31:02 AM
I guess that makes sense. But hey guys, how about our terrible playcalling tho, 'specially on that third and 11 before the field goal    :sdeek:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: troubledscribe on September 18, 2017, 11:46:46 AM
I guess that makes sense. But hey guys, how about our terrible playcalling tho, 'specially on that third and 11 before the field goal    :sdeek:

Our offensive play calling was the worst. Everyone knew everytime  Ertz was going to run in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 18, 2017, 11:52:25 AM
Play calls always suck when they don't work.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 18, 2017, 12:32:38 PM
Even if our 3rd and 11 had gained the same yardage as the terrible play call (so, like, no real yardage to speak of) but had at least centered the ball a little bit, it would've been a better play call because we would've walked away with 3 points. McCrane, our right footed kicker, missed that kick from the right hash by under two feet...to the right.


And I get the "play calls always suck when they don't work" thing if you're saying it as kind of a sarcastic thing. Nobody likes an armchair quarterback, and no coach can be expected to call plays that gain yardage every time. However, after the 15th time in like 16 plays that Ertz is stuffed trying to sneak it through the line, or after the 14th time in like 14 plays that we call and execute a pass play like a bunch of boneheads, it's pretty obvious that the playcalling sucks. The Vandy fans around us were LOLing at our offense because it was so completely predictable.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pissclams on September 18, 2017, 12:47:37 PM
i like armchair quarterbacks
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on September 18, 2017, 12:53:07 PM
I like that we busted out the pitch option and it ran all over their faces each time and then we got a late hit on one and never ran it again even tho it was getting like 12+ yards each time
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 18, 2017, 01:01:29 PM
I agree with many of the concerns, namely continuing to run Ertz after Vandy started putting 7 in the box and not going back to speed option after it was successful for big plays a couple of times. Of course, the successful plays to Silmon were power/counter trey, which Vandy absolutely destroyed in the first half.

And I think some of the issues go back to the drops. Not only do the drops throw the offense off or rhythm and end drives, they factor into play calling, ie. I don't think the coaches start thinking "we can't continue to throw because our guys can't throw" but rather "we have guys open, we must continue to throw" and it didn't work. Also, credit Vandy with adjusting well against our checks, which goes back to the predictable part. Our counters or fake checks didn't outweigh theirs IMO, which demonstrates good coaching and execution on Vandy's part as much as stupidity on ours IMO.

Again, I don't think this was one of Dimel's better games, but I also don't think he's an idiot.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 18, 2017, 01:20:14 PM
I thought it was easily one of Dimel's worst games. His offense mustered 7 points. Against Vanderbilt. We were completely outcoached.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 18, 2017, 01:27:35 PM
I thought it was easily one of Dimel's worst games. His offense mustered 7 points. Against Vanderbilt. We were completely outcoached.

I can't disagree with any of that.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheHamburglar on September 18, 2017, 01:32:56 PM
Again, I don't think this was one of Dimel's better games, but I also don't think he's an idiot.

He's not an idiot.  He thinks very highly of himself & his system.  8 or 9 times a year it works.  Once or twice a year he goes up against something that for some reason it doesn't work.  Rather than adapt, he keeps calling the plays the defense dictates, regardless of situation or personnel, like the 2nd half of 2015 TCU or 2016 WVU.  When you see it happening again, it's very frustrating.  For me, it's more frustrating that he tells Kellis we have a top 5 run scheme because of the options & angles it creates, but he abandons it if the defense dictates pass and puts it all on his QBs shoulders, even if his QB is obviously shaken by what's happening.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 18, 2017, 01:54:35 PM
Yep. His biggest issue has always been over thinking which leads to exactly what you are saying.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on September 18, 2017, 02:50:40 PM
it is so damn frustrating. none of these are new but here we go:

1.play clock ALWAYS gets below 5. this allows for the crowd to build noise/excitement, and removes any element of surprise as to when the ball is going to be snapped. we use the same damn cadence every play:

"set GO!"
*look to sideline*
*change play if needed*
3....2.....1....
*clap*
*snap ball*

2.do we have shallow crossing routes in our offense?

3.did we forget what a screen is? (it looked like we were trying a quincy morgan tunnel screen when ertz threw his first pick)

4.how many times did we give the ball to our running backs on something other than a zone read?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Dr Rick Daris on September 18, 2017, 03:51:42 PM
I really wanted more option in the 4th quarter.  :frown:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on September 18, 2017, 03:54:18 PM
Again, I don't think this was one of Dimel's better games, but I also don't think he's an idiot.

He's not an idiot.  He thinks very highly of himself & his system.  8 or 9 times a year it works.  Once or twice a year he goes up against something that for some reason it doesn't work.  Rather than adapt, he keeps calling the plays the defense dictates, regardless of situation or personnel, like the 2nd half of 2015 TCU or 2016 WVU.  When you see it happening again, it's very frustrating.  For me, it's more frustrating that he tells Kellis we have a top 5 run scheme because of the options & angles it creates, but he abandons it if the defense dictates pass and puts it all on his QBs shoulders, even if his QB is obviously shaken by what's happening.
I actually think he doesn't believe in the system as much as he should. I think he gave up on imagination to rely on Ertz left, Ertz right.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on September 18, 2017, 04:39:15 PM
I quit watching after the 4th quarter but it's pretty crazy we only gave up 14 points
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: troubledscribe on September 18, 2017, 05:02:41 PM
I agree with many of the concerns, namely continuing to run Ertz after Vandy started putting 7 in the box and not going back to speed option after it was successful for big plays a couple of times. Of course, the successful plays to Silmon were power/counter trey, which Vandy absolutely destroyed in the first half.

And I think some of the issues go back to the drops. Not only do the drops throw the offense off or rhythm and end drives, they factor into play calling, ie. I don't think the coaches start thinking "we can't continue to throw because our guys can't throw" but rather "we have guys open, we must continue to throw" and it didn't work. Also, credit Vandy with adjusting well against our checks, which goes back to the predictable part. Our counters or fake checks didn't outweigh theirs IMO, which demonstrates good coaching and execution on Vandy's part as much as stupidity on ours IMO.

Again, I don't think this was one of Dimel's better games, but I also don't think he's an idiot.

He is an idoit. A monkey can dial up more than four plays and put in Warmack for a different look/WR option out of the backfield. Guy makes huge dollars to crap his pants in big game situations.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 18, 2017, 05:06:38 PM
I quit watching after the 4th quarter but it's pretty crazy we only gave up 14 points

I know. Our D had to be so pissed after the game at our pathetic offensive output.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on September 18, 2017, 05:26:46 PM
WHOOPS I QUIT WATCHING AFTER THE FIRST
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on September 18, 2017, 05:53:44 PM
smdh
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on September 18, 2017, 07:20:10 PM
too cool for school
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: mocat on September 19, 2017, 11:51:05 AM
game was probably on too late in the morning for mich
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Dlew12 on September 19, 2017, 08:31:33 PM
Our backs carried the ball 11 times for 75 yards.  6.8 YPC. 

But by all means, let Jesse keep chucking. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on September 19, 2017, 08:36:36 PM
i'm gonna start punctuating his name dimeL because he is a gigantic loser
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on September 19, 2017, 09:27:29 PM
Our backs carried the ball 11 times for 75 yards.  6.8 YPC. 

that stat surprised me so much i had to look it up to confirm. 7 of Barnes' carries went for 17 total yards, but overall it was still a good average.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Dlew12 on September 19, 2017, 11:43:37 PM
Our backs carried the ball 11 times for 75 yards.  6.8 YPC. 

that stat surprised me so much i had to look it up to confirm. 7 of Barnes' carries went for 17 total yards, but overall it was still a good average.
Another surprising stat: 18 of Ertz's pass attempts went for 0 yards.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on September 20, 2017, 10:56:02 AM
The only play I enjoyed at all was when the line pushed the pile for an extra like 15 yds or w/e.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on September 20, 2017, 11:15:35 AM
game was probably on too late in the morning for mich
I went to dinner before the Jason Isbell show! Someone gave me a hit of too-strong marijuana  and Isbell made me cry.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Clevey No Mo on September 20, 2017, 12:33:45 PM
Jason Isbell, too strong marijuana, and tears. That sounds about right. I think pussies like Alex Smith have it on their pregame playlist, minus the too strong marijuana.

As for the game:

1 - We were out-coached, that is obvious. The coaching is a constant, at least within any season for the most part. Although I would've liked to see more of a short passing game, slants, etc. Playcalling can be tweaked as most of you are saying.

2 - Dropped passes. If I am blaming one thing on this loss, an incredibly stupid exercise that I'll participate in because messsage boards, it has to be the dropped balls. We had no rhythm. A lack of it will eff with any QB, but Ertz, to me, seems particularly affected by it. I don't seem to recall Roberson or Klein or Bishop or Waters (there are probably more)  being as impacted by it. Maybe turning Ertz into Klein battering ram part 2 is what mumped with him in Nashville though. Plus Vandy was pretty physical.

3 - The Vandy defense looked pretty good to me. Could see them lose many 13-10 SEC slug fests because their offense was pretty shitty.

4 - Our defense is one of the top 3 in the conference. If we can solve some of these offensive issues, even just a little, I still maintain we lose no more than 2 games in conference.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 20, 2017, 12:40:25 PM
Jason Isbell, too strong marijuana, and tears. That sounds about right. I think pussies like Alex Smith have it on their pregame playlist, minus the too strong marijuana.

As for the game:

1 - We were out-coached, that is obvious. The coaching is a constant, at least within any season for the most part. Although I would've liked to see more of a short passing game, slants, etc. Playcalling can be tweaked as most of you are saying.

2 - Dropped passes. If I am blaming one thing on this loss, an incredibly stupid exercise that I'll participate in because messsage boards, it has to be the dropped balls. We had no rhythm. A lack of it will eff with any QB, but Ertz, to me, seems particularly affected by it. I don't seem to recall Roberson or Klein or Bishop or Waters (there are probably more)  being as impacted by it. Maybe turning Ertz into Klein battering ram part 2 is what mumped with him in Nashville though. Plus Vandy was pretty physical.

3 - The Vandy defense looked pretty good to me. Could see them lose many 13-10 SEC slug fests because their offense was pretty shitty.

4 - Our defense is one of the top 3 in the conference. If we can solve some of these offensive issues, even just a little, I still maintain we lose no more than 2 games in conference.

Good stuff, and I agree with all of that.

When I look at the Vandy defense the biggest issue I see is that it might be more suited for the Big 12. Mason has a nice collection of athletic defenders and they do a great job of changing their fronts. As the game went a long Mason was able to add a player or a player "and a half" to the box, which took away QB run. We were able to still get some creases with off tackle power and speed option, but clearly our coaches thought the best counter to the stacked box was throwing and it didn't work. Snyder's comments about the issues in the passing game and being fairly happy with the running game would indicate the staff's post game break down was more disappointed in passing game execution than anything. That said, the success we eventually had with a few power run plays to the RB despite Vandy's stacked box doesn't bode well for the SEC. They are going to see many more offenses with big olines and downhill running attacks that will exploit their lack of size in the front 7. Bama will lean on them up front and likely be able to run through that defense and other SEC offenses will try to that as well.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 20, 2017, 12:55:49 PM
Also, the success Ertz and the passing game had in the first two games (especially game 1) may have built a bit of a sense of false confidence in our ability to beat a stacked box with the passing game. Last year we didn't trust the passing game and were forced to get creative in the running game. Down the stretch we ran on people no matter how many they put in the box. But alas, Dimel (with Snyder's advice) is always seeking to be "balanced" and they probably believe (or believed) to be an elite team this year they had to be able to throw as a counter to a stacked box. So instead of trusting the run and sticking with it after success runs from Silmon and a couple big play speed option runs, they went back to throwing The insistence on balance and being able to throw eventually cost them with the 2 TOs and only 7 points.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Clevey No Mo on September 20, 2017, 03:26:35 PM
Also, the success Ertz and the passing game had in the first two games (especially game 1) may have built a bit of a sense of false confidence in our ability to beat a stacked box with the passing game. Last year we didn't trust the passing game and were forced to get creative in the running game. Down the stretch we ran on people no matter how many they put in the box. But alas, Dimel (with Snyder's advice) is always seeking to be "balanced" and they probably believe (or believed) to be an elite team this year they had to be able to throw as a counter to a stacked box. So instead of trusting the run and sticking with it after success runs from Silmon and a couple big play speed option runs, they went back to throwing The insistence on balance and being able to throw eventually cost them with the 2 TOs and only 7 points.

There were some pretty terrible passes by Ertz, but if we catch those that were dropped it may just open it up enough for us to win that game by a FG or something. I mean it was a poor overall performance by the offense, but we were the better team, and this was one of those games that better teams sometimes lose to inferior opponents on the road -- 2 TDs called back, Ertz seemingly throwing balls over heads at times, receivers dropping balls. I don't see any of these as problems that will be consistently bad during the season. I don't recall off the top of my head, but I suspect some KSU teams that were very successful had games like this and maybe they pulled it out and won by a few points, so we don't think of them as disastrous, but they were very similar performances to what we saw at Vandy I suspect.

And on the SEC line point...this weekend we'll see the ultimate test for Vandy, but I still think, given the lack of passing ability from most SEC offenses, that Vandy holds their own on that side of the ball. Bama is an outlier that probably won't go well, but they can definitely play with every team in the SEC East. Maybe their offense will just be crap and they still only get to 7 wins, who knows.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on September 20, 2017, 03:29:43 PM
i did not feel like we were the better team on saturday, which has been the most depressing thing imo
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on September 20, 2017, 03:31:01 PM
Wait did that guy call me a pussy? :sdeek:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Clevey No Mo on September 20, 2017, 03:31:15 PM
i did not feel like we were the better team on saturday, which has been the most depressing thing imo

That would be a depressing feeling.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Clevey No Mo on September 20, 2017, 03:32:23 PM
Wait did that guy call me a pussy? :sdeek:

Not you personally, just the scene that you were a part of.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on September 20, 2017, 03:33:54 PM
:dubious:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: delerioustyme on September 20, 2017, 05:25:30 PM
2000 vs. OU, we had a ton of dropped passes that cost us the game.  OU went on to win the Natty that year. 


He trippin' so much, fans gonna begin to think he done fell off!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sonofdaxjones on September 20, 2017, 05:28:19 PM
It's okay clevey, call cRusty a pussy. 

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 20, 2017, 06:39:21 PM
i did not feel like we were the better team on saturday, which has been the most depressing thing imo

I felt we were much better. Honestly.

The points about 2 TDs called back and drops is enough. Vandy did not have nearly the same amount of missed opportunities and bad breaks. I was most impressed by Vandy's secondary, but that's it. I thought we were just as athletic and physical. The difference was the more disciplined team that eliminated mistakes won and it wasn't us. That's an outlier game for K-State football.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on September 20, 2017, 06:45:37 PM
Sounds familiar.  Like how opponents talked after losing to KSU.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 20, 2017, 06:55:49 PM
Yes. Until I see it regularly from opponents I won't expect it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on September 20, 2017, 08:06:45 PM
i did not feel like we were the better team on saturday, which has been the most depressing thing imo

I felt we were much better. Honestly.

The points about 2 TDs called back and drops is enough. Vandy did not have nearly the same amount of missed opportunities and bad breaks. I was most impressed by Vandy's secondary, but that's it. I thought we were just as athletic and physical. The difference was the more disciplined team that eliminated mistakes won and it wasn't us. That's an outlier game for K-State football.

100% agree
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on September 20, 2017, 08:25:18 PM
i did not feel like we were the better team on saturday, which has been the most depressing thing imo

I felt we were much better. Honestly.

The points about 2 TDs called back and drops is enough. Vandy did not have nearly the same amount of missed opportunities and bad breaks. I was most impressed by Vandy's secondary, but that's it. I thought we were just as athletic and physical. The difference was the more disciplined team that eliminated mistakes won and it wasn't us. That's an outlier game for K-State football.

Agree we were the better team. We left 17 points on the board and gave back about a hundred yards of offense to inconsequential penalties.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on September 20, 2017, 08:26:31 PM
Also, Vandy was better on special teams. Huge outlier.

Not an outlier, the big12 ref crew was an unmitigated disaster.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on September 20, 2017, 08:29:39 PM
Coaching eff up: running max protect passing playes against 4 man rushes. At least mix in a screen pass or draw play. So much WTF
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 20, 2017, 08:33:03 PM
I think our last screen was Ell to Sproles in the 03 Big 12 title game.

Dimel isn't and hasn't been a screen guy. I don't remember one since he's run the offense during 2.0.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on September 20, 2017, 09:05:35 PM
wasn't ertz' first INT (i think it was the first, the one where he threw left to pringle) a tunnel screen?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on September 20, 2017, 09:13:10 PM
I think our last screen was Ell to Sproles in the 03 Big 12 title game.

Dimel isn't and hasn't been a screen guy. I don't remember one since he's run the offense during 2.0.

I think enough time has passed that it would probably go for a very big play now.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on September 20, 2017, 09:16:07 PM
No, they were both down field throws. One was forced and tipped after flushing the pocket, the other was a poor throw on a slant.

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=20728153
http://es.pn/2jAgVMRhttp://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=20728153http://es.pn/2jAgVMR

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=20728238
http://es.pn/2jAEIvMhttp://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=20728238http://es.pn/2jAEIvM
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on September 20, 2017, 09:19:34 PM
yeah i guess that was just a slant. i hadn't seen a replay, but for some reason was watching pringle that entire play. his first three steps were very slow so it seemed like he was setting up for a screen.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on September 20, 2017, 10:37:31 PM
The second interception was so bad it looked like Ertz was shaving points. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on September 20, 2017, 10:40:30 PM
I think our last screen was Ell to Sproles in the 03 Big 12 title game.

Dimel isn't and hasn't been a screen guy. I don't remember one since he's run the offense during 2.0.

I think enough time has passed that it would probably go for a very big play now.

It's hard to mix in when you're required to run the qb into the line of scrimmage 50% of the downs
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: muqluk on September 21, 2017, 12:29:21 AM
The second interception was so bad it looked like Ertz was shaving points.

There's been more than a couple plays over the past few years that made me wonder similarly.  But I've been beat into submission (or at least into never specifically mentioning them again) on other boards - and besides, it's hard for me to imagine anyone would put enough down either way (for or against the cats) to make it worth while.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on September 21, 2017, 08:25:51 AM
List the plays unless you're too scared
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: muqluk on September 21, 2017, 08:45:23 AM
...unless you're too scared

There's a phrase I havn't had directed at me in over 35 years. Na, pass.  I'm sure if you think of as many as I can, just not necessarily the same plays.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on September 21, 2017, 08:51:48 AM
Muqluk, confirmed chicken smdh
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: muqluk on September 21, 2017, 09:13:11 AM
Muqluk, confirmed chicken smdh

(https://negromanosphere.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/ouch-that-hurt.jpg)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on September 21, 2017, 09:19:39 AM
More like muqsquawk bawk bawk
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: delerioustyme on September 22, 2017, 02:17:34 PM
If our passing plays didn’t take 10 seconds to develop, then we could possibly have a pretty potent passing game.


He trippin' so much, fans gonna begin to think he done fell off!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on September 22, 2017, 02:26:37 PM
going back through some old box scores, we lost to Louisiana Lafeyette 17-15. carson threw 30 passes the only td pass was from dt

wtf?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 0.42 on September 22, 2017, 02:56:03 PM
going back through some old box scores, we lost to Louisiana Lafeyette 17-15. carson threw 30 passes the only td pass was from dt

wtf?

ask ski-be for more details
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Skipper44 on September 22, 2017, 03:43:26 PM
going back through some old box scores, we lost to Louisiana Lafeyette 17-15. carson threw 30 passes the only td pass was from dt

wtf?
that was the first KSU football game on ESPN3 iirc and kept us from going a bowl game.  Just looked at the box score and 13 rushing attempts for CCQ is also a highlight
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 07, 2017, 10:00:40 PM
2nd Overtime vs. Texas. We've just committed 2 straight holding penalties and have 2nd and 23 from our own 38 or so.

Yep, better hand it off, run left, and get two yards.

HEY COOL, 3rd AND 21 A MILE FROM THE GOAL POSTS IN OVERTIME!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: bshea85 on October 07, 2017, 10:04:23 PM
I don't know of any specific examples.... but that penalty induced 2OT feels like they've been in that exact same spot many times.  And yes, they always call a stupid ass run for a few yards.  It always ends in a loss.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 07, 2017, 10:06:16 PM
I don't know of any specific examples.... but that penalty induced 2OT feels like they've been in that exact same spot many times.  And yes, they always call a stupid ass run for a few yards.  It always ends in a loss.

It's amazing that we can see this and they can't.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 07, 2017, 10:06:37 PM
Bringing Ertz back in to throw an int.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: goCats101 on October 07, 2017, 10:08:57 PM
Not going for two. Should've taken chance to end game instead of rely on our one-dimensional offense to put up points and our overmatched defense to stop them on next possession.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:09:48 PM
2nd Overtime vs. Texas. We've just committed 2 straight holding penalties and have 2nd and 23 from our own 38 or so.

Yep, better hand it off, run left, and get two yards.

HEY COOL, 3rd AND 21 A MILE FROM THE GOAL POSTS IN OVERTIME!

To be fair, neither of those were holding
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:14:11 PM
The only coach that goes for 2 there, is the coach of a 3-8 team
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:15:36 PM
The worst is not deciding whether we were going to try and score with 1:35 to go, or play for ot. So we dipfucked around and almost lost in regulation
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 07, 2017, 10:17:16 PM
Bringing Ertz back in to throw an int.

Bringing in Ertz was questionable, the INT was fine. You gotta throw that ball, best case scenario you win, worst you just punted.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 07, 2017, 10:19:17 PM
Bringing Ertz back in to throw an int.

Bringing in Ertz was questionable, the INT was fine. You gotta throw that ball, best case scenario you win, worst you just punted.
No. That 7 seconds a punt would have taken was very important. They just missed the field goal.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: PowercatPat on October 07, 2017, 10:19:21 PM
Not going for two. Should've taken chance to end game instead of rely on our one-dimensional offense to put up points and our overmatched defense to stop them on next possession.

This. When you’re on the road and your defense is getting shredded, you go for two 100% of the time. We were 3 yards away from ending the game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:19:44 PM
LOL, the INT was horrendous. We could have ran way more clock and put UT way further back. We'd have been better off taking a knee (or had a clue what our objective was on that drive to begin with)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 07, 2017, 10:21:02 PM
LOL, the INT was horrendous. We could have ran way more clock and put UT way further back. We'd have been better off taking a knee (or had a clue what our objective was on that drive to begin with)

They had a timeout FSD.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 07, 2017, 10:21:54 PM
The only coach that goes for 2 there, is the coach of a 3-8 team

You've got a team that has pretty consistently gotten 2-3 yards despite Texas knowing we are going to run.  You have a starting QB too banged up to play meaningful snaps in the 2nd half.  Going for two is absolutely the right call in that situation.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:22:16 PM
Not if we don't throw an int. That was the absolute worst putcome of that 3rd down play, fucktard
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:23:01 PM
The only coach that goes for 2 there, is the coach of a 3-8 team

You've got a team that has pretty consistently gotten 2-3 yards despite Texas knowing we are going to run.  You have a starting QB too banged up to play meaningful snaps in the 2nd half.  Going for two is absolutely the right call in that situation.


OK, coach beatty
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 07, 2017, 10:23:30 PM
Not if we don't throw an int. That was the absolute worst putcome of that 3rd down play, fucktard

Oh, okay FSD  :lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 07, 2017, 10:24:30 PM
The only coach that goes for 2 there, is the coach of a 3-8 team

You've got a team that has pretty consistently gotten 2-3 yards despite Texas knowing we are going to run.  You have a starting QB too banged up to play meaningful snaps in the 2nd half.  Going for two is absolutely the right call in that situation.


OK, coach beatty

I will take that, because, unlike us, BEATTY rough ridin' BEAT TEXAS.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:25:14 PM
Only in goEtard can someone str8 face say an INT was a good play. I mean, I don't even  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 07, 2017, 10:26:15 PM
Only in goEtard can someone str8 face say an INT was a good play. I mean, I don't even  :facepalm:

Wait, who the eff said that?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 07, 2017, 10:26:46 PM
The "should we have gone for two" argument is meaningless because it is so simple. If you go for two and it works, it was the right call. If you go for two and it doesn't work (Georgia Tech vs. Tennessee this year), then it wasn't the right call. Likewise, if you don't go for two, kick the PAT instead, and ultimately lose, then you should've gone for two. If you went for two and missed, you should've kicked the PAT.

Far too much hand-wringing goes on about the should we/shouldn't we have gone for two. The answer is way more obvious than people want to make it.


But yeah, to me I was far more infuriated when we got the ball back with a minute and a half left to go and had no rough ridin' clue whether we were trying to drive downfield and kick a game winner or run out the clock. It was embarrassing and super bushleague.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:28:21 PM
YES, and then cornbread threw a horrendous INT.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 07, 2017, 10:30:13 PM
The "should we have gone for two" argument is meaningless because it is so simple. If you go for two and it works, it was the right call. If you go for two and it doesn't work (Georgia Tech vs. Tennessee this year), then it wasn't the right call. Likewise, if you don't go for two, kick the PAT instead, and ultimately lose, then you should've gone for two. If you went for two and missed, you should've kicked the PAT.

Far too much hand-wringing goes on about the should we/shouldn't we have gone for two. The answer is way more obvious than people want to make it.

I get this point, and I was just jumping in that it made sense to go for 2.  I did not consider it a terrible coaching decision, so I guess not thread appropriate.  However, there were very compelling reasons to do it and I would not have been disappointed with the decision regardless of the outcome.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 07, 2017, 10:30:48 PM

But yeah, to me I was far more infuriated when we got the ball back with a minute and a half left to go and had no rough ridin' clue whether we were trying to drive downfield and kick a game winner or run out the clock. It was embarrassing and super bushleague.

It's was too cute. If you go back with Sisco there you better do something that Delton is incapable of and that didn't happen. They tried to trick UT instead of doing what what seemed to be working.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 07, 2017, 10:31:58 PM
This thread is too short
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 07, 2017, 10:33:21 PM
Our coaching staff is bordering on inept at times. I guess that's because our head coach just turned 78 years old today (not an exaggeration). :dunno:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 07, 2017, 10:35:30 PM
This thread is too short
Has anyone mentioned telegraphing the same blitz over and over and never checking out of it after ut changed their play?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 07, 2017, 10:36:19 PM
This thread is too short
Has anyone mentioned telegraphing the same blitz over and over and never checking out of it after ut changed their play?

I've mentioned it about a dozen times
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 07, 2017, 10:38:48 PM
This thread is too short
Has anyone mentioned telegraphing the same blitz over and over and never checking out of it after ut changed their play?

I've mentioned it about a dozen times
Good, thank you for doing that
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 07, 2017, 10:39:26 PM
This thread is too short
Has anyone mentioned telegraphing the same blitz over and over and never checking out of it after ut changed their play?

I'll wait for _FAN but I sure hope we were doing something different with the secondary on those, probably not tho.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 07, 2017, 11:09:37 PM
This thread is too short
Has anyone mentioned telegraphing the same blitz over and over and never checking out of it after ut changed their play?

I'll wait for _FAN but I sure hope we were doing something different with the secondary on those, probably not tho.

I would be more disappointed, but honestly it seemed like we were more successful whenever the freshman QB did try to change the play.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 07, 2017, 11:10:33 PM
LOL, the INT was horrendous. We could have ran way more clock and put UT way further back. We'd have been better off taking a knee (or had a clue what our objective was on that drive to begin with)

They had a timeout FSD.

the eff up was running on first down then calling time out.  If you are going to take a shot downfield, do it on first down.  If you connect, great, try to get in field goal range.   If you don't connect, run on second, even if they take a time out you can run again on third and virtually run the clock out before punting.  It was awful end of game management and almost cost us the game in regulation.  I was perfectly fine settling for OT, i was NOT fine with nearly not getting there.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on October 07, 2017, 11:20:26 PM
The "should we have gone for two" argument is meaningless because it is so simple. If you go for two and it works, it was the right call. If you go for two and it doesn't work (Georgia Tech vs. Tennessee this year), then it wasn't the right call. Likewise, if you don't go for two, kick the PAT instead, and ultimately lose, then you should've gone for two. If you went for two and missed, you should've kicked the PAT.

Far too much hand-wringing goes on about the should we/shouldn't we have gone for two. The answer is way more obvious than people want to make it.


But yeah, to me I was far more infuriated when we got the ball back with a minute and a half left to go and had no rough ridin' clue whether we were trying to drive downfield and kick a game winner or run out the clock. It was embarrassing and super bushleague.

The thing was, when Delton scored that TD in OT1, I had absolutely zero confidence on our defense and the defensive coaches to even muster up a stop, and that K-State had the momentum on that drive, I would have gone for two.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: scottwildcat on October 07, 2017, 11:25:20 PM
Defensive players are saying in their interviews that they had no idea the UT freshman QB could scramble weren’t expecting the QB run game. This shows how grossly unprepared the staff and team was.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 07, 2017, 11:30:51 PM
K-State is usually the team that makes fewer mistakes and beats teams they should because of that. This year that doesn't seem to be the case.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: bones129 on October 07, 2017, 11:32:50 PM
Defensive players are saying in their interviews that they had no idea the UT freshman QB could scramble weren’t expecting the QB run game. This shows how grossly unprepared the staff and team was.

True. It wasn't like he hadn't played before this game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 07, 2017, 11:35:05 PM
The "should we have gone for two" argument is meaningless because it is so simple. If you go for two and it works, it was the right call. If you go for two and it doesn't work (Georgia Tech vs. Tennessee this year), then it wasn't the right call. Likewise, if you don't go for two, kick the PAT instead, and ultimately lose, then you should've gone for two. If you went for two and missed, you should've kicked the PAT.

Far too much hand-wringing goes on about the should we/shouldn't we have gone for two. The answer is way more obvious than people want to make it.


But yeah, to me I was far more infuriated when we got the ball back with a minute and a half left to go and had no rough ridin' clue whether we were trying to drive downfield and kick a game winner or run out the clock. It was embarrassing and super bushleague.

The thing was, when Delton scored that TD in OT1, I had absolutely zero confidence on our defense and the defensive coaches to even muster up a stop, and that K-State had the momentum on that drive, I would have gone for two.

That's really stupid, the defense allowed 6 second half points.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on October 07, 2017, 11:40:03 PM
The "should we have gone for two" argument is meaningless because it is so simple. If you go for two and it works, it was the right call. If you go for two and it doesn't work (Georgia Tech vs. Tennessee this year), then it wasn't the right call. Likewise, if you don't go for two, kick the PAT instead, and ultimately lose, then you should've gone for two. If you went for two and missed, you should've kicked the PAT.

Far too much hand-wringing goes on about the should we/shouldn't we have gone for two. The answer is way more obvious than people want to make it.


But yeah, to me I was far more infuriated when we got the ball back with a minute and a half left to go and had no rough ridin' clue whether we were trying to drive downfield and kick a game winner or run out the clock. It was embarrassing and super bushleague.

The thing was, when Delton scored that TD in OT1, I had absolutely zero confidence on our defense and the defensive coaches to even muster up a stop, and that K-State had the momentum on that drive, I would have gone for two.

That's really stupid, the defense allowed 6 second half points.

Nobody's talking about the second half.  We're specifically talking about OT.  And on top of that, on the very first play, in overtime, a blown coverage netted Texas a TD.  When that happened, I had no confidence at all that our defense was going to hold them off.

The 2nd OT proved it.  They were gassed and was completely dominated.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 07, 2017, 11:42:57 PM
The "should we have gone for two" argument is meaningless because it is so simple. If you go for two and it works, it was the right call. If you go for two and it doesn't work (Georgia Tech vs. Tennessee this year), then it wasn't the right call. Likewise, if you don't go for two, kick the PAT instead, and ultimately lose, then you should've gone for two. If you went for two and missed, you should've kicked the PAT.

Far too much hand-wringing goes on about the should we/shouldn't we have gone for two. The answer is way more obvious than people want to make it.


But yeah, to me I was far more infuriated when we got the ball back with a minute and a half left to go and had no rough ridin' clue whether we were trying to drive downfield and kick a game winner or run out the clock. It was embarrassing and super bushleague.

The thing was, when Delton scored that TD in OT1, I had absolutely zero confidence on our defense and the defensive coaches to even muster up a stop, and that K-State had the momentum on that drive, I would have gone for two.

That's really stupid, the defense allowed 6 second half points.

It's not stupid, it was what basically everyone was thinking. The defense played well, but the 6 second half points stat is thanks to Texas uncharacteristically missing two other field goals on 2nd half drives. Also, they had ALL the momentum at that point in the game. I know you're gonna do your I'm-MIR-I'm-Super-Blowhardy-And-Stubborn thing where you just argue and argue and argue until the other people just get tired of it and tap out, but having zero confidence in our defensive coaches/defense to muster a stop was actually the right thing to be feeling. Know why? Because that's exactly what happened. In case you missed it, Texas scored a touchdown on their first play in the first overtime, and then again in the second overtime to win. Proof is in the puddin.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 07, 2017, 11:43:29 PM
The "should we have gone for two" argument is meaningless because it is so simple. If you go for two and it works, it was the right call. If you go for two and it doesn't work (Georgia Tech vs. Tennessee this year), then it wasn't the right call. Likewise, if you don't go for two, kick the PAT instead, and ultimately lose, then you should've gone for two. If you went for two and missed, you should've kicked the PAT.

Far too much hand-wringing goes on about the should we/shouldn't we have gone for two. The answer is way more obvious than people want to make it.


But yeah, to me I was far more infuriated when we got the ball back with a minute and a half left to go and had no rough ridin' clue whether we were trying to drive downfield and kick a game winner or run out the clock. It was embarrassing and super bushleague.

The thing was, when Delton scored that TD in OT1, I had absolutely zero confidence on our defense and the defensive coaches to even muster up a stop, and that K-State had the momentum on that drive, I would have gone for two.

That's really stupid, the defense allowed 6 second half points.

this isn't as cut and dried as some are making it out to be.  i was confident in our chances in OT because our kicker was far superior to theirs.  However, going to the 2nd OT, we had the ball first, a significant disadvantage, AND i thought we had the UT d on their heels during that OT1 drive and liked our chances of getting 2 yards to win it.  it merited consideration.  i was ok with the decision but would have also been ok going for it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: delerioustyme on October 07, 2017, 11:58:16 PM
We couldn’t stop their offense.  Our best Defense was them missing FGs and getting penalties. 

Our offense was once again, a Dimel crap show.  Running sweeps and options to the short side of the field, 3 WR’s running to the same spot on the field, and his son either missing blocks or getting called for holding.  And he finally runs a play action on 3rd and long with the clock under a minute?  Ef me if Dimel isn’t the dumbest OC of all time.  It’s almost like we are dating him to screw it up worse than the last time. 


He trippin' so much, fans gonna begin to think he done fell off!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 08, 2017, 12:00:32 AM
I think statistically we had a much better win percentage to go for 2 in OT1.  The more i think about it the more i think it was the right call.  I think we had a 60-65% chance to win in OT1 given we got the ball last.  I think that dropped to 50-55% in OT2 because we got the ball first (still favored based on our superior kicker).  I think there was at least a 65-70% chance we get the 2 yards to win.  Maybe higher if we had a specific play just for the situation.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 08, 2017, 12:24:04 AM
The "should we have gone for two" argument is meaningless because it is so simple. If you go for two and it works, it was the right call. If you go for two and it doesn't work (Georgia Tech vs. Tennessee this year), then it wasn't the right call. Likewise, if you don't go for two, kick the PAT instead, and ultimately lose, then you should've gone for two. If you went for two and missed, you should've kicked the PAT.

Far too much hand-wringing goes on about the should we/shouldn't we have gone for two. The answer is way more obvious than people want to make it.


But yeah, to me I was far more infuriated when we got the ball back with a minute and a half left to go and had no rough ridin' clue whether we were trying to drive downfield and kick a game winner or run out the clock. It was embarrassing and super bushleague.

The thing was, when Delton scored that TD in OT1, I had absolutely zero confidence on our defense and the defensive coaches to even muster up a stop, and that K-State had the momentum on that drive, I would have gone for two.

That's really stupid, the defense allowed 6 second half points.

It's not stupid, it was what basically everyone was thinking. The defense played well, but the 6 second half points stat is thanks to Texas uncharacteristically missing two other field goals on 2nd half drives. Also, they had ALL the momentum at that point in the game. I know you're gonna do your I'm-MIR-I'm-Super-Blowhardy-And-Stubborn thing where you just argue and argue and argue until the other people just get tired of it and tap out, but having zero confidence in our defensive coaches/defense to muster a stop was actually the right thing to be feeling. Know why? Because that's exactly what happened. In case you missed it, Texas scored a touchdown on their first play in the first overtime, and then again in the second overtime to win. Proof is in the puddin.

What the hell does this mean, should I not have a differing opinion? It's a discussion board, stop being weird.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 08, 2017, 12:29:12 AM
Nah, you can have a differing opinion, just don't be such a blowhardy know-it-all, especially when like 20 people give you counter-examples. it's kinda your thing, you don't have to pretend like you don't know it's happening. own it :dunno:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 08, 2017, 10:22:15 AM
K-State is usually the team that makes fewer mistakes and beats teams they should because of that. This year that doesn't seem to be the case.
and not many of them are forced, the coaches fail these players weekly but running bullshit over and over
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: EMAWzifried on October 08, 2017, 11:48:52 AM
The third-and-one when we went into the four-and-one formation. eff it. Bring Delton in.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 08, 2017, 01:31:44 PM
The third-and-one when we went into the four-and-one formation. eff it. Bring Delton in.

IIRC, this play resulted in one of the several phantom holding calls.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 08, 2017, 02:35:23 PM
The third-and-one when we went into the four-and-one formation. eff it. Bring Delton in.

IIRC, this play resulted in one of the several phantom holding calls.

I think you're right....both of the calls on Dimel were horrible.  The ones on Beacham...not so much.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: stunted on October 08, 2017, 06:26:21 PM
i think if bill were given 2 options:

1) have a 55% chance of victory and play to the end of the 4th quarter
2) make a decision with a 60% chance of victory in the 1st quarter, but if it fails, game is over

bill would choose option 1
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 08, 2017, 08:39:29 PM
i think if bill were given 2 options:

1) have a 55% chance of victory and play to the end of the 4th quarter
2) make a decision with a 60% chance of victory in the 1st quarter, but if it fails, game is over

bill would choose option 1


super normal hypothetical, stunted
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on October 09, 2017, 09:29:33 AM
I think statistically we had a much better win percentage to go for 2 in OT1.  The more i think about it the more i think it was the right call.  I think we had a 60-65% chance to win in OT1 given we got the ball last.  I think that dropped to 50-55% in OT2 because we got the ball first (still favored based on our superior kicker).  I think there was at least a 65-70% chance we get the 2 yards to win.  Maybe higher if we had a specific play just for the situation.

Do you really think a team that doesn't have a 2 minute offense has a play for that situation?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 09, 2017, 09:49:22 AM
I think statistically we had a much better win percentage to go for 2 in OT1.  The more i think about it the more i think it was the right call.  I think we had a 60-65% chance to win in OT1 given we got the ball last.  I think that dropped to 50-55% in OT2 because we got the ball first (still favored based on our superior kicker).  I think there was at least a 65-70% chance we get the 2 yards to win.  Maybe higher if we had a specific play just for the situation.

Do you really think a team that doesn't have a 2 minute offense has a play for that situation?
yes, short side option
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 09, 2017, 09:51:04 AM
 :lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 09, 2017, 09:54:37 AM
I mean, I think that's why we go for 2. Our playbook is pretty much built on 2-3 yard runs that everyone knows are coming.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 09, 2017, 01:21:56 PM
I think statistically we had a much better win percentage to go for 2 in OT1.  The more i think about it the more i think it was the right call.  I think we had a 60-65% chance to win in OT1 given we got the ball last.  I think that dropped to 50-55% in OT2 because we got the ball first (still favored based on our superior kicker).  I think there was at least a 65-70% chance we get the 2 yards to win.  Maybe higher if we had a specific play just for the situation.

Do you really think a team that doesn't have a 2 minute offense has a play for that situation?

Yes, i do.  That said, i've been pretty skeptical of the posts throwing the coaches under the bus....until i rewatched the game and listened to our captains try to defer when they won the toss before OT.  That was incredibly disappointing and I'm not sure how that even happens with a Snyder coached team.  His attention to detail is well known....it has me a little worried.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Sandstone Outcropping on October 09, 2017, 01:33:33 PM
I think statistically we had a much better win percentage to go for 2 in OT1.  The more i think about it the more i think it was the right call.  I think we had a 60-65% chance to win in OT1 given we got the ball last.  I think that dropped to 50-55% in OT2 because we got the ball first (still favored based on our superior kicker).  I think there was at least a 65-70% chance we get the 2 yards to win.  Maybe higher if we had a specific play just for the situation.

Do you really think a team that doesn't have a 2 minute offense has a play for that situation?

Yes, i do.  That said, i've been pretty skeptical of the posts throwing the coaches under the bus....until i rewatched the game and listened to our captains try to defer when they won the toss before OT.  That was incredibly disappointing and I'm not sure how that even happens with a Snyder coached team.  His attention to detail is well known....it has me a little worried.
Not sure if serious...
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 09, 2017, 01:40:34 PM
I think statistically we had a much better win percentage to go for 2 in OT1.  The more i think about it the more i think it was the right call.  I think we had a 60-65% chance to win in OT1 given we got the ball last.  I think that dropped to 50-55% in OT2 because we got the ball first (still favored based on our superior kicker).  I think there was at least a 65-70% chance we get the 2 yards to win.  Maybe higher if we had a specific play just for the situation.

Do you really think a team that doesn't have a 2 minute offense has a play for that situation?

Yes, i do.  That said, i've been pretty skeptical of the posts throwing the coaches under the bus....until i rewatched the game and listened to our captains try to defer when they won the toss before OT.  That was incredibly disappointing and I'm not sure how that even happens with a Snyder coached team.  His attention to detail is well known....it has me a little worried.
Not sure if serious...
yeah that was just a truly shitty post, brown belts everywhere these days
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 09, 2017, 03:25:37 PM
I think statistically we had a much better win percentage to go for 2 in OT1.  The more i think about it the more i think it was the right call.  I think we had a 60-65% chance to win in OT1 given we got the ball last.  I think that dropped to 50-55% in OT2 because we got the ball first (still favored based on our superior kicker).  I think there was at least a 65-70% chance we get the 2 yards to win.  Maybe higher if we had a specific play just for the situation.

Do you really think a team that doesn't have a 2 minute offense has a play for that situation?

Yes, i do.  That said, i've been pretty skeptical of the posts throwing the coaches under the bus....until i rewatched the game and listened to our captains try to defer when they won the toss before OT.  That was incredibly disappointing and I'm not sure how that even happens with a Snyder coached team.  His attention to detail is well known....it has me a little worried.
Not sure if serious...
yeah that was just a truly shitty post, brown belts everywhere these days

I've got you crap stains so mind mumped you don't know whether to crap or go blind.  :ROFL:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 09, 2017, 03:29:10 PM
When we won the toss and one of the captains said "Defer!", and the ref--who is also a complete dipshit--said "you can't defer" I was all  :facepalm:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: meow meow on October 09, 2017, 04:43:49 PM
When we won the toss and one of the captains said "Defer!", and the ref--who is also a complete dipshit--said "you can't defer" I was all  :facepalm:

can you imagine if the official would have then asked Texas and they would have taken defense and we would have totally effed ourselves.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 09, 2017, 08:13:14 PM
When we won the toss and one of the captains said "Defer!", and the ref--who is also a complete dipshit--said "you can't defer" I was all  :facepalm:

can you imagine if the official would have then asked Texas and they would have taken defense and we would have totally effed ourselves.

That's probably what he should have done--let us choose which endzone to defend
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 09, 2017, 08:28:34 PM
2nd to last play of the game, we called a play that led to our receiver being tackled at the 1. We had 0 timeouts. If we hadn't gotten a penalty for O-PI we would've ended the game without throwing to the endzone

I think that was more of the player not being aware of where he was on the field than the call. We've run rub plays against man in the endzone plenty of times before.

The play that really hurt on that final drive was the outside run to Jones that got blown up and forced us to waste a TO. Of course, that outside zone scheme had gotten us big chunks earlier in the game for both Jones and Barnes so I understood it, but when it got destroyed and we lost yards it took an additional running play our of our hands because we had to waste one of our two timeouts.

Also, this was a game where truly wasting a TO in a late play clock situation came back to hurt us. If we had an additional timeout and a chance to call another run play at the 4 with 10 seconds left I truly think we win the game.

yup
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 12, 2017, 12:10:00 AM
finally watched most of the game on youtube. that final regulation drive was really something. put ertz back in after he's obviously seriously injured his knee (and delton has played well) and then have no idea what we wanna do and also force ertz into having to run it again. smdh.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 12, 2017, 08:09:40 AM
It was truly a fascinating thing to behold. 5 days later, I'm still baffled by how perfectly we showed that we had absolutely zero idea whether we were trying to score or run out the clock. I mean, who else could possibly be so precise in their inefficiency?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sonofdaxjones on October 12, 2017, 10:54:39 AM
It was truly a fascinating thing to behold. 5 days later, I'm still baffled by how perfectly we showed that we had absolutely zero idea whether we were trying to score or run out the clock. I mean, who else could possibly be so precise in their inefficiency?

That’s what Snyder 2.0 has become and this is only further expanding on what any truly observant Qhatz fan has none for years.   That  Dana Dimel is one of the most formuliacly weird and contrarian OC’s (and not in a good way) in the game. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 12, 2017, 11:48:14 AM
It was truly a fascinating thing to behold. 5 days later, I'm still baffled by how perfectly we showed that we had absolutely zero idea whether we were trying to score or run out the clock. I mean, who else could possibly be so precise in their inefficiency?

That’s what Snyder 2.0 has become and this is only further expanding on what any truly observant Qhatz fan has none for years.   That  Dana Dimel is one of the most formuliacly weird and contrarian OC’s (and not in a good way) in the game.

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 12, 2017, 04:34:29 PM
It was truly a fascinating thing to behold. 5 days later, I'm still baffled by how perfectly we showed that we had absolutely zero idea whether we were trying to score or run out the clock. I mean, who else could possibly be so precise in their inefficiency?

That’s what Snyder 2.0 has become and this is only further expanding on what any truly observant Qhatz fan has none for years.   That  Dana Dimel is one of the most formuliacly weird and contrarian OC’s (and not in a good way) in the game.

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

yeah, guys. and on top of that it's just wrong and mumped up to put ertz back in when he's obviously injured. i'm sure ertz was in their ear wanting to play, but still. delton was playing fine. let it ride and see what happens. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 14, 2017, 08:54:48 PM
From the TCU game thread today, but it needs to be immortalized here too because this post was :thumbs:  Good job BostonPancake

Things that pissed me off today:

1.  After forcing a punt in the second quarter, we nearly block it, and the punt was poor because of a strong wind.  The next time we force a punt, we trot two return men out there again.  Why not load up everyone on the line and go for the block?  We nearly blocked it again.  If two more people are rushing in, maybe we get it.  We needed a special team score to even have a remote chance of winning.  Yet, we still sent two return guys out when we knew the punt would be unreturnable because it would likely be short due to the wind.

2.  Punting at the end of the first half with 43 seconds left.  We were on the 43, with the wind at our back.  We have a kicker who can kick a 60 yard FG without the wind, yet we punt.  Again....everyone knew the offense wasn't going to win this game for us.  Why not try the FG.  If we miss, yeah they get the ball at mid field.  Who cares.

3.  This has been discussed, but the 4th and 1/2 a yard play from shot gun.  Maddening.   :bang:  I hate backing up 4 yards from the line when all you need is less than 1.  Drives me crazy. 

4.  Not giving Thompson a snap.  I'm 99% certain that he wouldn't have made one bit of difference in this game, but give him some reps. 

5.  Facing a 5-7 / 6-6 record in the face.  This season is in the crapper.  It sucks.   :flush:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 14, 2017, 08:58:40 PM
From the TCU game thread today, but it needs to be immortalized here too because this post was :thumbs:  Good job BostonPancake

Things that pissed me off today:

1.  After forcing a punt in the second quarter, we nearly block it, and the punt was poor because of a strong wind.  The next time we force a punt, we trot two return men out there again.  Why not load up everyone on the line and go for the block?  We nearly blocked it again.  If two more people are rushing in, maybe we get it.  We needed a special team score to even have a remote chance of winning.  Yet, we still sent two return guys out when we knew the punt would be unreturnable because it would likely be short due to the wind.

2.  Punting at the end of the first half with 43 seconds left.  We were on the 43, with the wind at our back.  We have a kicker who can kick a 60 yard FG without the wind, yet we punt.  Again....everyone knew the offense wasn't going to win this game for us.  Why not try the FG.  If we miss, yeah they get the ball at mid field.  Who cares.

3.  This has been discussed, but the 4th and 1/2 a yard play from shot gun.  Maddening.   :bang:  I hate backing up 4 yards from the line when all you need is less than 1.  Drives me crazy. 

4.  Not giving Thompson a snap.  I'm 99% certain that he wouldn't have made one bit of difference in this game, but give him some reps. 

5.  Facing a 5-7 / 6-6 record in the face.  This season is in the crapper.  It sucks.   :flush:
Also mentioned in the other there's, but I would add making senior Bazooka Joe the primary backup to Ertz last season. Especially when every new QB for Snyder generally looks completely lost their first several meaningful drives.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: HELLHAMMER on October 14, 2017, 09:54:52 PM
For 3 rough ridin' years I've had a feeling in my gut like I needed to take a huge crap about LHC Bill Snyder sucking the life out of the program.  Today at halftime I finally decided to go plug the camode and clean myself up.  I'm over it.

This staff needs axed, and it starts by cutting the head off of the snake.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 14, 2017, 10:13:08 PM
Only 3 years?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: HELLHAMMER on October 14, 2017, 10:32:38 PM
Only 3 years?
A little bit of denial mixed in with severe gall bladder issues.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 15, 2017, 01:25:46 PM
Only 3 years?

 :confused: We won the conference 5 years ago, skinny benny. The year after that we won 8 games and a bowl. The year after that we won 9 games, played on the last day of the regular season with college gameday on site, for a share of the conference championship, and finished 18th in the country. The year after that was the year of 15 quarterbacks.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 15, 2017, 02:35:44 PM
Only 3 years?

 :confused: We won the conference 5 years ago, skinny benny. The year after that we won 8 games and a bowl. The year after that we won 9 games, played on the last day of the regular season with college gameday on site, for a share of the conference championship, and finished 18th in the country. The year after that was the year of 15 quarterbacks.

Our fan meltdowns are pretty incredible.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on October 15, 2017, 02:43:41 PM
They feel forced imo
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on October 15, 2017, 04:42:13 PM
For 3 rough ridin' years I've had a feeling in my gut like I needed to take a huge crap about LHC Bill Snyder sucking the life out of the program.  Today at halftime I finally decided to go plug the camode and clean myself up.  I'm over it.

This staff needs axed, and it starts by cutting the head off of the snake.

That must have been some kind of relief. Feel bad you had to hold it in that long.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Gooch on October 16, 2017, 10:29:31 AM
Regardless of this seasons record. This program feels very stale and just going through the motions. There is no spark just super flat and boring. Literal milquetoast.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on October 16, 2017, 10:40:48 AM
Regardless of this seasons record. This program feels very stale and just going through the motions. There is no spark just super flat and boring. Literal milquetoast.
we've recruited a bunch of millennial snowflakes
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on October 16, 2017, 11:08:58 AM
i was so cocky coming into this season. really thought we were going to be as good as advertised, because every position other than linebacker had proven talent.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on October 16, 2017, 11:13:41 AM
The one part I really don't understand is how the OL has been so mediocre
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: meow meow on October 16, 2017, 11:18:26 AM
losing our starting center right before the year hurt, Risner has been banged up all year, etc.  depth must not be that great up there.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sonofdaxjones on October 16, 2017, 11:27:29 AM
We have the “fastest qb since Roberson” starting his first game so let’s run him into the teeth of a defense that when they have the talent is one of the best run scheme staffs in the country and/or make him a pocket passer.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 16, 2017, 11:48:05 AM
The one part I really don't understand is how the OL has been so mediocre

40% of last year's regular offensive line is gone. I thought we'd be fine losing Johnson because one of the others would fit in over the spring and fall and take his place. I probably downplayed the significance of losing Najvar, especially so late in the fall.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: AppleJack on October 16, 2017, 11:51:14 AM
I used to get really angry on how badly we telegraph our blitzes but now I just laugh.

QB lines up - "Down, Set"

2 LB's/S's rush the LOS.

QB backs out, looks and laughs at us.

2 LB's/S's don't move, revving their engines

"Hut!"

2 LB's/S's get stonewalled

36 yard screen and/or crossing route

So funny
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on October 16, 2017, 11:57:09 AM
The one part I really don't understand is how the OL has been so mediocre

40% of last year's regular offensive line is gone. I thought we'd be fine losing Johnson because one of the others would fit in over the spring and fall and take his place. I probably downplayed the significance of losing Najvar, especially so late in the fall.
yeah.. I guess we've had so much luck with being able to go next guy up on the line that I didn't think it would be as big of an issue.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 16, 2017, 12:20:42 PM
I used to get really angry on how badly we telegraph our blitzes but now I just laugh.

QB lines up - "Down, Set"

2 LB's/S's rush the LOS.

QB backs out, looks and laughs at us.

2 LB's/S's don't move, revving their engines

"Hut!"

2 LB's/S's get stonewalled

36 yard screen and/or crossing route

So funny

IT'S SO CRAZY. HOW DO WE NEVER EVER CHECK OUT OF THE BLITZ????
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on October 16, 2017, 12:31:53 PM
I really don't find it very funny applejack
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on October 16, 2017, 12:50:47 PM
The blitz where Holl ran it in, Kendall Adams ran/was pushed so far outside and past Hill it made me laugh. Our outside blitzing is hilarious.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on October 20, 2017, 04:52:48 PM
They probably thought the game time last week and this week were great times to try and play football.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Brock Landers on October 21, 2017, 04:56:30 PM
Anyone with a brain: K State should keep running the ball and keep the clock moving so they at least maintain a 2 touchdown lead going to halftime.

KSU coaches: No, denied.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 21, 2017, 05:01:42 PM
LOLOLOL, Klatt just called out Dana Dimel for a terrible playcall that resulted in an awful turnover.

For the record, this happened after He Who Smelton Delton and Co. had been having tons of success during a 21-7 first half ass beating running and passing the ball in super tiny chunks. We were obviously trying to get a score while simultaneously bleeding out the clock and make our drive the last drive of the half. Welp nope, Delton throws real far downfield and straight to an OU D-back, who returns it like 700 yards to our 12 yard-line. I'm completely paraphrasing here, but Klatt says something to the effect of, "That just falls on Dana Dimel. Why would you throw that far downfield with an inexperienced QB when the small chunks were working so well?"


Dimel has called a pretty good game so far, but it's still nice to see him getting destroyed on national TV.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BMWWcat on October 21, 2017, 05:04:02 PM
Hi, my name is alex barnes I have 96 yards on 3 carries...but lets just effing drop back and throw a crap pass to a crap route on a crap play call.   :flush:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheProdigiousTalent on October 21, 2017, 05:28:00 PM
Wasn't Warmack in on that drive too?  I don't get why you wouldn't stick with the wild success of Barnes and Silmon either.  Gotta be creative, I guess.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 21, 2017, 05:30:49 PM
:lol:

We get the ball on our own ~35 or w/e with :36 left in the half. Again it seems at first like we have no idea whether we're going to try to get in FG range or run out the clock. Delton runs a nice 9-yard run and goes down in bounds with :26 left. We just let the clock run for another five seconds before we finally decide to use one of our two remaining time outs.

Then, with :06 left in the half, we attempt a 59-yard field goal that ends up bouncing off the crossbar. We probably could've used the extra five seconds we wasted at the beginning to push the ball forward 6 inches so McCrane could've made that field goal.


*EDIT* This stud post was in the "Has McCrane Ever Made An Important Field Goal?" thread, but it may as well be linked in here for posterity too.
http://goEMAW.com/forum/index.php?topic=39659.msg1770789#msg1770789
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on October 21, 2017, 05:44:17 PM
And Dimel's shitty playcalling has returned.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: EMAWzifried on October 21, 2017, 06:11:54 PM
And the ball in the hands of son. WTF, Barnes with his ninety six yards and fresh legs.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 21, 2017, 06:32:03 PM
3rd and 14 deep in our own territory, and we throw a lil pass to our RB and he catches it 4 yards behind the line of scrimmage. Stunningly, we did not convert the 3rd down. :lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: KSURFC8 on October 21, 2017, 06:52:11 PM
Who's that wearing Pringle's uni. He actually caught one.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 21, 2017, 07:12:21 PM
i liked the part where we were up 21-7 with the ball. having it run it straight down ou's throats all half and then dial up a delton bomb that turns into a pic and an ou fg and turns around all momentum
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Super PurpleCat on October 21, 2017, 07:13:09 PM
It's a scenario I've NEVER SEEN played out in front of our eyes before.  Maybe we should take notes?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheProdigiousTalent on October 21, 2017, 07:17:57 PM
3rd and 14 deep in our own territory, and we throw a lil pass to our RB and he catches it 4 yards behind the line of scrimmage. Stunningly, we did not convert the 3rd down. :lol:
Turned off the TV at this point.  Why bother watching if the players aren't given the opportunities to make plays without the element of surprise/WTF?  Delton moved the ball on that last drive when they let him pass the ball downfield like a regular QB.  Maybe we should try less contrarian BS and just let our O try to execute (?).
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 21, 2017, 07:27:50 PM
When considering this game, make sure to note that we blew a big lead, even a 10-point halftime lead. Which all play-by-play guys used to tell us Snyder never did. If the Mustang fires everybody I will be giddy AF and doing this in the streets:

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: troubledscribe on October 21, 2017, 07:28:21 PM
3rd and 14 deep in our own territory, and we throw a lil pass to our RB and he catches it 4 yards behind the line of scrimmage. Stunningly, we did not convert the 3rd down. :lol:
Turned off the TV at this point.  Why bother watching if the players aren't given the opportunities to make plays without the element of surprise/WTF?  Delton moved the ball on that last drive when they let him pass the ball downfield like a regular QB.  Maybe we should try less contrarian BS and just let our O try to execute (?).

Delton should have been picked twice on his passes to pringle. Floating ducks.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 21, 2017, 08:11:13 PM
It's a scenario I've NEVER SEEN played out in front of our eyes before.  Maybe we should take notes?

no crap. this game was just osu last year, osu the year before, texas this year, tcu in 2015, etc. there's no end. i hate to say it, but i think this is the end of bill. we'll finish 5-7 and mean gene will have to earn his money in the offseason.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 21, 2017, 08:12:38 PM
I thought the 65 plays between touches for Barnes, particularly considering his 30+ ypc average, was questionable.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 21, 2017, 08:15:12 PM
I thought the 65 plays between touches for Barnes, particularly considering his 30+ ypc average, was questionable.

a reasonable, non-racist, non-fuckface point from fake sugar dick.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 21, 2017, 08:23:48 PM
The frustrating thing is that Dimel or Hayes can make 600K per year and have all this responsibility, but are only allowed to speak to the media once per year. It's ridiculous that they don't get to answer questions that should be asked.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Trim on October 21, 2017, 08:33:01 PM
 :impatient:

https://twitter.com/mommabarnes34/with_replies
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: slackcat on October 21, 2017, 08:52:09 PM
Bill leaving the lip balm at home.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 21, 2017, 08:59:44 PM
Playing tanking and Kirby every down
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 21, 2017, 10:13:29 PM
i think snyder's plan is to have seiler be dc, collin bc oc, and sean to be hc. i think he will "retire" after this season and "consult" from his box from his west stadium club suite. i also think he thinks taylor is his stooge and will make that all happen.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: chum1 on October 22, 2017, 07:49:55 AM
Inflexibility always seems to be one of the virtues of our offense.

Quote
Barnes found a hole between the tackles and outran everyone to the end zone for a 75-yard touchdown. Not only was it his longest run of the season, it was a confidence booster.

Oddly, though, he only touched saw five more carries, leaving many to wonder, why?

K-State coach LHC Bill Snyder explained the Wildcats preferred to run formations that featured quarterback Alex Delton, who ran for 142 yards and three touchdowns on 27 carries. The majority of those plays call for a lead blocker, instead of a running back.

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/kansas-state/article180244656.html
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on October 22, 2017, 07:59:58 AM
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: HELLHAMMER on October 22, 2017, 08:08:43 AM
Inflexibility always seems to be one of the virtues of our offense.

Quote
Barnes found a hole between the tackles and outran everyone to the end zone for a 75-yard touchdown. Not only was it his longest run of the season, it was a confidence booster.

Oddly, though, he only touched saw five more carries, leaving many to wonder, why?

K-State coach LHC Bill Snyder explained the Wildcats preferred to run formations that featured quarterback Alex Delton, who ran for 142 yards and three touchdowns on 27 carries. The majority of those plays call for a lead blocker, instead of a running back.

http://www.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/kansas-state/article180244656.html
Bill continues to think he's the smartest guy in the room, but he's not.  Arrogant male genitals sucker.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Lucas Scoopsalot on October 22, 2017, 08:37:11 AM
I can't think of another team in the country that uses their QB like a feature back.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheTruth on October 22, 2017, 08:43:36 AM

Good for Alex. I would imagine there are several players that feel the same way.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: IPA4Me on October 22, 2017, 08:53:49 AM
He's going to get mumped hard by old balls and the gang. No more touches for him.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on October 22, 2017, 09:00:03 AM
He's going to get mumped hard by old balls and the gang. No more touches for him.

How would that be any different than it is right now?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: chum1 on October 22, 2017, 09:03:49 AM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: slackcat on October 22, 2017, 09:07:36 AM
He's going to get mumped hard by old balls and the gang. No more touches for him.

this
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 22, 2017, 09:22:09 AM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 22, 2017, 09:26:25 AM
Good game from Barnes against OU with pretty questionable play calling. But let’s not forget how completely ineffective he has been in most games this season.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 22, 2017, 09:28:49 AM
We just got utterly out coached this game, which I hoped wouldn’t happen with Stoops out. Somehow they seemed unprepared at first to stop the only thing we do well, but made the corrections they needed to at the end.

Still, they’re just a better team. We couldn’t do anything to stop them when their backs were against the corner in the 4th.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 22, 2017, 09:31:23 AM
And pretty LFBIQ, but even I could tell it was 100% stupid at the end of the first half to call timeout and try kicking a FG with 6 seconds left. First, there is no reason to have more than 3 on the clock, so why not just sneak it up the middle and see what you get first?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheHamburglar on October 22, 2017, 09:44:50 AM
And pretty LFBIQ, but even I could tell it was 100% stupid at the end of the first half to call timeout and try kicking a FG with 6 seconds left. First, there is no reason to have more than 3 on the clock, so why not just sneak it up the middle and see what you get first?

Earlier in the drive they wasted 4 seconds to call a timeout.  That would have given 10 seconds with 1 timeout left.  They then had to call a timeout with 6 seconds because, not surprisingly, the Bill-Sean-Dana clusterfuck couldnt decide what to do with the clock stopped at 0:06.

If we would have given McCrane 2 more yards we would have been up 4 for OU's final drive as OU wouldn't have gone for 2 earlier.  That's a direct result of wasting 4 seconds because our geriatric coach is always standing 30 yards away & his son acting like the HC, but still asking daddy's permission for everything.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 22, 2017, 09:52:10 AM
You guys gotta stop blaming this crap on Sean. He doesn't wear a headset and only interacts with special teams. You have enough enemies without having to demonize Sean.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: HELLHAMMER on October 22, 2017, 10:16:20 AM
  http://www.dana.org/Cerebrum/2015/Cognitive_Skills_and_the_Aging_Brain__What_to_Expect/     (http://www.dana.org/Cerebrum/2015/Cognitive_Skills_and_the_Aging_Brain__What_to_Expect/)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 22, 2017, 10:35:45 AM
Regardless that was a hilarious timeout
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 22, 2017, 10:49:04 AM
Playing tanking and Kirby every down

Tanking has actually been good. Kirby can kick rocks, although I haven't seen anything from #3 that makes me think he's better.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 22, 2017, 10:59:22 AM
Kirby got completely destroyed on that final run by OU. I thought he had an easy tackle for a loss of 3-4 yards.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TheHamburglar on October 22, 2017, 11:08:10 AM
You guys gotta stop blaming this crap on Sean. He doesn't wear a headset and only interacts with special teams. You have enough enemies without having to demonize Sean.

Sean absolutely wears a headset.  I watched him almost throw it yesterday.  Me & the guy sitting next to me were laughing about it.  I rewatched part of the game this morning & saw multiple shots of him with it on. 

I've also watched him call multiple timeouts because Bill is 40 yards upfield watching from behind the D.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Sandstone Outcropping on October 22, 2017, 11:12:24 AM

Good for Alex. I would imagine there are several players that feel the same way.
He is the best football player on the team. It is really unbelievable.

 :billdance:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 22, 2017, 11:42:50 AM
good for barnes. he could have had 200 yards in yesterday's game, saved delton the pummeling, and we would have won.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 22, 2017, 11:45:48 AM
and i'll say it again. play all the young kids. this season is lost. see what we have as bill checks out and gets himself some solid fried chicken meals at ramblers.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Powercat Posse on October 22, 2017, 11:56:04 AM
Playing tanking and Kirby every down

Tanking has actually been good. Kirby can kick rocks, although I haven't seen anything from #3 that makes me think he's better.

Kirby got completely destroyed on that final run by OU. I thought he had an easy tackle for a loss of 3-4 yards.

Yes. Kirby got 2 hands on #24 but then got stiff armed like a little boy.  He also had a laughable missed tackle on a 4th down play in the 1st half.

He actually made a couple decent plays y'day, but his poor plays this season have far outweighed the good.

Both LBs struggle big time in pass coverage or on pass downs. Tanking does come out on 3rd & long. However we should have Sullivan and E.Walker playing the LB spots when we bring in our 4 DE rush unit.

Also, Newlan was a big issue y'day too. We missed Adams a ton
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on October 22, 2017, 12:26:55 PM
Playing tanking and Kirby every down

Tanking has actually been good. Kirby can kick rocks, although I haven't seen anything from #3 that makes me think he's better.

Kirby got completely destroyed on that final run by OU. I thought he had an easy tackle for a loss of 3-4 yards.

Yes. Kirby got 2 hands on #24 but then got stiff armed like a little boy.  He also had a laughable missed tackle on a 4th down play in the 1st half.

He actually made a couple decent plays y'day, but his poor plays this season have far outweighed the good.

Both LBs struggle big time in pass coverage or on pass downs. Tanking does come out on 3rd & long. However we should have Sullivan and E.Walker playing the LB spots when we bring in our 4 DE rush unit.

Also, Newlan was a big issue y'day too. We missed Adams a ton

How many sacks did our D-Line, as a whole, have this season?  It seems to be historically low under a LHC Bill Snyder coached team.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 22, 2017, 12:47:32 PM
You guys gotta stop blaming this crap on Sean. He doesn't wear a headset and only interacts with special teams. You have enough enemies without having to demonize Sean.

Sean absolutely wears a headset.  I watched him almost throw it yesterday.  Me & the guy sitting next to me were laughing about it.  I rewatched part of the game this morning & saw multiple shots of him with it on. 

I've also watched him call multiple timeouts because Bill is 40 yards upfield watching from behind the D.

I started watching the last three possessions, 2 defensive 1 offensive, and he didn't wear one for any of that time, he didn't even have it in his hands. I laughed because on the last defensive possession he was jumping up and down with the players on the bench, it was hilarious watching that bald head bouncing up and down.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 22, 2017, 12:49:00 PM

Good for Alex. I would imagine there are several players that feel the same way.
He is the best football player on the team. It is really unbelievable.

 :billdance:

No he isn't
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on October 22, 2017, 12:56:26 PM
Kirby got burned covering a back on a passsing play, but then they said Riley put a WR in the back field for it. That was damn genius.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 22, 2017, 12:58:36 PM

Good for Alex. I would imagine there are several players that feel the same way.
He is the best football player on the team. It is really unbelievable.

 :billdance:
This is not true. Not even the best RB.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 22, 2017, 06:31:08 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 22, 2017, 06:33:26 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
How so?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 22, 2017, 07:47:01 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
How so?
why would you want one of our only good players to leave? I'm glad he is frustrated and he should be. matter of fact a lot more players should be frustrated
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Katdaddy on October 22, 2017, 08:08:53 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
How so?
why would you want one of our only good players to leave? I'm glad he is frustrated and he should be. matter of fact a lot more players should be frustrated

(http://goEMAW.com/forum/Smileys/goEMAW/thumbs_up_emoticon.gif)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 22, 2017, 08:33:21 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
How so?
why would you want one of our only good players to leave? I'm glad he is frustrated and he should be. matter of fact a lot more players should be frustrated
It's his life. I hope he does what makes him happiest.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 22, 2017, 08:35:11 PM
If he is frustrated with how he is being utilized at KSU by this staff, I hope he is able to go somewhere that utilizes him in a way he feels he should be.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 22, 2017, 08:39:37 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
How so?
why would you want one of our only good players to leave? I'm glad he is frustrated and he should be. matter of fact a lot more players should be frustrated
It's his life. I hope he does what makes him happiest.
something tells me its running a football well, kinda hard to do that when you get held back by coaches (hence the terrible coaches thread)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 22, 2017, 09:02:24 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
How so?
why would you want one of our only good players to leave? I'm glad he is frustrated and he should be. matter of fact a lot more players should be frustrated
It's his life. I hope he does what makes him happiest.
something tells me its running a football well, kinda hard to do that when you get held back by coaches (hence the terrible coaches thread)
So you want him to stay and be frustrated and vocal to force a coaching change?

Lol. Yeah I'm not going to ask that Delton stay for my benefit.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 22, 2017, 09:07:01 PM
He should absolutely voice his frustration to his position coach. And his coach should have a good explanation.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 22, 2017, 09:14:05 PM
I agree. mcat.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 22, 2017, 09:15:27 PM
Playing tanking and Kirby every down

Tanking has actually been good. Kirby can kick rocks, although I haven't seen anything from #3 that makes me think he's better.

Kirby got completely destroyed on that final run by OU. I thought he had an easy tackle for a loss of 3-4 yards.

Yes. Kirby got 2 hands on #24 but then got stiff armed like a little boy.  He also had a laughable missed tackle on a 4th down play in the 1st half.

He actually made a couple decent plays y'day, but his poor plays this season have far outweighed the good.

Both LBs struggle big time in pass coverage or on pass downs. Tanking does come out on 3rd & long. However we should have Sullivan and E.Walker playing the LB spots when we bring in our 4 DE rush unit.

Also, Newlan was a big issue y'day too. We missed Adams a ton

Kirby also managed to get a personal foul penalty in process of missing thst tackle that negated any chance of a kick return.

Also, all LBs struggle in pass coverage
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 22, 2017, 09:47:52 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
How so?
why would you want one of our only good players to leave? I'm glad he is frustrated and he should be. matter of fact a lot more players should be frustrated
It's his life. I hope he does what makes him happiest.
something tells me its running a football well, kinda hard to do that when you get held back by coaches (hence the terrible coaches thread)
So you want him to stay and be frustrated and vocal to force a coaching change?

Lol. Yeah I'm not going to ask that Delton stay for my benefit.
if he doesn't get carries the rest of the year, like 15-20 carries after voicing his frustration not only to the media but also the coaches then yes he should go (rb can be a hard transfer once you get miles on the legs but he doesn't have that issue now does he lol snarf snarf) after he makes it clear why. the coaches would be stuck with their dicks in their hands knowing stubbornness cost them the 1 of a handful of players that is legit on this roster.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 22, 2017, 09:52:49 PM
Haha. Wow. Bye, Barnes.
If he is frustrated I hope he leaves.
well this is a dumb statement to make
How so?
why would you want one of our only good players to leave? I'm glad he is frustrated and he should be. matter of fact a lot more players should be frustrated
It's his life. I hope he does what makes him happiest.
something tells me its running a football well, kinda hard to do that when you get held back by coaches (hence the terrible coaches thread)
So you want him to stay and be frustrated and vocal to force a coaching change?

Lol. Yeah I'm not going to ask that Delton stay for my benefit.
if he doesn't get carries the rest of the year, like 15-20 carries after voicing his frustration not only to the media but also the coaches then yes he should go (rb can be a hard transfer once you get miles on the legs but he doesn't have that issue now does he lol snarf snarf) after he makes it clear why. the coaches would be stuck with their dicks in their hands knowing stubbornness cost them the 1 of a handful of players that is legit on this roster.
I think we agree on this issue, kslim. I was poor at articulation. :cheers:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 23, 2017, 12:51:16 AM
Saw this posted on FB by a loyal qat fan after our meltdown in the 2nd half yesterday. Thought it was pretty well-reasoned and well-researched. Might not be any new info here, but I wanted to get it in this thread.

Quote
FINAL: OU 42, K-State 35 - The second half constitued coaching malpractice, top to bottom.

K-State had 257 yards rushing at halftime.

They finished with 268.

Fire Dimel.

LHC Bill Snyder on not playing Barnes for a period: "It was just the nature of what we were doing. Part of it was the quarterback run game."

ALEX DELTON RAN FOR 28 YARDS ON 14 CARRIES IN THE SECOND HALF
THAT'S WHY THEY DIDN'T GIVE THE BALL TO BARNES. FOR THE QB RUN GAME
/*seizure
WAIT MY MISTAKE
DELTON TECHNICALLY RAN FOR EIGHT YARDS ON FOURTEEN CARRIES IN THE SECOND HALF..

Alex Delton had 27 carries.

The rest of the team combined had 15.

This insanity has to end.

Alex Barnes averaged almost 7 yards per carry AFTER YOU SUBTRACT HIS 75-YARD TD RUN...But let's focus on the QB run game.
Alex Barnes 6 carries, 108 yards. Without the 75-yard TD, he still averaged 6.6 yards per carry. Only 6 carries defies logical explanation.

Word has it Alex Barnes wasn’t the happiest of campers at times last year. Looks like things have only gone further south in his mind. Not good for KSU. I don’t blame half the talent on the team for transferring. Asked if Alex Barnes will voice frustration about his limited usage with K-State coaches, Alex Barnes unequivocally responds: "Yes."

Look, we take it easy on the players mostly. We don't call them out until a problem is GLARING (Pringle's drops, Kirby's pass defense). That's because they don't get paid...but the coaches do. Their job is to win football games. We pay them to win. Not to choke.

Last legendary coach to go out on his own terms was Schembechler. They stay too long because people think they should go when they're ready...

Final Thought: I’m Disappointed as hell. But proud of the fight in this team. That was a different team that I saw play the first half of the game..Proud of the cats, but that 3rd quarter was Hot Garbage. Coaching staff needs to go. I’m done with the moral victories.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 23, 2017, 04:22:30 AM
Saw this posted on FB by a loyal qat fan after our meltdown in the 2nd half yesterday. Thought it was pretty well-reasoned and well-researched. Might not be any new info here, but I wanted to get it in this thread.

Quote
FINAL: OU 42, K-State 35 - The second half constitued coaching malpractice, top to bottom.

K-State had 257 yards rushing at halftime.

They finished with 268.

Fire Dimel.

LHC Bill Snyder on not playing Barnes for a period: "It was just the nature of what we were doing. Part of it was the quarterback run game."

ALEX DELTON RAN FOR 28 YARDS ON 14 CARRIES IN THE SECOND HALF
THAT'S WHY THEY DIDN'T GIVE THE BALL TO BARNES. FOR THE QB RUN GAME
/*seizure
WAIT MY MISTAKE
DELTON TECHNICALLY RAN FOR EIGHT YARDS ON FOURTEEN CARRIES IN THE SECOND HALF..

Alex Delton had 27 carries.

The rest of the team combined had 15.

This insanity has to end.

Alex Barnes averaged almost 7 yards per carry AFTER YOU SUBTRACT HIS 75-YARD TD RUN...But let's focus on the QB run game.
Alex Barnes 6 carries, 108 yards. Without the 75-yard TD, he still averaged 6.6 yards per carry. Only 6 carries defies logical explanation.

Word has it Alex Barnes wasn’t the happiest of campers at times last year. Looks like things have only gone further south in his mind. Not good for KSU. I don’t blame half the talent on the team for transferring. Asked if Alex Barnes will voice frustration about his limited usage with K-State coaches, Alex Barnes unequivocally responds: "Yes."

Look, we take it easy on the players mostly. We don't call them out until a problem is GLARING (Pringle's drops, Kirby's pass defense). That's because they don't get paid...but the coaches do. Their job is to win football games. We pay them to win. Not to choke.

Last legendary coach to go out on his own terms was Schembechler. They stay too long because people think they should go when they're ready...

Final Thought: I’m Disappointed as hell. But proud of the fight in this team. That was a different team that I saw play the first half of the game..Proud of the cats, but that 3rd quarter was Hot Garbage. Coaching staff needs to go. I’m done with the moral victories.

wow, super lit post. almost like i wrote it. and this guy is totally correct. barnes 1st carry of the game is for 75 yards. td. gets 5 more. is awesome on all them. but, nope. let's run delton 25 rough ridin' times.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: jc_jax on October 23, 2017, 09:49:39 AM
I couldn't watch the game.  I'm not smart enough on high lvl football defensive concepts anyway, so it probably wouldn't matter.

So, was there some type of defensive scheme that OU was doing that led our offense to continue to check in to the QB run?  If so, an example of the OU defensive coordinators recognizing they wanted Delton to run it and not Barnes and deliberately bating us into the checks we made.  That seems like the type of scheming we used to do...
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pett on October 23, 2017, 10:33:55 AM
This has most likely been mentioned but needs to be rehashed.

We are up 21-7, with possession, four minutes or so remaining before half. We run for a first down. With the success we were having running the ball and our coach's strategy of owning the TOP, especially against a superior opponent, you would imagine that we would keep pounding the ball and run the clock.

Nope. Dipshit Dimel dials up a twenty yard out route on first down. Ball is intercepted. Completely inexcusable.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 23, 2017, 10:46:11 AM
This has most likely been mentioned but needs to be re-hashed.

We are up 21-7, with possession, four minutes or so remaining before half. We run for a first down. With the success we were having running the ball and our coach's strategy of owning the TOP, especially against a superior opponent, you would imagine that we would keep pounding the ball and run the clock.

Nope. Dipshit Dimel dials up a twenty yard out route on first down. Ball is intercepted. Inexcusable.

I understand this, but I knew if we got a first down we would take a shot and I thought that we should. We got man coverage with no safety help, so a throw made sense, but there was an overestimation of Delton's ability to make the throw or make the right decision. The pass floated (Delton did get late pressure) and the Zuber wasn't able to make a play on the ball. It honestly was just a really bad throw. IIRC, the wind had already shifted to out of the north, so Delton had the wind at his back. If it works everyone thinks Dimel is a genius.

To be fair, I think the pass should have been off of play action and a route that allowed for an easier (and safer) read and throw, but I had zero problem with a 1st down pass there.

https://youtu.be/sqMxEd3meoM?t=5224
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 23, 2017, 10:52:09 AM
Yea. Honestly you’re never going to see me calling for an offensive coordinator’s Head after a 35+ point performance.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pett on October 23, 2017, 10:58:56 AM
This has most likely been mentioned but needs to be re-hashed.

We are up 21-7, with possession, four minutes or so remaining before half. We run for a first down. With the success we were having running the ball and our coach's strategy of owning the TOP, especially against a superior opponent, you would imagine that we would keep pounding the ball and run the clock.

Nope. Dipshit Dimel dials up a twenty yard out route on first down. Ball is intercepted. Inexcusable.

I understand this, but I knew if we got a first down we would take a shot and I thought that we should. We got man coverage with no safety help, so a throw made sense, but there was an overestimation of Delton's ability to make the throw or make the right decision. The pass floated (Delton did get late pressure) and the Zuber wasn't able to make a play on the ball. It honestly was just a really bad throw. IIRC, the wind had already shifted to out of the north, so Delton had the wind at his back. If it works everyone thinks Dimel is a genius.

To be fair, I think the pass should have been off of play action and a route that allowed for an easier (and safer) read and throw, but I had zero problem with a 1st down pass there.

https://youtu.be/sqMxEd3meoM?t=5224

Understandable. I just would have preferred a deeper route, without such great timing and accuracy involved. We are all aware of the struggles in our passing game with Delton under center.

Granted, Dimel has lived under a microscopic lens through my eyes since 2015. I find it easy to criticize.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 23, 2017, 11:03:27 AM
I like being aggressive and putting trust in your QB to make the correct read/throw. 1st, the OU CB did not bite on the double move at all, but 2nd that ball was under thrown by at least 5 yards. If the throw is 10 yards deeper you let Zuber go make a play on the ball and at worst its an incomplete pass. My initial thought was why didn't the receiver do something, but the CB reacted quicker than Zuber and he had no shot with how badly the ball was thrown.

Granted, I think part of the throw being short was the delayed blitz by the ILB. However, I put most of that blame on the right guard (#62, Mitchell). He is uncovered, but comes over the help the center on the NG which is fine, but oline in that situation are taught to keep their eyes up and shoulders down the field so they can pick up a late stunt. Mitchell completely turns his shoulder to help and then he is unable to pick up the blitz through his gap. He didn't even need to help there because Dimel was already on that side to provide extra protection. Dimel ends up helping on the same guy that Mitchell helped on for a completely unnecessary triple team. That's a massive execution error in basic pass protection from the offensive line, especially when they had to know that route called for extra time for a longer developing route, we had 7 guys to protect against a 5 man OU front plus the 6th late blitzer, you should NEVER get beat in that situation like we did there.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pett on October 23, 2017, 11:10:07 AM
I like being aggressive and putting trust in your QB to make the correct read/throw. 1st, the OU CB did not bite on the double move at all, but 2nd that ball was under thrown by at least 5 yards. If the throw is 10 yards deeper you let Zuber go make a play on the ball and at worst its an incomplete pass. My initial thought was why didn't the receiver do something, but the CB reacted quicker than Zuber and he had no shot with how badly the ball was thrown.

Granted, I think part of the throw being short was the delayed blitz by the ILB. However, I put most of that blame on the right guard (#62, Mitchell). He is uncovered, but comes over the help the center on the NG which is fine, but oline in that situation are taught to keep their eyes up and shoulders down the field so they can pick up a late stunt. Mitchell completely turns his shoulder to help and then he is unable to pick up the blitz through his gap. He didn't even need to help there because Dimel was already on that side to provide extra protection. Dimel ends up helping on the same guy that Mitchell helped on for a completely unnecessary triple team. That's a massive execution error in basic pass protection from the offensive line, especially when they had to know that route called for extra time for a longer developing route, we had 7 guys to protect against a 5 man OU front plus the 6th late blitzer, you should NEVER get beat in that situation like we did there.

Always appreciate your analysis, _fan
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 23, 2017, 11:15:26 AM
I have to be careful going back to watch, because now I'm ticked at that protection. That's easy to protect if guys communicate and know the situation. If you tell me you have Zuber (who I think is our best WR right now) 1 on 1 with no safety help and Delton throwing with the wind at his back, I take that shot every single time. Sucks that we couldn't provide basic protection for what should be a pretty safe shot down the field.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on October 23, 2017, 11:19:30 AM
Zuber's route sucked too.  Not much of a "double" move, or pump fake by delton.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 23, 2017, 11:24:02 AM
Zuber's route sucked too.  Not much of a "double" move, or pump fake by delton.

That's fair, but it wasn't atypical. It wasn't Lockett-esque by any means, but I don't think it was poor either. It was just pretty good discipline by the OU CB not to get his eyes in the backfield.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 23, 2017, 11:34:02 AM
I understand this, but I knew if we got a first down we would take a shot and I thought that we should. We got man coverage with no safety help, so a throw made sense, but there was an overestimation of Delton's ability to make the throw or make the right decision. The pass floated (Delton did get late pressure) and the Zuber wasn't able to make a play on the ball. It honestly was just a really bad throw. IIRC, the wind had already shifted to out of the north, so Delton had the wind at his back. If it works everyone thinks Dimel is a genius.


Absolutely. But....it didn't. In fact it backfired in spectacular fashion. I think in general the whole "yeah but if it worked you'd all be calling him a genius" thing is kinda missing the forest for the trees. If an OC dials up a play that ultimately works, then that OC is successful and has succeeded at his job. But if an OC dials up a play that could hypothetically work in a vacuum but that doesn't account for our offense's various weaknesses, and that play backfires badly, then it was indeed an awful call. Proof is in the pudding.

I mean, even _fan's expert post provided an alternative that would probably have been better:

Quote
To be fair, I think the pass should have been off of play action and a route that allowed for an easier (and safer) read and throw, but I had zero problem with a 1st down pass there.


Now that's not to say OCs have to be perfect on every single play to be successful, I'm just saying that I find it laughable for instance when  commentators go, "Yeah sure they lost the game on a stopped 2-point conversion when they could've kicked the PAT to go to overtime, but if they'd MADE the 2-point conversion, you'd all call him a genius!" Because it's like........yeah. No kidding. The success or failure of specific coaching decisions does indeed factor into whether they are good at their jobs or bad at their jobs.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 23, 2017, 11:42:33 AM
That perspective makes sense.

I guess I would add the qualifier that there are definitely some play calls that stand no chance because they don't fit the a) situation, b) player's abilities, or c) the defense you are facing. I get that the answer of "if the players just execute, it should work" can be a cop out and I probably lean that direction more than I should. However, this is a situation where I can't fault any of those because IMO the main problem features a major protection error that gave the play no chance to succeed.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 23, 2017, 11:52:38 AM
This has most likely been mentioned but needs to be rehashed.

We are up 21-7, with possession, four minutes or so remaining before half. We run for a first down. With the success we were having running the ball and our coach's strategy of owning the TOP, especially against a superior opponent, you would imagine that we would keep pounding the ball and run the clock.

Nope. Dipshit Dimel dials up a twenty yard out route on first down. Ball is intercepted. Completely inexcusable.
i agree but what’s more inexcusable is not running a play with a timeout and 6 seconds left before half. A simple 2 yard qb sneak would have made the difference in the ball hitting the goal post or being good and even more momentum
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 23, 2017, 11:54:01 AM
i agree but what’s more inexcusable is not running a play with a timeout and 6 seconds left before half. A simple 2 yard qb sneak would have made the difference in the ball hitting the goal post or being good and even more momentum

Agree 100% with this, but this staff has never had much ability to manage a clock, which is sad. That was just another terrible example to add to a long list.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: cfbandyman on October 23, 2017, 12:44:59 PM
i agree but what’s more inexcusable is not running a play with a timeout and 6 seconds left before half. A simple 2 yard qb sneak would have made the difference in the ball hitting the goal post or being good and even more momentum

Agree 100% with this, but this staff has never had much ability to manage a clock, which is sad. That was just another terrible example to add to a long list.

I was shocked with did that and then shocked he hit the crossbar.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: cfbandyman on October 23, 2017, 12:46:45 PM
That perspective makes sense.

I guess I would add the qualifier that there are definitely some play calls that stand no chance because they don't fit the a) situation, b) player's abilities, or c) the defense you are facing. I get that the answer of "if the players just execute, it should work" can be a cop out and I probably lean that direction more than I should. However, this is a situation where I can't fault any of those because IMO the main problem features a major protection error that gave the play no chance to succeed.

Right, IMO the play was as much that as a bad throw by Delton, but not really a bad play, is he leads Zuber correctly we get a giant play and potentially a TD. I never had a problem with the call, just a problem with throwing it 5 yards behind him.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: meow meow on October 23, 2017, 01:38:53 PM
i liked it better when we'd win almost every game when we were leading at half
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 23, 2017, 01:42:44 PM
That perspective makes sense.

I guess I would add the qualifier that there are definitely some play calls that stand no chance because they don't fit the a) situation, b) player's abilities, or c) the defense you are facing. I get that the answer of "if the players just execute, it should work" can be a cop out and I probably lean that direction more than I should. However, this is a situation where I can't fault any of those because IMO the main problem features a major protection error that gave the play no chance to succeed.

Right, IMO the play was as much that as a bad throw by Delton, but not really a bad play, is he leads Zuber correctly we get a giant play and potentially a TD. I never had a problem with the call, just a problem with throwing it 5 yards behind him.

I'm another thread I broke down the terrible protection we had that led to the bad throw. He had to throw off his back foot because a late blitz got in his face that we should have easily picked up.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: cfbandyman on October 23, 2017, 02:09:43 PM
That perspective makes sense.

I guess I would add the qualifier that there are definitely some play calls that stand no chance because they don't fit the a) situation, b) player's abilities, or c) the defense you are facing. I get that the answer of "if the players just execute, it should work" can be a cop out and I probably lean that direction more than I should. However, this is a situation where I can't fault any of those because IMO the main problem features a major protection error that gave the play no chance to succeed.

Right, IMO the play was as much that as a bad throw by Delton, but not really a bad play, is he leads Zuber correctly we get a giant play and potentially a TD. I never had a problem with the call, just a problem with throwing it 5 yards behind him.

I'm another thread I broke down the terrible protection we had that led to the bad throw. He had to throw off his back foot because a late blitz got in his face that we should have easily picked up.

See that now, also agree. Mostly was agreeing with your assessment it wasn't a bad play call but good to know.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Mikeyis4dcats on October 23, 2017, 02:10:15 PM
This has most likely been mentioned but needs to be re-hashed.

We are up 21-7, with possession, four minutes or so remaining before half. We run for a first down. With the success we were having running the ball and our coach's strategy of owning the TOP, especially against a superior opponent, you would imagine that we would keep pounding the ball and run the clock.

Nope. Dipshit Dimel dials up a twenty yard out route on first down. Ball is intercepted. Inexcusable.

I understand this, but I knew if we got a first down we would take a shot and I thought that we should. We got man coverage with no safety help, so a throw made sense, but there was an overestimation of Delton's ability to make the throw or make the right decision. The pass floated (Delton did get late pressure) and the Zuber wasn't able to make a play on the ball. It honestly was just a really bad throw. IIRC, the wind had already shifted to out of the north, so Delton had the wind at his back. If it works everyone thinks Dimel is a genius.

To be fair, I think the pass should have been off of play action and a route that allowed for an easier (and safer) read and throw, but I had zero problem with a 1st down pass there.

https://youtu.be/sqMxEd3meoM?t=5224

Watching this live I think the receiver ran the wrong route for the throw.   Receiver ran a post, and I think Delton thought he was running a corner.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on October 23, 2017, 02:16:48 PM
This was a pump fake stop and go that we've been running FOREVER.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 23, 2017, 02:20:21 PM
This was a pump fake stop and go that we've been running FOREVER.

Yep.

Delton just got smashed as he threw it.

I mean, we had token play action, but it wasn't a whole lot different than this (pump fake, double move), except Ell didn't under throw it (even though he threw into safety help).

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 23, 2017, 03:00:11 PM
A couple things about my tweet after I saw Barnes lose his crap on the sideline on Saturday.

1. Because twitter is racist and I didn't get the increased characters like scott did, I couldn't add that he had the freak out after he was pulled off of the field, after the punter mishandled the snap. He went on the field on first down, they'll pulled him, he lost it, they put him in and gave him the carry on second down.

2. I'll point it out now that I think it's over and hopefully I'm not snitching but Boom Massie like the tweet, well after the fact. Hopefully these dudes get these pretty obvious issues worked out, it's mad problematic that a d-lineman first found the tweet, then liked it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on October 24, 2017, 04:52:56 PM
I understand this, but I knew if we got a first down we would take a shot and I thought that we should. We got man coverage with no safety help, so a throw made sense, but there was an overestimation of Delton's ability to make the throw or make the right decision. The pass floated (Delton did get late pressure) and the Zuber wasn't able to make a play on the ball. It honestly was just a really bad throw. IIRC, the wind had already shifted to out of the north, so Delton had the wind at his back. If it works everyone thinks Dimel is a genius.


Absolutely. But....it didn't. In fact it backfired in spectacular fashion. I think in general the whole "yeah but if it worked you'd all be calling him a genius" thing is kinda missing the forest for the trees. If an OC dials up a play that ultimately works, then that OC is successful and has succeeded at his job. But if an OC dials up a play that could hypothetically work in a vacuum but that doesn't account for our offense's various weaknesses, and that play backfires badly, then it was indeed an awful call. Proof is in the pudding.

I mean, even _fan's expert post provided an alternative that would probably have been better:

Quote
To be fair, I think the pass should have been off of play action and a route that allowed for an easier (and safer) read and throw, but I had zero problem with a 1st down pass there.


Now that's not to say OCs have to be perfect on every single play to be successful, I'm just saying that I find it laughable for instance when  commentators go, "Yeah sure they lost the game on a stopped 2-point conversion when they could've kicked the PAT to go to overtime, but if they'd MADE the 2-point conversion, you'd all call him a genius!" Because it's like........yeah. No kidding. The success or failure of specific coaching decisions does indeed factor into whether they are good at their jobs or bad at their jobs.

It's really hard for me to say the offensive coordinator called a bad play when the players fail to execute as badly as they did. I blame the staff as a whole for lack of preparation, but an offensive coordinator should be able to trust the players he recruits and places onto the field to be able to execute a basic play like that.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 25, 2017, 11:01:13 AM
Good stuff from our guy Brent.

http://footballscoop.com/news/clemson-dc-brent-venables-explains-costly-play-calling-mistake-many-offensive-coordinators-make/
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 25, 2017, 11:14:47 AM
Good stuff from our guy Brent.

http://footballscoop.com/news/clemson-dc-brent-venables-explains-costly-play-calling-mistake-many-offensive-coordinators-make/
spot on, man i want him as our next coach so rough ridin' bad
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: bones129 on October 26, 2017, 01:47:33 AM
BV is clearly the guy to take over. Knows poor play calling when he sees it. Count me in.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: HELLHAMMER on October 26, 2017, 07:29:59 AM
Who will get the playing time now that Tanking has herniated ribs?  Surely there's a 5 heart walk-on waiting in the wings.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 28, 2017, 02:44:01 PM
AAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on October 28, 2017, 02:44:39 PM
AAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Haha
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on October 28, 2017, 02:45:40 PM
 :jerk:  playcall was fine, defense made a spectacular play
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 28, 2017, 02:45:49 PM
WE HAD FOURTH AND INCHES ON KU'S 4 YARD-LINE AND WE SET UP WITH DELTON IN SHOTGUN :lol: :lol:  :lol:


This is going to shock you guys, but we ran Delton out naked toward the right pylon and he was tackled short of the first down. Turnover on downs, thanks Dimel.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 28, 2017, 02:46:25 PM
:jerk:  playcall was fine, defense made a spectacular play


:lol: know how I know the playcall wasn't fine? Because it didn't work. Against an absolutely awful team.


We could've just lined up under center and pounded the ball forward six inches for a first down like we did successfully multiple times last week against a far superior Oklahoma team, but nope, had to summon the Ron Prince school of thought that vehemently repudiated traditional quarterback sneaks.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: chum1 on October 28, 2017, 02:53:41 PM
Getting stuffed there was a pretty big fail.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: _33 on October 28, 2017, 03:04:48 PM
What a chess match between Bowen and Dimel so far.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on October 28, 2017, 03:06:08 PM
Dimel should spend halftime crying on a staircase.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: _33 on October 28, 2017, 03:16:04 PM
It's almost as if teams prepare for our 3 plays.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on October 28, 2017, 03:17:25 PM
Dimel should spend halftime crying on a staircase.
:lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on October 28, 2017, 03:25:10 PM
Dimel should spend halftime crying on a staircase.

Hayes will be right next to him.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 28, 2017, 03:27:53 PM
Our coaches are getting schemed by a staff whose record is like 3-27 :frown:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 28, 2017, 03:28:30 PM
we needed to call timeout!!!  they're going to throw it in the end zone on fourth down!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 28, 2017, 03:29:13 PM
We are so rough ridin' stupid.  Had to call timeout with 40 seconds left to prevent just this situation.  eff me
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 28, 2017, 03:31:25 PM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on October 28, 2017, 03:32:56 PM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I think running a QB sweep out of the shotgun on 4th and inches is worse.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on October 28, 2017, 03:33:20 PM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.
You think that's the worst decision our staff will make this game? You're in for a treat in the second half.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 28, 2017, 03:35:37 PM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on October 28, 2017, 03:37:05 PM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on October 28, 2017, 03:39:32 PM
i think they go for it either way.  we would just take a knee if we got the ball.  maybe attempt one pass
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Super PurpleCat on October 28, 2017, 04:29:58 PM
Delay of game.  Never change, Bill.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 28, 2017, 04:40:04 PM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

It was the most mind boggling, amateur hour thing Ive seen
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 28, 2017, 04:41:39 PM
Very sad I missed it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: chum1 on October 28, 2017, 04:52:32 PM
KU went 97 yards for a TD. Now down 7. Our response: try to run out the clock with 12:00 to go in the game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on October 28, 2017, 04:55:33 PM
What's our record when leading to start the fourth quarter?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 28, 2017, 05:03:08 PM
Not topical, but props to Dimel for continuing to go with what works regarding Barnes in the wildcat.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: chum1 on October 28, 2017, 05:08:17 PM
Kirby on Sims? I don't know. Just asking.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BostonPancake on October 28, 2017, 06:05:30 PM
Kirby on Sims? I don't know. Just asking.

I think a player made a mistake and as a result, Kirby ended up on Sims.  I'm not going to blame the coaches on that one, unless someone else can show me I'm incorrect.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 28, 2017, 06:14:19 PM
Dimel should spend halftime crying on a staircase.

Yes!  :lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 28, 2017, 08:45:58 PM
Not topical, but props to Dimel for continuing to go with what works regarding Barnes in the wildcat.


Congrats to him for kinda a little bit doing his job for once
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on October 28, 2017, 09:26:20 PM
Man Guest has some really bad takes ITT
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on October 28, 2017, 09:33:43 PM
Ain't said crap


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Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on October 28, 2017, 09:33:54 PM
Shhhhiiittt


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on October 28, 2017, 09:34:14 PM
:lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ednksu on October 28, 2017, 10:51:04 PM
Man Guest has some really bad takes ITT

(http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/tom-delonge-wtf1.gif)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on October 28, 2017, 10:55:23 PM
I love that this happens.. I mean I get it.. but I love playing coy with it


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Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on October 28, 2017, 10:55:48 PM
Chignon should've waited until April fools day


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Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ednksu on October 28, 2017, 11:00:55 PM
No when did we start to add features?  I mean it's not like you don't see it when you quote it.  Are there any fresh emojis?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 29, 2017, 12:01:01 AM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

There was absolutely zero chance they would have punted if we called a timeout there. If we did call a timeout they would have only needed to pick up the first down to keep the half going. Not calling a time out was 100% the right call.

Even if it isn't what Guest would have done, you absolutely have to be able to see the logic at not calling the timeout there.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 29, 2017, 12:05:10 AM
Getting stuffed there was a pretty big fail.

For sure. The problem with the forth down call was the third down call getting stuffed. It seems the only play we run under center now is the play we ran on third down. There are a million plays we can run from under center with three guys in the backfield, apparently not in this offense.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ednksu on October 29, 2017, 01:19:38 AM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

There was absolutely zero chance they would have punted if we called a timeout there. If we did call a timeout they would have only needed to pick up the first down to keep the half going. Not calling a time out was 100% the right call.

Even if it isn't what Guest would have done, you absolutely have to be able to see the logic at not calling the timeout there.

Game plan that out a bit for me because I don't see that playing out that way.

They were at 4th and 14 at our 39 (the 3rd down was a 4 yrd loss/sack) with about a minute left. 

KU is deep on the yards and hasn't shown that much explosiveness (lets say plays over 15 yards).  If KSU takes the time out and leaves I think 45 seconds for 4th down KU can either punt and pin KSU deep which assuredly will mean Bill takes a knee, even if they get a touchback.  The other scenario is that they make a deep play miss the connection and it functionally serves the same as giving KSU another possession not really far from the average starting position that KSU has started with in the half it seems.  Best case for them is the deep pass working and it's a first down or maybe touchdown.  I think our defense has been the strongest unit to this point and I would trust them to keep KU to a play <14 yards and we get a possession with one or two shots from mid field.  It just seems like there is much more upside for KSU compared to the risk.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 29, 2017, 01:39:32 AM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

There was absolutely zero chance they would have punted if we called a timeout there. If we did call a timeout they would have only needed to pick up the first down to keep the half going. Not calling a time out was 100% the right call.

Even if it isn't what Guest would have done, you absolutely have to be able to see the logic at not calling the timeout there.
It just seems like there is much more upside for KSU compared to the risk.
I don't need to argue what KU would have or should have done, the point is there is no correct answer so the decision doesn't belong in the thread. If we did call timeout and they went for it and got the first down then people would have freaked out about not letting the time run out.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ednksu on October 29, 2017, 02:23:05 AM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

There was absolutely zero chance they would have punted if we called a timeout there. If we did call a timeout they would have only needed to pick up the first down to keep the half going. Not calling a time out was 100% the right call.

Even if it isn't what Guest would have done, you absolutely have to be able to see the logic at not calling the timeout there.
It just seems like there is much more upside for KSU compared to the risk.
I don't need to argue what KU would have or should have done, the point is there is no correct answer so the decision doesn't belong in the thread. If we did call timeout and they went for it and got the first down then people would have freaked out about not letting the time run out.

I really don't agree.  With the way our offense has been struggling we need to manufacture possessions anyway we can.  I see, and appreciate, your point that fans would freak out either way.  I just think the smarter play, fans be damned, would have been to try and get our offense one more possession with a minute left and 2 timeouts from midfield.  Seems like it could be relatively possible to get our sure-footed kicker in range at the least. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 29, 2017, 06:33:32 AM
KU had shown a lot more explosiveness than our offense at that point.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 29, 2017, 07:20:47 AM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

There was absolutely zero chance they would have punted if we called a timeout there. If we did call a timeout they would have only needed to pick up the first down to keep the half going. Not calling a time out was 100% the right call.

Even if it isn't what Guest would have done, you absolutely have to be able to see the logic at not calling the timeout there.

Game plan that out a bit for me because I don't see that playing out that way.

They were at 4th and 14 at our 39 (the 3rd down was a 4 yrd loss/sack) with about a minute left. 

KU is deep on the yards and hasn't shown that much explosiveness (lets say plays over 15 yards).  If KSU takes the time out and leaves I think 45 seconds for 4th down KU can either punt and pin KSU deep which assuredly will mean Bill takes a knee, even if they get a touchback.  The other scenario is that they make a deep play miss the connection and it functionally serves the same as giving KSU another possession not really far from the average starting position that KSU has started with in the half it seems.  Best case for them is the deep pass working and it's a first down or maybe touchdown.  I think our defense has been the strongest unit to this point and I would trust them to keep KU to a play <14 yards and we get a possession with one or two shots from mid field.  It just seems like there is much more upside for KSU compared to the risk.

Sorry man, MIR has spoken and said it was ”100% the right call.” :lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 29, 2017, 08:28:53 AM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

There was absolutely zero chance they would have punted if we called a timeout there. If we did call a timeout they would have only needed to pick up the first down to keep the half going. Not calling a time out was 100% the right call.

Even if it isn't what Guest would have done, you absolutely have to be able to see the logic at not calling the timeout there.

No rough ridin' way they go for it in 4th and 14 and risk giving us the ball at midfield. Not calling a TO was unequivocally the wrong call.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: tdaver on October 29, 2017, 09:30:35 AM
You guys are forgetting that Delton was done at that point and Sky had not played yet.  Bill didn't want the ball.  He succeeded.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 29, 2017, 09:45:58 AM
So give them a free shot at the endzone (which they almost converted)? C'mon, no amount of cynicism can overcome the stupidity that was not calling a TO.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 29, 2017, 09:47:30 AM
excellent point by my guy tdaver here.

And I know this is a pointless hypothetical, but even if Delton hadn’t just gotten sketti brain’d, do we really think our coaches would’ve done anything differently? I don’t. (Based entirely off of now years of clock mismanagement/WTF time out ineptitude.)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 29, 2017, 09:59:36 AM
excellent point by my guy tdaver here.

And I know this is a pointless hypothetical, but even if Delton hadn’t just gotten sketti brain’d, do we really think our coaches would’ve done anything differently? I don’t. (Based entirely off of now years of clock mismanagement/WTF time out ineptitude.)
Yeah I feel like people in this thread have spent more time thinking about time management than our staff
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 29, 2017, 10:03:18 AM
Actually...eff it. Even with Delton sketti’d, we still should’ve called timeout. We had already run Barnes out of the wildcat at that point and had success. So, if KU HAD gone for it on 4th and failed, we at least get one crack (or maybe even two or maybe even three!) to get it from our own 39 yard-line onto the other side of midfield for McCrane’s considerable range. If that Barnes-cat attempt gets stuffed and our coaches have second thoughts, we could've then had a clearer picture and knelt it out and it’s the same result.

Or, alternatively, we call timeout with :40 left and KU punts, we kneel it out from deep in our own territory. Same result.

Instead (!), we eff around, let the clock tick down to :07 and give them no reason to have to make any decision EXCEPT heaving it into the end zone (which I’ll remind everyone again, was nearly caught for a touchdown). The plan we took offered KU a chance to have a play with no potential upside for us but a huge potential upside for them. Our coaches are rough ridin' idiots.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 29, 2017, 10:18:49 AM
I think we can all agree the amount of questionable coaching decisions from this staff this season has been vast. With Bill's sickness, I think that can at least be partially attributed to him being around less and having less input into day to day operations. Either way, IMO it's a good sign that vast changes need to be made in the near future. I think squeezing out a couple more wins and a middling bowl game is still possible and hopefully will provide Bill a decent way to go out.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on October 29, 2017, 10:33:28 AM
Beating a down Nebraska in a crappy bowl would be the next best thing for Bill to go out on IMO. Only a conference / national championship would be better. And that’s not happening again during his lifetime.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 29, 2017, 12:27:33 PM
Actually...eff it. Even with Delton sketti’d, we still should’ve called timeout. We had already run Barnes out of the wildcat at that point and had success. So, if KU HAD gone for it on 4th and failed, we at least get one crack (or maybe even two!) to get it into McCrane’s considerable range. If that wildcat Barnes attempt gets stuffed, we kneel it out and it’s the same result as what we got.

Or, we call timeout and KU punts, we kneel it out. Same result.

Instead, we eff around and give them no reason to have to make any decision EXCEPT heaving it into the end zone, which I’ll remind everyone again, was nearly caught for a touchdown. Our coaches are rough ridin' idiots.

I mean, duh!

The choices were: 1) give ku a free shot at a TD, or 2) force a punt (ku was not going for it on 4th and 14 at the 40, good grief), get a shot at a block or punt return, maybe give yourself a shot at points but worse case they don't get a shot at points.

It's a decision point as obvious as "should I park my car on train tracks or not?"
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: meow meow on October 29, 2017, 01:19:31 PM
Ku may have even been able to run a quick out and get out of bounds with a second left to try a long field goal if they wanted, it was a pretty wtf is going on moment
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 29, 2017, 01:22:59 PM
That's true. They would've had to gain at minimum 14 yards, though, and that would've been difficult because of our no-nonsense, bump-and-run, tight coverage we've run all season long. #NeitherBendNorBreak
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 29, 2017, 01:49:11 PM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

There was absolutely zero chance they would have punted if we called a timeout there. If we did call a timeout they would have only needed to pick up the first down to keep the half going. Not calling a time out was 100% the right call.

Even if it isn't what Guest would have done, you absolutely have to be able to see the logic at not calling the timeout there.
It just seems like there is much more upside for KSU compared to the risk.
I don't need to argue what KU would have or should have done, the point is there is no correct answer so the decision doesn't belong in the thread. If we did call timeout and they went for it and got the first down then people would have freaked out about not letting the time run out.

I really don't agree.  With the way our offense has been struggling we need to manufacture possessions anyway we can.  I see, and appreciate, your point that fans would freak out either way.  I just think the smarter play, fans be damned, would have been to try and get our offense one more possession with a minute left and 2 timeouts from midfield.  Seems like it could be relatively possible to get our sure-footed kicker in range at the least.

Calling the time out gives KU another option to extend the half. Not calling the time out gives one, very.low percentage chance to extend the half or score. If you call that time out and KU decides to go for it, they need 14 yards, if you don't they need 49 yards.

Also you're arguing against your own point. You're saying if we call time out, KU punts. If they punt from there it's highly unlikely that were getting the ball near midfield.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 29, 2017, 01:52:03 PM
This is absolutely by far the WORST coaching decision we will have in this thread.  We gave them a free shot at the end zone because we were too rough ridin' stupid to call timeout with 40 seconds left.

I zoned out and/or was changing laundry or something. What exactly happened? Plz include setup, our coaches' dumb expressions, and everything else for posterity. tia.

They had a 4th down with about 40 seconds left. Our coaches didn't call timeout, so they were able to burn clock and take a free shot at the end zone instead of punting.

There was absolutely zero chance they would have punted if we called a timeout there. If we did call a timeout they would have only needed to pick up the first down to keep the half going. Not calling a time out was 100% the right call.

Even if it isn't what Guest would have done, you absolutely have to be able to see the logic at not calling the timeout there.

Game plan that out a bit for me because I don't see that playing out that way.

They were at 4th and 14 at our 39 (the 3rd down was a 4 yrd loss/sack) with about a minute left. 

KU is deep on the yards and hasn't shown that much explosiveness (lets say plays over 15 yards).  If KSU takes the time out and leaves I think 45 seconds for 4th down KU can either punt and pin KSU deep which assuredly will mean Bill takes a knee, even if they get a touchback.  The other scenario is that they make a deep play miss the connection and it functionally serves the same as giving KSU another possession not really far from the average starting position that KSU has started with in the half it seems.  Best case for them is the deep pass working and it's a first down or maybe touchdown.  I think our defense has been the strongest unit to this point and I would trust them to keep KU to a play <14 yards and we get a possession with one or two shots from mid field.  It just seems like there is much more upside for KSU compared to the risk.

Sorry man, MIR has spoken and said it was ”100% the right call.” :lol:

Why do you do this every weekend? Frankly I'm tired of it. We're having a completely normal, civil, message board discussion and you have to come thundering in being an inflammatory weirdo. rough ridin' get off of my nuts, creeper.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: HELLHAMMER on October 29, 2017, 02:21:19 PM
(http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ2fcGFZP9orYC4F2yoau-323FowaAPFrvX2dWqApDz0tjdQ4cy)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: meow meow on October 29, 2017, 02:47:00 PM
Ku is not going for it on 4th and 14
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 29, 2017, 02:48:44 PM
:lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 29, 2017, 02:49:21 PM
just trying to help you reduce the eye rolls around you (or whatever it was somebody else said) :dunno: :ump:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on October 29, 2017, 03:02:44 PM
90% they go for it if we call a time out
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 29, 2017, 03:11:00 PM
Maybe. They did have the ball on our own 41 5 minutes into the 3rd quarter and they punted it on 4th and 3, though. Whether or not the two situs can be applied to each other, though, I don’t know.

Probably the bigger issues, though:
A) We don’t have enough confidence in our coaches to have any idea what to do in late-game clock management situations, and
B) we have no faith in our coaches or our players to be able to dial up a stop on 4th and 14 against bar none the worst team in P5. A team that mustered 21 yards of total offense a week ago. :frown:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 29, 2017, 03:11:28 PM
(https://twinningforbooks.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/no-more.gif?w=240)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 29, 2017, 04:03:21 PM
does anyone actually know dimel or met him? just curious if he's a totally oblivious blowhard irl or just bad at coaching or handicapped by other elements of our staff/team or what. during tcu 2015 as he was blowing it for us, i actually turned to the press box and flipped him off and yelled, "you rough ridin' suck dimel," and like 20 ppl in section 8 laughed. there isn't anyone i've met who thinks he knows wtf he's doing.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pissclams on October 29, 2017, 04:05:01 PM
does anyone actually know dimel or met him? just curious if he's a totally oblivious blowhard irl or just bad at coaching or handicapped by other elements of our staff/team or what. during tcu 2015 as he was blowing it for us, i actually turned to the press box and flipped him off and yelled, "you rough ridin' suck dimel," and like 20 ppl in section 8 laughed. there isn't anyone i've met who thinks he knows wtf he's doing.

were you embarrassed after doing that?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 29, 2017, 04:09:21 PM
does anyone actually know dimel or met him? just curious if he's a totally oblivious blowhard irl or just bad at coaching or handicapped by other elements of our staff/team or what. during tcu 2015 as he was blowing it for us, i actually turned to the press box and flipped him off and yelled, "you rough ridin' suck dimel," and like 20 ppl in section 8 laughed. there isn't anyone i've met who thinks he knows wtf he's doing.

were you embarrassed after doing that?

hahahahahaha. are you aware that no one can intimidate me? and no i wasn't. at all. eff off.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: KST8FAN on October 29, 2017, 04:12:32 PM
does anyone actually know dimel or met him? just curious if he's a totally oblivious blowhard irl or just bad at coaching or handicapped by other elements of our staff/team or what. during tcu 2015 as he was blowing it for us, i actually turned to the press box and flipped him off and yelled, "you rough ridin' suck dimel," and like 20 ppl in section 8 laughed. there isn't anyone i've met who thinks he knows wtf he's doing.

http://cjonline.com/stories/092803/cat_dimel.shtml#.WfZDn3Zrxzk

http://www.chron.com/sports/college-football/article/Robertson-After-Dimel-disappointment-UH-can-t-2085642.php

Tom
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ednksu on October 29, 2017, 04:30:02 PM

I really don't agree.  With the way our offense has been struggling we need to manufacture possessions anyway we can.  I see, and appreciate, your point that fans would freak out either way.  I just think the smarter play, fans be damned, would have been to try and get our offense one more possession with a minute left and 2 timeouts from midfield.  Seems like it could be relatively possible to get our sure-footed kicker in range at the least.

Calling the time out gives KU another option to extend the half. Not calling the time out gives one, very.low percentage chance to extend the half or score. If you call that time out and KU decides to go for it, they need 14 yards, if you don't they need 49 yards.

Also you're arguing against your own point. You're saying if we call time out, KU punts. If they punt from there it's highly unlikely that were getting the ball near midfield.

Not to belabor this too much but you're misrepresenting my point(s).  I never said we would get the ball at mid field after a punt, in fact I said: "If KSU takes the time out and leaves I think 45 seconds for 4th down KU can either punt and pin KSU deep which assuredly will mean Bill takes a knee, even if they get a touchback."  The point was don't give them a shot down field, even if it is low percentage.  You hold them on 3rd down.  They have a low percentage of getting that first down (4th and 14), I would trust my defense to make that play.  I did trust them to prevent the touchdown but the risk reward is much worse for us then stopping them and getting another offensive possession.

I guess my point is which do you think has a great probability of success.
1) KU getting 14 yards with 39 seconds left, needing probably 20 yards after that to get into scoring position (35 yard FG). 
or
2) KSU defense holding KU on a 4th down play and preventing a 14 yard play and then a 25 yard play.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 29, 2017, 04:52:49 PM
does anyone actually know dimel or met him? just curious if he's a totally oblivious blowhard irl or just bad at coaching or handicapped by other elements of our staff/team or what. during tcu 2015 as he was blowing it for us, i actually turned to the press box and flipped him off and yelled, "you rough ridin' suck dimel," and like 20 ppl in section 8 laughed. there isn't anyone i've met who thinks he knows wtf he's doing.

http://cjonline.com/stories/092803/cat_dimel.shtml#.WfZDn3Zrxzk

http://www.chron.com/sports/college-football/article/Robertson-After-Dimel-disappointment-UH-can-t-2085642.php

Tom

thanks, tom. much obliged.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pissclams on October 29, 2017, 06:27:16 PM
does anyone actually know dimel or met him? just curious if he's a totally oblivious blowhard irl or just bad at coaching or handicapped by other elements of our staff/team or what. during tcu 2015 as he was blowing it for us, i actually turned to the press box and flipped him off and yelled, "you rough ridin' suck dimel," and like 20 ppl in section 8 laughed. there isn't anyone i've met who thinks he knows wtf he's doing.

were you embarrassed after doing that?

hahahahahaha. are you aware that no one can intimidate me? and no i wasn't. at all. eff off.

intimidate you?  you’re a rough ridin' downgrade dude.  your posting is such a car wreck, it’s hard to look away.
but congrats on screaming expletives in public at a 55 year old man who absolutely didn’t hear you.  you’re obviously proud enough of yourself that you chose to share your anecdote here with the world.  we’re all quite impressed, another example of you “effecting change”
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 29, 2017, 06:34:51 PM
I have been fine with Dimel throughout most of Snyder 2.0. He's put multiple top 30 offenses on the field during his time here and I can't fault that. However, this year I expected a Top 30 group, but according to the 2 major metrics we're at #44 or at #69 (not counting KU), which simply isn't getting it done considering what we returned. There is a clear disconnect there and its a major reason why we're 4-4.

Of course, you could say the same about the defense, though my expectations weren't quite as high. The metrics had them at #46 and #74, so again quite a bit of disparity between the 2, but still not very good.

Meanwhile Special Teams are at #15 pre KU and sure to go up, probably near the Top 10.

Regardless, both the offense and defense are not good. The offense IMO has provided the most frustration of any unit with 2 of the worst performances of any Snyder 2.0 team this year vs Vandy and TCU. That simply shouldn't have happened this year.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 29, 2017, 06:41:01 PM
I have been fine with Dimel throughout most of Snyder 2.0. He's put multiple top 30 offenses on the field during his time here and I can't fault that. However, this year I expected a Top 30 group, but according to the 2 major metrics we're at #44 or at #69 (not counting KU), which simply isn't getting it done considering what we returned. There is a clear disconnect there and its a major reason why we're 4-4.

Of course, you could say the same about the defense, though my expectations weren't quite as high. The metrics had them at #46 and #74, so again quite a bit of disparity between the 2, but still not very good.

Meanwhile Special Teams are at #15 pre KU and sure to go up, probably near the Top 10.

Regardless, both the offense and defense are not good. The offense IMO has provided the most frustration of any unit with 2 of the worst performances of any Snyder 2.0 team this year vs Vandy and TCU. That simply shouldn't have happened this year.

So, that all makes a lot of sense. But as a high football IQ guy, what do you attribute that to? Certainly, injuries and scheme have hindered us, but even our 2015 Hubener/Cook team managed to be pretty competent offensively. This season just seems so bizarre.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 29, 2017, 07:18:55 PM
So, that all makes a lot of sense. But as a high football IQ guy, what do you attribute that to? Certainly, injuries and scheme have hindered us, but even our 2015 Hubener/Cook team managed to be pretty competent offensively. This season just seems so bizarre.

Honestly, I'm not sure. I'd say the loss of Johnson and Najvar on the offensive line would be primary, followed by WRs underperforming and QB injuries.

Here are the 2 major metrics that I follow (S&P and FEI, from footballoutsiders.com) during Snyder 2.0. I expected this year to have a similar progression as we had from 2010 to 2011 and so far that simply hasn't happened.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/FB-Metrics-Snyder-2.0.png)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Trim on October 29, 2017, 07:22:01 PM
Opponents got better?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 29, 2017, 07:50:04 PM

I really don't agree.  With the way our offense has been struggling we need to manufacture possessions anyway we can.  I see, and appreciate, your point that fans would freak out either way.  I just think the smarter play, fans be damned, would have been to try and get our offense one more possession with a minute left and 2 timeouts from midfield.  Seems like it could be relatively possible to get our sure-footed kicker in range at the least.

Calling the time out gives KU another option to extend the half. Not calling the time out gives one, very.low percentage chance to extend the half or score. If you call that time out and KU decides to go for it, they need 14 yards, if you don't they need 49 yards.

Also you're arguing against your own point. You're saying if we call time out, KU punts. If they punt from there it's highly unlikely that were getting the ball near midfield.

Not to belabor this too much but you're misrepresenting my point(s).  I never said we would get the ball at mid field after a punt, in fact I said: "If KSU takes the time out and leaves I think 45 seconds for 4th down KU can either punt and pin KSU deep which assuredly will mean Bill takes a knee, even if they get a touchback."  The point was don't give them a shot down field, even if it is low percentage.  You hold them on 3rd down.  They have a low percentage of getting that first down (4th and 14), I would trust my defense to make that play.  I did trust them to prevent the touchdown but the risk reward is much worse for us then stopping them and getting another offensive possession.

I guess my point is which do you think has a great probability of success.
1) KU getting 14 yards with 39 seconds left, needing probably 20 yards after that to get into scoring position (35 yard FG). 
or
2) KSU defense holding KU on a 4th down play and preventing a 14 yard play and then a 25 yard play.

Oh, I don't think it was very likely they would have gotten the first down, nor do I think it was likely that the coaches would have let Thompson pass us into field goal territory, so why give them the opportunity to try to make that first down?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: RickRampus on October 29, 2017, 07:51:05 PM
dafuq
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 29, 2017, 07:59:03 PM
just trying to help you reduce the eye rolls around you (or whatever it was somebody else said) :dunno: :ump:

No one said crap. You say that like people are interested in reading you repeatedly ruining threads by doing this. Instead of offering me advice, maybe you can find some self-awareness. I'll let you have the last word. I'm done with this stupid crap, I'd rather continue talking about the cats and not some bum ass, weird rando.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 29, 2017, 08:00:00 PM
So, that all makes a lot of sense. But as a high football IQ guy, what do you attribute that to? Certainly, injuries and scheme have hindered us, but even our 2015 Hubener/Cook team managed to be pretty competent offensively. This season just seems so bizarre.

Honestly, I'm not sure. I'd say the loss of Johnson and Najvar on the offensive line would be primary, followed by WRs underperforming and QB injuries.

Here are the 2 major metrics that I follow (S&P and FEI, from footballoutsiders.com) during Snyder 2.0. I expected this year to have a similar progression as we had from 2010 to 2011 and so far that simply hasn't happened.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/FB-Metrics-Snyder-2.0.png)

Those special teams tho :love:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 29, 2017, 08:20:35 PM
(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/sean.gif)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 29, 2017, 10:08:25 PM
just trying to help you reduce the eye rolls around you (or whatever it was somebody else said) :dunno: :ump:

No one said crap. You say that like people are interested in reading you repeatedly ruining threads by doing this. Instead of offering me advice, maybe you can find some self-awareness. I'll let you have the last word. I'm done with this stupid crap, I'd rather continue talking about the cats and not some bum ass, weird rando.

we r buds, always have been, always will be :cheers:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on October 30, 2017, 02:59:30 AM
So, that all makes a lot of sense. But as a high football IQ guy, what do you attribute that to? Certainly, injuries and scheme have hindered us, but even our 2015 Hubener/Cook team managed to be pretty competent offensively. This season just seems so bizarre.

Honestly, I'm not sure. I'd say the loss of Johnson and Najvar on the offensive line would be primary, followed by WRs underperforming and QB injuries.

Here are the 2 major metrics that I follow (S&P and FEI, from footballoutsiders.com) during Snyder 2.0. I expected this year to have a similar progression as we had from 2010 to 2011 and so far that simply hasn't happened.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/FB-Metrics-Snyder-2.0.png)

thanks man, i reek of blood and guts and chum salmon head and am headed to bed. this chart really puts it in perspective and know it's appreciated from a guy who is just trying to follow the cats from afar.  :)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ednksu on October 30, 2017, 03:41:17 AM

I really don't agree.  With the way our offense has been struggling we need to manufacture possessions anyway we can.  I see, and appreciate, your point that fans would freak out either way.  I just think the smarter play, fans be damned, would have been to try and get our offense one more possession with a minute left and 2 timeouts from midfield.  Seems like it could be relatively possible to get our sure-footed kicker in range at the least.

Calling the time out gives KU another option to extend the half. Not calling the time out gives one, very.low percentage chance to extend the half or score. If you call that time out and KU decides to go for it, they need 14 yards, if you don't they need 49 yards.

Also you're arguing against your own point. You're saying if we call time out, KU punts. If they punt from there it's highly unlikely that were getting the ball near midfield.

Not to belabor this too much but you're misrepresenting my point(s).  I never said we would get the ball at mid field after a punt, in fact I said: "If KSU takes the time out and leaves I think 45 seconds for 4th down KU can either punt and pin KSU deep which assuredly will mean Bill takes a knee, even if they get a touchback."  The point was don't give them a shot down field, even if it is low percentage.  You hold them on 3rd down.  They have a low percentage of getting that first down (4th and 14), I would trust my defense to make that play.  I did trust them to prevent the touchdown but the risk reward is much worse for us then stopping them and getting another offensive possession.

I guess my point is which do you think has a great probability of success.
1) KU getting 14 yards with 39 seconds left, needing probably 20 yards after that to get into scoring position (35 yard FG). 
or
2) KSU defense holding KU on a 4th down play and preventing a 14 yard play and then a 25 yard play.

Oh, I don't think it was very likely they would have gotten the first down, nor do I think it was likely that the coaches would have let Thompson pass us into field goal territory, so why give them the opportunity to try to make that first down?
. Fair points. As you rightly pointed out, this is far from the most glaring decision.

Go cats.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: meow meow on October 30, 2017, 08:35:54 AM
does anyone actually know dimel or met him? just curious if he's a totally oblivious blowhard irl or just bad at coaching or handicapped by other elements of our staff/team or what. during tcu 2015 as he was blowing it for us, i actually turned to the press box and flipped him off and yelled, "you rough ridin' suck dimel," and like 20 ppl in section 8 laughed. there isn't anyone i've met who thinks he knows wtf he's doing.

were you embarrassed after doing that?

hahahahahaha. are you aware that no one can intimidate me? and no i wasn't. at all. eff off.

how old are you?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on October 30, 2017, 08:41:55 AM
Maybe del was more important than we thought
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on October 30, 2017, 08:43:41 AM
Maybe del was more important than we thought

Or is Collin really bad?  :surprised:

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on October 30, 2017, 08:44:17 AM
 :ohno:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 30, 2017, 01:47:15 PM
One last point on the end of half, non-timeout call.  There is no way KU was going for it on 4th and 14...and for all those saying they would have had we called timeout i ask this:  why didn't KU call timeout immediately?  If they would have gone for it had we called timeout, whey wouldn't they have called timeout themselves and gone for it if that's what was their plan?

Bottom line, it was a horrible decision to not call timeout and allow KU a free shot. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 30, 2017, 01:49:24 PM
One last point on the end of half, non-timeout call.  There is no way KU was going for it on 4th and 14...and for all those saying they would have had we called timeout i ask this:  why didn't KU call timeout immediately?  If they would have gone for it had we called timeout, whey wouldn't they have called timeout themselves and gone for it if that's what was their plan?

Bottom line, it was a horrible decision to not call timeout and allow KU a free shot.

They were out of time outs, used the last one on third down.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 30, 2017, 01:52:55 PM
KU had to waste a time out after an incomplete pass while running their two minute drill :lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on October 30, 2017, 01:56:41 PM
I think the smart move had we called a timeout would have been to go ahead and go for it on 4th and 14, based entirely on the way our coaching staff fails to manage the clock and the capabilities of our special teams to produce big plays. Against just about any other college football program, a coach would be insane to go for 4th and 14 and risk giving the other team the ball near midfield with almost 1 minute to play. I think Beatty would have punted because I don't think he is a very good football coach and coaches are just expected to punt in that situation, anyway. It's not like anyone would be asking questions about why he chose to punt on 4th and 14 after the game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: cfbandyman on October 30, 2017, 02:27:56 PM
Maybe del was more important than we thought

I have thought about that a few times. We've had issue adjusting in the past, but this year is probably the worst of it and I wonder how much Del was able to pull Dimel in. Or at least providing that steady hand to QBs that Collin still hasn't mastered yet.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on October 30, 2017, 02:36:55 PM
Fwiw right after 3rd down Joe DeForest texted Sean saying "if you call timeout we will Polamalu whoever you send back to receive the punt. See if I'm joking."
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on October 30, 2017, 02:43:12 PM
Sean texted back:
(https://i.imgur.com/6PQr0Q8.jpg)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pett on October 30, 2017, 02:54:18 PM
dimel was addicted to running to the short side of the field vs KU
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on October 30, 2017, 03:53:48 PM
down to the 3rd string qb and what's the first playcall? quarterback run!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Sandstone Outcropping on October 30, 2017, 04:16:50 PM
down to the 3rd string qb and what's the first playcall? quarterback run!
Stan was all  :love: when he saw this. "You wanna play QB for the KSUCats? Prepare to run the ball and deal with a bit of soreness after."
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 30, 2017, 04:53:42 PM
One last point on the end of half, non-timeout call.  There is no way KU was going for it on 4th and 14...and for all those saying they would have had we called timeout i ask this:  why didn't KU call timeout immediately?  If they would have gone for it had we called timeout, whey wouldn't they have called timeout themselves and gone for it if that's what was their plan?

Bottom line, it was a horrible decision to not call timeout and allow KU a free shot.

Nobody with a brain actually think ku was going to go for it on 4th and 14 from midfield. Not even Beatty is that stupid.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on October 30, 2017, 05:36:00 PM
down to the 3rd string qb and what's the first playcall? quarterback run!
Stan was all  :love: when he saw this. "You wanna play QB for the KSUCats? Prepare to run the ball and deal with a bit of soreness after."

lol

this is a much bigger terrible decision item than the 4th and 14. I guess it's more of a terrible philosophy rather than a terrible decision though. Which makes it more terrible, but still.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 30, 2017, 06:54:50 PM
I was at the Bedlam game in Stillwater when Pat Jones decided to call time out when OU had 4th down from midfield with 6 seconds left in the first half.  The problem was that instead of punting like Pat thought they would, OU decided to throw it to the end zone knowing the play would take at least 6 seconds so there was no risk.  Cale Gundy chucked it deep and it was caught for a TD, forever being known as the "Cale Mary".  That was one of the worst coaching decisions i can remember but it's been rivaled several times this year by our staff.    :flush:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: 'taterblast on October 30, 2017, 07:20:15 PM
down to the 3rd string qb and what's the first playcall? quarterback run!
Stan was all  :love: when he saw this. "You wanna play QB for the KSUCats? Prepare to run the ball and deal with a bit of soreness after."

lol

this is a much bigger terrible decision item than the 4th and 14. I guess it's more of a terrible philosophy rather than a terrible decision though. Which makes it more terrible, but still.

2 out of the last 3 seasons the QB depth chart has been decimated due to injury. i can't help but wonder if the coaches ever once consider that their offensive philosophy does more harm than good. the more time goes on the more i realize that CK7 was an absolute freak, and even he got 'sketti brained vs osu in '12.

all we ever hear about is how diverse the playbook is, how we can run anything.. and yet, with a promising freshman that has been reported to have a rocket arm (hasn't been allowed to show it), our first playcall with him shows no creativity or change from the previous quarterbacks. it's disgusting.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on October 30, 2017, 07:46:44 PM
Well said. We have a Tecmo Super Bowl offense of 8 plays.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 30, 2017, 09:26:47 PM
Well said. We have a Tecmo Super Bowl offense of 8 plays.

READY
DOWN
HUT HUT HUT HUT HUT HUT HUT HUT
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: KSURFC8 on October 30, 2017, 09:38:50 PM
Well said. We have a Tecmo Super Bowl offense of 8 plays.

READY
DOWN
HUT HUT HUT HUT HUT HUT HUT HUT

Nah.

Ready
Down
Hut, Hut, Hurt
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: meow meow on October 31, 2017, 10:08:17 AM
the qb run game/control the clock gives us the best chance to win because we are always facing teams with more talent because we don't recruit skill positions for crap
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on October 31, 2017, 01:20:34 PM
I was absolutely shocked that we ran sky the first play.

Also, it seems like we NEVER run quick hitches/bubble screens that jake threw a lot of.  Pringle and Zuber are not bad edge blockers, and those guys and heath can all run in space.  Why not get them easy touches?  It's been in the playbook in the past.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on October 31, 2017, 01:30:22 PM
I was absolutely shocked that we ran sky the first play.

Also, it seems like we NEVER run quick hitches/bubble screens that jake threw a lot of.  Pringle and Zuber are not bad edge blockers, and those guys and heath can all run in space.  Why not get them easy touches?  It's been in the playbook in the past.

Member that middle screen we ran to Sproles in the 2003 Big 12 Champ game?  Member?  Those were the days
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on October 31, 2017, 01:52:21 PM
I was absolutely shocked that we ran sky the first play.

Also, it seems like we NEVER run quick hitches/bubble screens that jake threw a lot of.  Pringle and Zuber are not bad edge blockers, and those guys and heath can all run in space.  Why not get them easy touches?  It's been in the playbook in the past.

Delton threw six or seven of these against OU.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on October 31, 2017, 02:28:29 PM
Where in the world has Heath been? He was our #1 or #2 WR last season.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on October 31, 2017, 02:54:03 PM
Where in the world has Heath been? He was our #1 or #2 WR last season.
hot dogging it, also strickland must be in the doghouse or the crap in the spring was all made up
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: CATILLAC on October 31, 2017, 03:17:01 PM
Where in the world has Heath been? He was our #1 or #2 WR last season.
hot dogging it, also strickland must be in the doghouse or the crap in the spring was all made up

It is really mind boggling at how horrible the receiving core has been this season. I felt Heath, Pringle and Strickland, were going to be studs and had so much promise coming into the year. If not for Gruntley  and Zuber our receiving stats would be horrendous.

I'm not sure if it comes down to a lack of chemistry between the QB and the receivers or just simply a lack of talent. Either way the W.R position has been my biggest let down for 2017.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on October 31, 2017, 07:01:20 PM

Bye, Bill.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 01, 2017, 02:07:17 PM


hahahahahaha. are you aware that no one can intimidate me? and no i wasn't. at all. eff off.

intimidate you?  you’re a rough ridin' downgrade dude.  your posting is such a car wreck, it’s hard to look away.
but congrats on screaming expletives in public at a 55 year old man who absolutely didn’t hear you.  you’re obviously proud enough of yourself that you chose to share your anecdote here with the world.  we’re all quite impressed, another example of you “effecting change”
[/quote]

How about you calm the eff down and get off of Pvegs' back for doing what is clearly the right thing. Go join some religious orthodoxy if you want to judge others. It's pretty clear that you get off on it.
[/quote]uhhh wtf?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BrokenSky1113 on November 01, 2017, 02:12:29 PM
The quotes were a struggle. Clearly I'm rusty.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on November 01, 2017, 02:21:48 PM
Rusty wouldn't post something that stupid  :Rusty:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on November 01, 2017, 03:34:23 PM
you guys are funny
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 01, 2017, 03:43:02 PM
The quotes were a struggle. Clearly I'm rusty.
id say its more whats in the quote than anything
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: wetwillie on November 01, 2017, 05:36:55 PM
He didn't eff up this thread anymore than Guest did
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 01, 2017, 05:38:49 PM
Look at how our awful coaches are tearing this board apart. Maybe Beems was right about gE's future. :frown:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: fatdamon on November 01, 2017, 06:08:32 PM
Look at how our awful coaches are tearing this board apart. Maybe Beems was right about gE's future. :frown:

Maybe this board wouldn’t be falling apart if you would get off ur duff and give the people a song already
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 01, 2017, 06:15:47 PM
Next song will definitely be about Guest.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on November 01, 2017, 06:22:31 PM


Next song will definitely be about Guest.

:excited:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on November 02, 2017, 02:44:56 AM
does anyone actually know dimel or met him? just curious if he's a totally oblivious blowhard irl or just bad at coaching or handicapped by other elements of our staff/team or what. during tcu 2015 as he was blowing it for us, i actually turned to the press box and flipped him off and yelled, "you rough ridin' suck dimel," and like 20 ppl in section 8 laughed. there isn't anyone i've met who thinks he knows wtf he's doing.

were you embarrassed after doing that?

hahahahahaha. are you aware that no one can intimidate me? and no i wasn't. at all. eff off.

intimidate you?  you’re a rough ridin' downgrade dude.  your posting is such a car wreck, it’s hard to look away.
but congrats on screaming expletives in public at a 55 year old man who absolutely didn’t hear you.  you’re obviously proud enough of yourself that you chose to share your anecdote here with the world.  we’re all quite impressed, another example of you “effecting change”

clams, kids being present is always on my mind. the section 8 folks at the time were a core constituent of friends, relatives, and other people i knew from games who are not you. i'm not trying to impress anyone. relax and enjoy your night.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Clevey No Mo on November 03, 2017, 09:30:13 AM
He didn't eff up this thread anymore than Guest did

Ha. This made me laugh.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: LickNeckey on November 03, 2017, 03:21:14 PM
 :driving:

  :love::love:song idea :love: :love:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: LickNeckey on November 03, 2017, 03:22:02 PM
He didn't eff up this thread anymore than Guest did

Ha. This made me laugh.

 :gocho:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ednksu on November 04, 2017, 05:02:51 PM
I questioned going for the field goal down 11.  I worried about them getting that field goal.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on November 04, 2017, 05:33:37 PM
TTU made KSU Coaching decisions look like amateur hour.  42 seconds left, you have the ball, and with that offense rolling, they played it safe.

That. Was. Bad.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 10, 2017, 08:21:35 AM
 :gocho:

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: TownieCat on November 10, 2017, 08:31:31 AM
Makes sense with Origami Rose, but Tanking  :surprised:

Also, weird thread to post this in.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: LickNeckey on November 10, 2017, 10:26:51 AM
 :cheers:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 11, 2017, 02:13:12 PM
Osu is really making me scratch my head
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pissclams on November 11, 2017, 02:21:22 PM
later, flowers
cheap shot
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 11, 2017, 02:42:44 PM
Why not go for two if your isu?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Super PurpleCat on November 11, 2017, 03:10:52 PM
Our offense so far today.   :facepalm:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2017, 04:19:36 PM
 Run well then abandon it
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 11, 2017, 04:32:18 PM
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HOLY eff THAT WAS THE WORST ONE YET.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on November 11, 2017, 04:33:07 PM
Booooooooooo
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on November 11, 2017, 04:33:34 PM
Was just going to say that. Coaching 100% cost us those 7 points.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 11, 2017, 04:41:49 PM
Screen pass to your son for no other plausible reason than to pad his stats....resulting in an INT that cost us 7 points.  15 seconds left from the 35 and you call that play?  That is indefensible.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on November 11, 2017, 04:43:06 PM
Not just 15 seconds left. Letting the clock run down 30 seconds and THEN calling that play.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pendergast on November 11, 2017, 04:45:07 PM
Screen pass to your son for no other plausible reason than to pad his stats....resulting in an INT that cost us 7 points.  15 seconds left from the 35 and you call that play?  That is indefensible.

Yes, all of this.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on November 11, 2017, 04:46:54 PM
I, for one, was surprised that wv opted to have their QB scramble in the backfield then throw up a hail Mary on the last play of the half, and I'm not sure how any reasonable person could have prepared for the possiblity that they might run a play similar to that
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 11, 2017, 04:47:06 PM
Okay, so for posterity's sake, here's what just happened.


K-State is down 21-20 right at the end of the first half. We scored our previous TD with about 1:30 left in the half or so; kinda worrisome because they have shown a propensity to score fast. But NOPE! Our D comes up with its 4th turnover of the game with ~:45 left in the half! Holy crap, we're down one with nearly a minute and two timeouts left, and we have the ball at about our own 40 yard-line! What will we do??? Will we...A) Throw a few 8-10 yard outs, call time out, and kick a field goal right before half, B) play it safe and sit on it, content to take it to the lockerroom down one?  C) Do a weird hybrid where we simultaneously do both and neither, and end up with a dogshit result/?

If you said C, you are CORRECT!

Here's how it played out.

On 1st and 10 from our own 40, with 2TO left, we get sacked. Okay, fine, it happens. We should probably call one of our two timeouts so we can stop the clock, right? Nope, it seems since it's now 2nd and 14 from our own 36, we're just gonna let the clock run out. Okay, that works.

HEY WAIT, WE RAN ~25 SECONDS OFF THE CLOCK AND THEN DECIDED TO RUN A PLAY WITH LIKE 15 SECONDS LEFT? WHY???? Well, at least we're going to throw it downfield, right? Nope. Instead, we throw a.....screen pass?!? Oh and btw it got intercepted with 10 seconds left.

Ensuing play from scrimmage....10 seconds left, Will Grier eludes our laughable pass rush a la Bish vs. Ohio U., and then...well...a wide open WVU receiver catches it in the end zone.

Instead of us going up 23-21 or maybe even 27-21 right before half, our shitty, indecisive coaches, amidst a chorus of boos, led the team into the lockerroom down 28-20.

And we have to kickoff when we come out in the 3rd quarter.

Chip Kelly and the halftime crew were basically LOL'n at our shitty-ass coaches.


Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 11, 2017, 04:49:06 PM
What an embarrassment.

And until that moronic sequence we were +4 in TO margin and still losing by 1.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SdK on November 11, 2017, 04:50:35 PM
Boooooooooo
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Steffy08 on November 11, 2017, 04:52:43 PM
I'm no great defensive mind, but can someone explain to me how we have 4 guys after quarterback, leaving 7 guys to cover, and yet have man-to-man coverage in the end zone?  With no time left?  Why are our linebackers guarding the 25 yard line in that situation?

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on November 11, 2017, 04:52:56 PM
SB that's all needed to be documented and I appreciate you for it, but I want so hard to forget that any of that just happened. I have a feeling that will be the case for this entire game
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pendergast on November 11, 2017, 04:54:16 PM
All the BS they say about "Bill Teams" in the pre-game is completely gone now.  You also hear this crap from the old fans who would let him coach from his deathbed.

1. They don't beat themselves  :ROFL:
2. They don't have a lot of penalties   :'bye cruel world:
3. They play tough (see also hard nosed) football  :dunno:
4. They have great game plans  :curse:
5. They play smart football  :dubious:
6. Something about pinocchio  :buh-bye:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on November 11, 2017, 04:54:36 PM
I'm no great defensive mind, but can someone explain to me how we have 4 guys after quarterback, leaving 7 guys to cover, and yet have man-to-man coverage in the end zone?  With no time left?  Why are our linebackers guarding the 25 yard line in that situation?

It's hard to guard good receivers for over 10 seconds
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on November 11, 2017, 04:55:08 PM
I, for one, was surprised that wv opted to have their QB scramble in the backfield then throw up a hail Mary on the last play of the half, and I'm not sure how any reasonable person could have prepared for the possiblity that they might run a play similar to that
Maybe looking at the three plays they ran prior to that and realizing you were lucky as eff that any of those Hail Mary's didn't connect
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 11, 2017, 04:58:23 PM
Wvu not running that exact same play on 4th
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Joker on November 11, 2017, 04:59:36 PM

Chip Kelly and the halftime crew were basically LOL'n at our shitty-ass coaches.

The entire WV coaching staff were laughing their asses off.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 11, 2017, 05:03:40 PM
It was as absurd a sequence as I've seen since Marshall decided to throw the ball at the end of the game when we played in Huntington that one time.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 11, 2017, 05:40:59 PM
After scoring 20 points in the first half after getting FOUR TURNOVERS, and then scoring a whole zero points in the third quarter, I’m almost glad we’re about to kick a FG here to bring it to 23-28. It saves me the seizure I would inevitably have had when, after our hypothetical TD,  our coaches would have kicked the PAT to bring it to 27-28 rather than go for 2 to tie the game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2017, 06:55:59 PM
That sequence to end the first half was the worst display of coaching I think I’ve ever seen.  SkiBen did a really good job of explaining it.  Like, if we’re gonna go and try and score, then just rough ridin' do it.

I thought after that first play we would just let the clock run out.  When we threw that horrendous screen pass there actually wasn’t a whole lot of emotion at the game.  Everyone was just kind of like WTF?  Then the TD everyone just kind of was like whatever. 

Absolutely rough ridin' garbage.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2017, 07:27:42 PM
Okay, so for posterity's sake, here's what just happened.


K-State is down 21-20 right at the end of the first half. We scored our previous TD with about 1:30 left in the half or so; kinda worrisome because they have shown a propensity to score fast. But NOPE! Our D comes up with its 4th turnover of the game with ~:45 left in the half! Holy crap, we're down one with nearly a minute and two timeouts left, and we have the ball at about our own 40 yard-line! What will we do??? Will we...A) Throw a few 8-10 yard outs, call time out, and kick a field goal right before half, B) play it safe and sit on it, content to take it to the lockerroom down one?  C) Do a weird hybrid where we simultaneously do both and neither, and end up with a dogshit result/?

If you said C, you are CORRECT!

Here's how it played out.

On 1st and 10 from our own 40, with 2TO left, we get sacked. Okay, fine, it happens. We should probably call one of our two timeouts so we can stop the clock, right? Nope, it seems since it's now 2nd and 14 from our own 36, we're just gonna let the clock run out. Okay, that works.

HEY WAIT, WE RAN ~25 SECONDS OFF THE CLOCK AND THEN DECIDED TO RUN A PLAY WITH LIKE 15 SECONDS LEFT? WHY???? Well, at least we're going to throw it downfield, right? Nope. Instead, we throw a.....screen pass?!? Oh and btw it got intercepted with 10 seconds left.

Ensuing play from scrimmage....10 seconds left, Will Grier eludes our laughable pass rush a la Bish vs. Ohio U., and then...well...a wide open WVU receiver catches it in the end zone.

Instead of us going up 23-21 or maybe even 27-21 right before half, our shitty, indecisive coaches, amidst a chorus of boos, led the team into the lockerroom down 28-20.

And we have to kickoff when we come out in the 3rd quarter.

Chip Kelly and the halftime crew were basically LOL'n at our shitty-ass coaches.

Great posts by you, whisker biscuit, and catastrophe. That sequence doesn't happen with a head coach and offensive coaching staff that's cool, organized, and in control. I can't imagine the chaos happening in the head sets after we got that fumble.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2017, 07:31:43 PM
I know it's nitpicky but, why didn't we call our last timeout at the end of the game and make them snap the ball again? They don't take many snaps under center and it was raining.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Justwin on November 11, 2017, 07:37:08 PM
Okay, so for posterity's sake, here's what just happened.


K-State is down 21-20 right at the end of the first half. We scored our previous TD with about 1:30 left in the half or so; kinda worrisome because they have shown a propensity to score fast. But NOPE! Our D comes up with its 4th turnover of the game with ~:45 left in the half! Holy crap, we're down one with nearly a minute and two timeouts left, and we have the ball at about our own 40 yard-line! What will we do??? Will we...A) Throw a few 8-10 yard outs, call time out, and kick a field goal right before half, B) play it safe and sit on it, content to take it to the lockerroom down one?  C) Do a weird hybrid where we simultaneously do both and neither, and end up with a dogshit result/?

If you said C, you are CORRECT!

Here's how it played out.

On 1st and 10 from our own 40, with 2TO left, we get sacked. Okay, fine, it happens. We should probably call one of our two timeouts so we can stop the clock, right? Nope, it seems since it's now 2nd and 14 from our own 36, we're just gonna let the clock run out. Okay, that works.

HEY WAIT, WE RAN ~25 SECONDS OFF THE CLOCK AND THEN DECIDED TO RUN A PLAY WITH LIKE 15 SECONDS LEFT? WHY???? Well, at least we're going to throw it downfield, right? Nope. Instead, we throw a.....screen pass?!? Oh and btw it got intercepted with 10 seconds left.

Ensuing play from scrimmage....10 seconds left, Will Grier eludes our laughable pass rush a la Bish vs. Ohio U., and then...well...a wide open WVU receiver catches it in the end zone.

Instead of us going up 23-21 or maybe even 27-21 right before half, our shitty, indecisive coaches, amidst a chorus of boos, led the team into the lockerroom down 28-20.

And we have to kickoff when we come out in the 3rd quarter.

Chip Kelly and the halftime crew were basically LOL'n at our shitty-ass coaches.

Since it's for posterity's sake, I thought we ran the ball with Warmack on 1st and 10 (instead of being sacked on a pass play).
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2017, 07:39:23 PM
That's correct
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on November 11, 2017, 07:40:21 PM
I know it's nitpicky but, why didn't we call our last timeout at the end of the game and make them snap the ball again? They don't take many snaps under center and it was raining.

Same thing occurred to me but I was also like, Dana knows Bill won’t call a timeout because he’s too classy. I know that’s not a great reason, but my backup is that the refs already dragged it out way too much at the end and I’m guessing the stadium was empty at that point.
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2017, 07:43:01 PM
I know it's nitpicky but, why didn't we call our last timeout at the end of the game and make them snap the ball again? They don't take many snaps under center and it was raining.

Same thing occurred to me but I was also like, Dana knows Bill won’t call a timeout because he’s too classy. I know that’s not a great reason, but my backup is that the refs already dragged it out way too much at the end and I’m guessing the stadium was empty at that point.

I was talking about this also with some buds after the game.  Pretty telling where this program is just throwing in the towel like that.  Bill says never quit but that’s rough ridin' quitting IMO.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 11, 2017, 07:55:35 PM
Okay, so for posterity's sake, here's what just happened.


K-State is down 21-20 right at the end of the first half. We scored our previous TD with about 1:30 left in the half or so; kinda worrisome because they have shown a propensity to score fast. But NOPE! Our D comes up with its 4th turnover of the game with ~:45 left in the half! Holy crap, we're down one with nearly a minute and two timeouts left, and we have the ball at about our own 40 yard-line! What will we do??? Will we...A) Throw a few 8-10 yard outs, call time out, and kick a field goal right before half, B) play it safe and sit on it, content to take it to the lockerroom down one?  C) Do a weird hybrid where we simultaneously do both and neither, and end up with a dogshit result/?

If you said C, you are CORRECT!

Here's how it played out.

On 1st and 10 from our own 40, with 2TO left, we get sacked. Okay, fine, it happens. We should probably call one of our two timeouts so we can stop the clock, right? Nope, it seems since it's now 2nd and 14 from our own 36, we're just gonna let the clock run out. Okay, that works.

HEY WAIT, WE RAN ~25 SECONDS OFF THE CLOCK AND THEN DECIDED TO RUN A PLAY WITH LIKE 15 SECONDS LEFT? WHY???? Well, at least we're going to throw it downfield, right? Nope. Instead, we throw a.....screen pass?!? Oh and btw it got intercepted with 10 seconds left.

Ensuing play from scrimmage....10 seconds left, Will Grier eludes our laughable pass rush a la Bish vs. Ohio U., and then...well...a wide open WVU receiver catches it in the end zone.

Instead of us going up 23-21 or maybe even 27-21 right before half, our shitty, indecisive coaches, amidst a chorus of boos, led the team into the lockerroom down 28-20.

And we have to kickoff when we come out in the 3rd quarter.

Chip Kelly and the halftime crew were basically LOL'n at our shitty-ass coaches.

Since it's for posterity's sake, I thought we ran the ball with Warmack on 1st and 10 (instead of being sacked on a pass play).


You’re absolutely right, thanks. Somehow I had forgotten that. In fact it makes the screen pass even more WTF’y, if you think about it. So we hand the ball off with 40 seconds rather than try to throw and strike downfield. Clearly gonna just run out the clock if we’re calling run plays. Nope! Better throw a weird screen to the coach’s son with 15 seconds left so we can officially make this the most inept exhibition of clock management yet so far this season.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 11, 2017, 08:02:53 PM
It would still have been a huge bonehead call had Warmack been the target.  But the fact that it was Dimel screams "i've decided to play it safe and run clock...i'll get my kid some garbagy stats on this last play"   I mean, what else can it be?  It would likely have been the final play of the half had it been caught.  What else was the rough ridin' point?  I think this play cost us the game...i really do.
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:08:42 PM
Here’s the thing everyone is going to be subjected to, though not everyone will accept...we aren’t going to be “good” again for a very long time.  I won’t say “never again,” but it won’t be for another near decade. 

I doubt Bill retires.  I bet he thinks he can somehow go out a winner next year, like he hoped he could this year...but he will go out a loser, and will have neglected recruiting for yet another year.

New program comes in, takes them 4-5 years to get their system going, and then it’s long odds against them being above average in the conference.  The most likely upside scenario being that they are a .500 in the conference type program (though that’s still not probable).

To sum up, I’d bet we don’t have another 9 win season for 10 years.
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2017, 08:11:15 PM
Well this blog only has like 2 years left max so you won’t have the “I told you so” posts, Pete.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 11, 2017, 08:13:45 PM
Here’s the thing everyone is going to be subjected to, though not everyone will accept...we aren’t going to be “good” again for a very long time.  I won’t say “never again,” but it won’t be for another near decade. 

I doubt Bill retires.  I bet he thinks he can somehow go out a winner next year, like he hoped he could this year...but he will go out a loser, and will have neglected recruiting for yet another year.

New program comes in, takes them 4-5 years to get their system going, and then it’s long odds against them being above average in the conference.  The most likely upside scenario being that they are a .500 in the conference type program (though that’s still not probable).

To sum up, I’d bet we don’t have another 9 win season for 10 years.

The only reason you have any idea what a 9 win season even feels like is because of one man...LHC Bill Snyder.  Call me a tuck or whatever you want, but he's earned the right to go out however the eff he wants.  I'll deal with these frustrating loses for as long as he wants to subject me to them. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 11, 2017, 08:19:28 PM
The only reason you have any idea what a 9 win season even feels like is because of one man...LHC Bill Snyder.  Call me a tuck or whatever you want, but he's earned the right to go out however the eff he wants.  I'll deal with these frustrating loses for as long as he wants to subject me to them.

that's such a loser mentality. you should demand more from these guys.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:19:50 PM
Here’s the thing everyone is going to be subjected to, though not everyone will accept...we aren’t going to be “good” again for a very long time.  I won’t say “never again,” but it won’t be for another near decade. 

I doubt Bill retires.  I bet he thinks he can somehow go out a winner next year, like he hoped he could this year...but he will go out a loser, and will have neglected recruiting for yet another year.

New program comes in, takes them 4-5 years to get their system going, and then it’s long odds against them being above average in the conference.  The most likely upside scenario being that they are a .500 in the conference type program (though that’s still not probable).

To sum up, I’d bet we don’t have another 9 win season for 10 years.

The only reason you have any idea what a 9 win season even feels like is because of one man...LHC Bill Snyder.  Call me a tuck or whatever you want, but he's earned the right to go out however the eff he wants.  I'll deal with these frustrating loses for as long as he wants to subject me to them.


Fine. Sure.  But, that changes nothing about what I posted.  Heck, I agree with you.  We are still going to suck for the foreseeable future tho.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:21:08 PM
The only reason you have any idea what a 9 win season even feels like is because of one man...LHC Bill Snyder.  Call me a tuck or whatever you want, but he's earned the right to go out however the eff he wants.  I'll deal with these frustrating loses for as long as he wants to subject me to them.

that's such a loser mentality. you should demand more from these guys.


LOL, we don’t and we won’t.  We have rough ridin' oscar Weber, and did you not see our god damn AD hire?  LOL
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:22:22 PM
Loving LHC Bill Snyder and knowing he will run the program into the ground is what we do!  We have done it before and we will do it again.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 11, 2017, 08:25:27 PM
it's gotta be the cancer. really mumped with his 94 year old brain.
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:26:50 PM
This is how mumped up K-State is...the second best thing that has happened to us is John Currie, because of our facilities that would never have happened without him.

Yet, Currie personally destroyed the third best thing that has happened to us, which was the rebirth of basketball.

And our best thing is running his own program into the ground, again, because of his fear of firing staff and getting to know new staff.


THAT IS K-STATE!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 11, 2017, 08:27:01 PM
I believe more than one coach can be successful at KSU.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:28:39 PM
I believe more than one coach can be successful at KSU.


Sure. I do too.  But, you know better than I do how daunting the math is on that happening within the next decade.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 11, 2017, 08:31:29 PM
Depends on who we end up hiring.  If we insist on picking from the Synder tree (not named Venables) we're looking at decades of mediocrity.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:32:15 PM
Totally agree
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:33:22 PM
Tho, there is a part of me that thinks Sean might, MIGHT, have the balls to go get a great staff.  Tho, that’s probably me being unrealistic.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:34:44 PM
I wouldn’t risk it.  If I were the KSU President, I would not gamble on Sean Snyder. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 11, 2017, 08:35:30 PM
who's decision is it to not pair white pants with the white helmet? i want that guy/girl fired.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 11, 2017, 08:36:38 PM
Tho, there is a part of me that thinks Sean might, MIGHT, have the balls to go get a great staff.  Tho, that’s probably me being unrealistic.
If he believes in the same philosophy of actively avoiding recruiting 4 and 5 star talent he will fail just as badly.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 11, 2017, 08:41:40 PM
 
I wouldn’t risk it.  If I were the KSU President, I would not gamble on Sean Snyder.

We have the small timiest AD in the conf.  He prob considers Sean the safe bet
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pete on November 11, 2017, 08:51:31 PM
I wouldn’t risk it.  If I were the KSU President, I would not gamble on Sean Snyder.

We have the small timiest AD in the conf.  He prob considers Sean the safe bet


I agree with you.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Justwin on November 11, 2017, 08:56:37 PM
Okay, so for posterity's sake, here's what just happened.


K-State is down 21-20 right at the end of the first half. We scored our previous TD with about 1:30 left in the half or so; kinda worrisome because they have shown a propensity to score fast. But NOPE! Our D comes up with its 4th turnover of the game with ~:45 left in the half! Holy crap, we're down one with nearly a minute and two timeouts left, and we have the ball at about our own 40 yard-line! What will we do??? Will we...A) Throw a few 8-10 yard outs, call time out, and kick a field goal right before half, B) play it safe and sit on it, content to take it to the lockerroom down one?  C) Do a weird hybrid where we simultaneously do both and neither, and end up with a dogshit result/?

If you said C, you are CORRECT!

Here's how it played out.

On 1st and 10 from our own 40, with 2TO left, we get sacked. Okay, fine, it happens. We should probably call one of our two timeouts so we can stop the clock, right? Nope, it seems since it's now 2nd and 14 from our own 36, we're just gonna let the clock run out. Okay, that works.

HEY WAIT, WE RAN ~25 SECONDS OFF THE CLOCK AND THEN DECIDED TO RUN A PLAY WITH LIKE 15 SECONDS LEFT? WHY???? Well, at least we're going to throw it downfield, right? Nope. Instead, we throw a.....screen pass?!? Oh and btw it got intercepted with 10 seconds left.

Ensuing play from scrimmage....10 seconds left, Will Grier eludes our laughable pass rush a la Bish vs. Ohio U., and then...well...a wide open WVU receiver catches it in the end zone.

Instead of us going up 23-21 or maybe even 27-21 right before half, our shitty, indecisive coaches, amidst a chorus of boos, led the team into the lockerroom down 28-20.

And we have to kickoff when we come out in the 3rd quarter.

Chip Kelly and the halftime crew were basically LOL'n at our shitty-ass coaches.

Since it's for posterity's sake, I thought we ran the ball with Warmack on 1st and 10 (instead of being sacked on a pass play).


You’re absolutely right, thanks. Somehow I had forgotten that. In fact it makes the screen pass even more WTF’y, if you think about it. So we hand the ball off with 40 seconds rather than try to throw and strike downfield. Clearly gonna just run out the clock if we’re calling run plays. Nope! Better throw a weird screen to the coach’s son with 15 seconds left so we can officially make this the most inept exhibition of clock management yet so far this season.

It's why I thought it was relevant.  I was pretty ticked we were running out the clock with 2 timeouts, but was willing to chalk it up to Snyder being Snyder.  Then we come out throwing on the next play and my head basically exploded.  My wife actually had to tell me that my one-year old son was about to cry.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on November 11, 2017, 09:13:37 PM

To sum up, I’d bet we don’t have another 9 win season for 10 years.

I would bet so much you are wrong about that. Like between $100-$500 depending on how good of friends we are.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2017, 09:54:37 PM
Pete has either completely lost it or he's just trolling his ass off.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 11, 2017, 10:15:42 PM
I'm not sure Snyder even knows what's going on anymore. Not because he's senile, but because there is a bigger disconnect than we've ever had from a Snyder coached team. Perhaps 04 and 05 were similar. The issues with mistakes and consistently beating ourselves are frustrating.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on November 11, 2017, 10:16:26 PM
Bill's postgame pressers are painful and frustrating to watch. Seems worse than years past.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 11, 2017, 10:20:07 PM
Saying we are blowing games is not something Snyder has done a lot in the past.

"As I shared with our players, and take nothing away from West Virginia, whatsoever, West Virginia’s proven to be a very fine football team, it was in our hands. It was ours to win or lose."
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Woogy on November 11, 2017, 10:26:22 PM
I'm not sure Snyder even knows what's going on anymore. Not because he's senile, but because there is a bigger disconnect than we've ever had from a Snyder coached team. Perhaps 04 and 05 were similar. The issues with mistakes and consistently beating ourselves are frustrating.

Disconnect as in the staff telling Bill "We got this, We gonna win! Can't miss this time!"

Or

Disconnect as in "having an impact" or influence on the players in a football sense...
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 11, 2017, 10:30:22 PM
Disconnect in that Snyder is truly a figure head now. He simply doesn't have the energy or input he once had. That helped make K-State great and now it's falling apart. IMO.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on November 11, 2017, 10:32:03 PM
Disconnect in that Snyder is truly a figure head now. He simply doesn't have the energy or input he once had. That helped make K-State great and now it's falling apart. IMO.

I agree with this. He's basically Joe Pa now (minus the sex scandal).  Only difference was, Penn State had legit coaches, unlike Kansas State.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on November 11, 2017, 10:50:03 PM
All of this pisses me off.  I love Bill, but if this whole rough ridin' charade is a tryout for Sean hoping to impress so he can take over.  I just, idk, this is so rough ridin' frustrating.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 11, 2017, 11:48:36 PM
All of this pisses me off.  I love Bill, but if this whole rough ridin' charade is a tryout for Sean hoping to impress so he can take over.  I just, idk, this is so rough ridin' frustrating.

It's not. Bill can't walk away. He can't help but think he's what's best for the program. That's what an athletic director is for, the big variable is if the biggest boosters will let him do his job.

If this was about Sean, Bill would stepped aside in July.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 07:34:26 AM
Expect some news today, not sure what but seems like a big deal
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: wetwillie on November 12, 2017, 07:49:37 AM
Tate is taking over playcalling duties!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 12, 2017, 08:04:45 AM
Are we firing Zenger?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 12, 2017, 08:45:22 AM
Disconnect in that Snyder is truly a figure head now. He simply doesn't have the energy or input he once had. That helped make K-State great and now it's falling apart. IMO.

I see some of this as well.  Honestly it's just something that is going to happen.  Hard to have the same drive/desire/energy in your late 70's as you had in your 50's.  All that said, it will be nearly impossible to ever replicate the past 30 years.  People excited for Bill to step down just don't appreciate how truly difficult it is to have sustained success at a school like KSU, or any other non-top 10 program for that matter.  Congrats to ISU for finding Matt Campbell and having a "nice" season....borderline top 25.  Who thinks he will be there for 5 more years let alone 25 if he continues to win EIGHT games?   The only way to have a chance at long term success is to hire a coach with significant ties to the school that "might" keep them here during sustained success....and that's assuming he can have success in the first place.  The next several years will be a trying and difficult time.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2017, 09:02:58 AM
Disconnect in that Snyder is truly a figure head now. He simply doesn't have the energy or input he once had. That helped make K-State great and now it's falling apart. IMO.

I see some of this as well.  Honestly it's just something that is going to happen.  Hard to have the same drive/desire/energy in your late 70's as you had in your 50's.  All that said, it will be nearly impossible to ever replicate the past 30 years.  People excited for Bill to step down just don't appreciate how truly difficult it is to have sustained success at a school like KSU, or any other non-top 10 program for that matter.  Congrats to ISU for finding Matt Campbell and having a "nice" season....borderline top 25.  Who thinks he will be there for 5 more years let alone 25 if he continues to win EIGHT games?   The only way to have a chance at long term success is to hire a coach with significant ties to the school that "might" keep them here during sustained success....and that's assuming he can have success in the first place.  The next several years will be a trying and difficult time.

yeah that's a pretty losery way to approach things. there's not a ton of jobs out there would interest a guy like Campbell and have that interest reciprocated.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 09:03:18 AM
Disconnect in that Snyder is truly a figure head now. He simply doesn't have the energy or input he once had. That helped make K-State great and now it's falling apart. IMO.

I see some of this as well.  Honestly it's just something that is going to happen.  Hard to have the same drive/desire/energy in your late 70's as you had in your 50's.  All that said, it will be nearly impossible to ever replicate the past 30 years.  People excited for Bill to step down just don't appreciate how truly difficult it is to have sustained success at a school like KSU, or any other non-top 10 program for that matter.  Congrats to ISU for finding Matt Campbell and having a "nice" season....borderline top 25.  Who thinks he will be there for 5 more years let alone 25 if he continues to win EIGHT games?   The only way to have a chance at long term success is to hire a coach with significant ties to the school that "might" keep them here during sustained success....and that's assuming he can have success in the first place.  The next several years will be a trying and difficult time.
you sound like an espn commentator, so sick of these talking points
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 12, 2017, 09:15:07 AM
Expect some news today, not sure what but seems like a big deal


Trying not to get my hopes up because I'm 99% sure nothing will happen, but that 1% shadow of a doubt has me :excited:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 12, 2017, 09:15:32 AM
Disconnect in that Snyder is truly a figure head now. He simply doesn't have the energy or input he once had. That helped make K-State great and now it's falling apart. IMO.

I see some of this as well.  Honestly it's just something that is going to happen.  Hard to have the same drive/desire/energy in your late 70's as you had in your 50's.  All that said, it will be nearly impossible to ever replicate the past 30 years.  People excited for Bill to step down just don't appreciate how truly difficult it is to have sustained success at a school like KSU, or any other non-top 10 program for that matter.  Congrats to ISU for finding Matt Campbell and having a "nice" season....borderline top 25.  Who thinks he will be there for 5 more years let alone 25 if he continues to win EIGHT games?   The only way to have a chance at long term success is to hire a coach with significant ties to the school that "might" keep them here during sustained success....and that's assuming he can have success in the first place.  The next several years will be a trying and difficult time.

yeah that's a pretty losery way to approach things. there's not a ton of jobs out there would interest a guy like Campbell and have that interest reciprocated.

Yes, i knew these posts were coming..."loser mentality".  LOL..this is reality.  I can accept that we hired a once in a lifetime coach 30 years ago that brought me more joy than i could have imagined.  I can also understand the difficulty of repeating that.  That doesn't make me a loser.  I "hope" we can hire a great coach that can compete for titles.  I "hope" we can be more successful with this hire than Texas, Missouri, Arkansas, Nebraska, (this list is sooo long) all schools we have so many advantages over.  :rolleyes:  The best AD in the world would/will struggle to identify and secure the next great coach.  Time will tell.  I'm pretty confident i have a firm grasp on expectations.  Those of you who don't.......
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 09:17:26 AM
Disconnect in that Snyder is truly a figure head now. He simply doesn't have the energy or input he once had. That helped make K-State great and now it's falling apart. IMO.

I see some of this as well.  Honestly it's just something that is going to happen.  Hard to have the same drive/desire/energy in your late 70's as you had in your 50's.  All that said, it will be nearly impossible to ever replicate the past 30 years.  People excited for Bill to step down just don't appreciate how truly difficult it is to have sustained success at a school like KSU, or any other non-top 10 program for that matter.  Congrats to ISU for finding Matt Campbell and having a "nice" season....borderline top 25.  Who thinks he will be there for 5 more years let alone 25 if he continues to win EIGHT games?   The only way to have a chance at long term success is to hire a coach with significant ties to the school that "might" keep them here during sustained success....and that's assuming he can have success in the first place.  The next several years will be a trying and difficult time.

yeah that's a pretty losery way to approach things. there's not a ton of jobs out there would interest a guy like Campbell and have that interest reciprocated.

Yes, i knew these posts were coming..."loser mentality".  LOL..this is reality.  I can accept that we hired a once in a lifetime coach 30 years ago that brought me more joy than i could have imagined.  I can also understand the difficulty of repeating that.  That doesn't make me a loser.  I "hope" we can hire a great coach that can compete for titles.  I "hope" we can be more successful with this hire than Texas, Missouri, Arkansas, Nebraska, (this list is sooo long) all schools we have so many advantages over.  :rolleyes:  The best AD in the world would/will struggle to identify and secure the next great coach.  Time will tell.  I'm pretty confident i have a firm grasp on expectations.  Those of you who don't.......
a loser mentality is accepting failure, which you are clearly doing and so does 80% of our fanbase
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Super PurpleCat on November 12, 2017, 09:17:54 AM
As I stood there at the trophy presentation last year for the Houston something-something bowl, I turned to the people around me and said enjoy this moment because this is Bill's last moment as coach.

It should've been.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 12, 2017, 09:23:35 AM
Disconnect in that Snyder is truly a figure head now. He simply doesn't have the energy or input he once had. That helped make K-State great and now it's falling apart. IMO.

I see some of this as well.  Honestly it's just something that is going to happen.  Hard to have the same drive/desire/energy in your late 70's as you had in your 50's.  All that said, it will be nearly impossible to ever replicate the past 30 years.  People excited for Bill to step down just don't appreciate how truly difficult it is to have sustained success at a school like KSU, or any other non-top 10 program for that matter.  Congrats to ISU for finding Matt Campbell and having a "nice" season....borderline top 25.  Who thinks he will be there for 5 more years let alone 25 if he continues to win EIGHT games?   The only way to have a chance at long term success is to hire a coach with significant ties to the school that "might" keep them here during sustained success....and that's assuming he can have success in the first place.  The next several years will be a trying and difficult time.

yeah that's a pretty losery way to approach things. there's not a ton of jobs out there would interest a guy like Campbell and have that interest reciprocated.

Yes, i knew these posts were coming..."loser mentality".  LOL..this is reality.  I can accept that we hired a once in a lifetime coach 30 years ago that brought me more joy than i could have imagined.  I can also understand the difficulty of repeating that.  That doesn't make me a loser.  I "hope" we can hire a great coach that can compete for titles.  I "hope" we can be more successful with this hire than Texas, Missouri, Arkansas, Nebraska, (this list is sooo long) all schools we have so many advantages over.  :rolleyes:  The best AD in the world would/will struggle to identify and secure the next great coach.  Time will tell.  I'm pretty confident i have a firm grasp on expectations.  Those of you who don't.......
a loser mentality is accepting failure, which you are clearly doing and so does 80% of our fanbase

I think you have a clear misunderstanding of the word "failure"
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 09:24:28 AM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 12, 2017, 09:26:52 AM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.

Well hopefully the 20% "non-losers" will demand the AD hire an incredibly successful coach and ensure winning ways into the foreseeable future! Easy peasy! Huzzah!!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 12, 2017, 09:27:41 AM
I just don't understand the "we'll never be good again, so be happy we were for a bit" talking point. This football program is in a vastly different place from 1989. I think a good coach other than Bill can have success here. We have great facilities, a loyal fan base, daily flights for recruiting, and seem to be well funded. Accepting mediocrity is so losery.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 09:30:21 AM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.
im not calling anyone a loser, but thinking that only one man can coach this team successfully is ridiculous. And like above this isn’t 1989 anymore, i mean hell prince could recruit so it can be done.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 09:31:21 AM
I just don't understand the "we'll never be good again, so be happy we were for a bit" talking point. This football program is in a vastly different place from 1989. I think a good coach other than Bill can have success here. We have great facilities, a loyal fan base, daily flights for recruiting, and seem to be well funded. Accepting mediocrity is so losery.

I'm not saying that, I'm saying getting a 30 year coach like Bill that has enormous success isn't likely. I do think its much more likely that when we get a successful coach, he jumps from K-State for a bigger opportunity if he has large levels of success. I don't think that should be a deterrent in hiring anyone, but I think its the likely reality of who we are.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 09:32:24 AM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.

Well hopefully the 20% "non-losers" will demand the AD hire an incredibly successful coach and ensure winning ways into the foreseeable future! Easy peasy! Huzzah!!
a) i  never said anyone was a loser, just that you have a loser mentality. B) if bill retired today would you be okay with it or mad?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 09:33:29 AM
B) if bill retired today would you be okay with it or mad?

Bill absolutely needs to retire and the program needs to move on. Bill around in a lesser role because of age and illness is no good for this program as this season shows.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 09:37:54 AM
Whatever happens needs to happen fast
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 12, 2017, 09:38:52 AM
I'm not sure having a thirty year coach is a great thing to shoot for.  That era of coaching is essentially over.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 12, 2017, 09:40:42 AM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.
im not calling anyone a loser, but thinking that only one man can coach this team successfully is ridiculous. And like above this isn’t 1989 anymore, i mean hell prince could recruit so it can be done.

Are you and EOSU suggesting that myself and the other 80% of our loser fanbase will be happy with winning 5 games a year? I think you don't fully grasp what i am saying or you are making a straw man argument.  6 years ago when i got married my wife wrote my vows and they included this phrase:  "whether KState is playing well or playing poorly"  IN MY WEDDING VOWS!  So don't misunderstand what i am saying here.  I desperately want to win, but it will be much, much harder than most people like yourself (maybe the 20% non-losers you speak of) expect or want to accept. 

And if Bill retires today, i will be very sad.  It will truly be the end of a wonderful era.  My 70 year old mother cried for 3 days when Bill retired the first time.  That's how i feel.  I'm sad.  Yes it probably needs to happen but i am sad.  Kinda like when George pulled the trigger on Lennie.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 12, 2017, 09:42:11 AM
Coaches jump ship all the time, at many programs. That's just the reality of today's game, and I'm fine with that. I hope our AD makes a good decision in the near future.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 09:43:36 AM
I'm not sure having a thirty year coach is a great thing to shoot for.  That era of coaching is essentially over.

Probably so, but guys like Patterson and Gundy are having nice extended careers.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 12, 2017, 09:45:51 AM
If we want a 30 year coach, it'll have to be Sean.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 09:47:03 AM
I'm hoping for a really good 10-15 year guy, but if we get a guy who gives us a great 5 years and jumps I'll be fine with that.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: wetwillie on November 12, 2017, 09:50:13 AM
Just hire Jim "oscar Weber" Leavitt and get it over with.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 12, 2017, 09:50:49 AM
I'm not sure having a thirty year coach is a great thing to shoot for.  That era of coaching is essentially over.

Probably so, but guys like Patterson and Gundy are having nice extended careers.
Right, but that's not the only way for KSU to be successful is all I am saying.

Trying to hire a guy just because you think he will stay for thirty years is a terrible way to find the best head coach you can get (as you agreed).
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Trim on November 12, 2017, 09:51:20 AM
Nothing about this year is weird as it relates to KSU. Our opponents collectively don’t suck as much as they have in past years. The game results this year shouldn’t have anyone any more concerned than when OBz legit couldn’t distinguish H3O and #LiFE.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 09:53:28 AM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.
im not calling anyone a loser, but thinking that only one man can coach this team successfully is ridiculous. And like above this isn’t 1989 anymore, i mean hell prince could recruit so it can be done.

Are you and EOSU suggesting that myself and the other 80% of our loser fanbase will be happy with winning 5 games a year? I think you don't fully grasp what i am saying or you are making a straw man argument.  6 years ago when i got married my wife wrote my vows and they included this phrase:  "whether KState is playing well or playing poorly"  IN MY WEDDING VOWS!  So don't misunderstand what i am saying here.  I desperately want to win, but it will be much, much harder than most people like yourself (maybe the 20% non-losers you speak of) expect or want to accept. 

And if Bill retires today, i will be very sad.  It will truly be the end of a wonderful era.  My 70 year old mother cried for 3 days when Bill retired the first time.  That's how i feel.  I'm sad.  Yes it probably needs to happen but i am sad.  Kinda like when George pulled the trigger on Lennie.
wow
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 12, 2017, 10:01:01 AM
If you've ever cried for 3 days because a cfb coach retired, you might be too invested, IMO. I love the cats, but i can assure you I will never shed tears over it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 12, 2017, 10:04:35 AM
Just hire Jim "oscar Weber" Leavitt and get it over with.

Exactly our plan.  We want to wait for him to get older and worse at coaching first
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2017, 10:57:43 AM
I'm not sure having a thirty year coach is a great thing to shoot for.  That era of coaching is essentially over.

Probably so, but guys like Patterson and Gundy are having nice extended careers.
Right, but that's not the only way for KSU to be successful is all I am saying.

Trying to hire a guy just because you think he will stay for thirty years is a terrible way to find the best head coach you can get (as you agreed).


yeah and if TCU and OSU can have runs like they've had with Gundy and Patterson, there's no reason to think ISU couldn't have something similar with a guy like Campbell.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 11:01:05 AM
yeah and if TCU and OSU can have runs like they've had with Gundy and Patterson, there's no reason to think ISU couldn't have something similar with a guy like Campbell.

Perhaps, but can they pay him? I know there were some other parts to it, but they couldn't even keep their home grown fantastic basketball coach. Patterson is top 10 ($5+ mil) and Gundy top 20 (4+ mil) in salary, ISU isn't paying that type of money.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: wetwillie on November 12, 2017, 11:04:32 AM
yeah and if TCU and OSU can have runs like they've had with Gundy and Patterson, there's no reason to think ISU couldn't have something similar with a guy like Campbell.

Perhaps, but can they pay him? I know there were some other parts to it, but they couldn't even keep their home grown fantastic basketball coach. Patterson is top 10 ($5+ mil) and Gundy top 20 (4+ mil) in salary, ISU isn't paying that type of money.

Why do you think ISU won't shell out 4 million a year to keep a football coach?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 12, 2017, 11:05:24 AM
yeah and if TCU and OSU can have runs like they've had with Gundy and Patterson, there's no reason to think ISU couldn't have something similar with a guy like Campbell.

Perhaps, but can they pay him? I know there were some other parts to it, but they couldn't even keep their home grown fantastic basketball coach. Patterson is top 10 ($5+ mil) and Gundy top 20 (4+ mil) in salary, ISU isn't paying that type of money.

they might? Haven't they had pretty significant upgrades to their stadium?

Hoiberg left for $5 million a year in the NBA - I know their AD seems like a weird cheapskate but that isn't like a crazy jump and no one in CBB was going to pay him that much.

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 11:52:27 AM
that why id love a hire like stoops/kelly/venables guys like that will put together a good staff and when they move on or actually retire hopefully you can promote from within (could be posted in this thread or the terrible ksu coaches thread but the point still stands)

I agree with that.

Of course if that doesn't happen I'm all for getting a successful group of 5 coach (especially MAC). That seems like the best case scenario for getting a good coach, at least that's my perception.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: HELLHAMMER on November 12, 2017, 12:41:34 PM
Whole staff has been out coached every game this year except the first 2.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2017, 01:02:04 PM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.

My issue with WB's comments, and I'm sure others feel the same, is there isn't an acknowledgement that LHC Bill Snyder is a unicorn and would be no matter where he was. If we were to step back it wouldn't be because we're Kansas State but because we're replacing one of the greatest coaches who's ever lived. It reads like whisker biscuit is saying the bigger issue is that we're K-State not that we're replacing LHC Bill Snyder. If that's what he meant I have a problem with that mentality. Every single program in America is one good hire from glory or a bad one from obscurity.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pett on November 12, 2017, 01:05:28 PM
Blitzing Duke on the long pass play to white on west virginia's first touchdown. Left adams in single coverage
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 01:06:42 PM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.

My issue with WB's comments, and I'm sure others feel the same, is there isn't an acknowledgement that LHC Bill Snyder is a unicorn and would be no matter where he was. If we were to step back it wouldn't be because we're Kansas State but because we're replacing one of the greatest coaches who's ever lived. It reads like whisker biscuit is saying the bigger issue is that we're K-State not that we're replacing LHC Bill Snyder. If that's what he meant I have a problem with that mentality. Every single program in America is one good hire from glory or a bad one from obscurity.

That makes sense and I agree with it 100%. Bill is/was a freak, we shouldn't expect a repeat of that, but he's built a foundation that any decent coach should be able to build off of. Heck, if Prince was able to get out of his own way, he may have very well been successful here judging by his original staff.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2017, 01:08:47 PM
If you've ever cried for 3 days because a cfb coach retired, you might be too invested, IMO. I love the cats, but i can assure you I will never shed tears over it.

I probably will but I'm not too invested. LHC Bill Snyder football became a thing for me when I was 18 years old. I'm now 41 with two kids who have had season tickets since they were in utero. My youngest looks for Bill when he comes onto the field, not Willie. That's the thing about Bill, my story is far from unique.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 01:09:33 PM
Blitzing Duke on the long pass play to white on west virginia's first touchdown. Left adams in single coverage

But then people complain that we never blitz and play 10 yards off all the time. If anything, we've blitzed poorly way too much this year as we seem to constantly end up with safeties or linebackers one on one on receivers. The biggest issue is our front 7 has an incredible ability to not make plays at the point of attack as we saw over and over yesterday. I'd say that Hayes has done a much better job putting his defense in position to make plays (especially compared to Dimel and the offense), just way too often our guys don't when they get to the QB.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 01:10:53 PM
If you've ever cried for 3 days because a cfb coach retired, you might be too invested, IMO. I love the cats, but i can assure you I will never shed tears over it.

I probably will but I'm not too invested. LHC Bill Snyder football became a thing for me when I was 18 years old. I'm now 41 with two kids who have had season tickets since they were in utero. My youngest looks for Bill when he comes onto the field, not Willie. That's the thing about Bill, my story is far from unique.

Same. In the fall, my facebook memories thing is me and my sons at games every week during Snyder 2.0. And celebrations of great wins in 11 and 12 and a few others in other seasons.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on November 12, 2017, 01:13:01 PM
Blitzing Duke on the long pass play to white on west virginia's first touchdown. Left adams in single coverage

But then people complain that we never blitz and play 10 yards off all the time. If anything, we've blitzed poorly way too much this year as we seem to constantly end up with safeties or linebackers one on one on receivers. The biggest issue is our front 7 has an incredible ability to not make plays at the point of attack as we saw over and over yesterday. I'd say that Hayes has done a much better job putting his defense in position to make plays (especially compared to Dimel and the offense), just way too often our guys don't when they get to the QB.

100%  Our pass rush was embarrassing yesterday and cost us the game.  Blitzing helped a lot in the second half, but so many other games it barely seems worth blitzing because our guys show it way too early and cannot get to the QB before our secondary gets beat in single coverage.

Also, a big reason WVU did not score in the second half yesterday is because of several (pretty terrible) dropped passes.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on November 12, 2017, 01:14:34 PM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.

My issue with WB's comments, and I'm sure others feel the same, is there isn't an acknowledgement that LHC LHC Bill Snyder is a unicorn and would be no matter where he was. If we were to step back it wouldn't be because we're Kansas State but because we're replacing one of the greatest coaches who's ever lived. It reads like whisker biscuit is saying the bigger issue is that we're K-State not that we're replacing LHC LHC Bill Snyder. If that's what he meant I have a problem with that mentality. Every single program in America is one good hire from glory or a bad one from obscurity.

That makes sense and I agree with it 100%. Bill is/was a freak, we shouldn't expect a repeat of that, but he's built a foundation that any decent coach should be able to build off of. Heck, if Prince was able to get out of his own way, he may have very well been successful here judging by his original staff.

Man, James Franklin and Raheem Morris was great.  Unfortunately, there is some risk to this that also could produce a Tim Tibesar.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 01:16:54 PM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.

My issue with WB's comments, and I'm sure others feel the same, is there isn't an acknowledgement that LHC LHC Bill Snyder is a unicorn and would be no matter where he was. If we were to step back it wouldn't be because we're Kansas State but because we're replacing one of the greatest coaches who's ever lived. It reads like whisker biscuit is saying the bigger issue is that we're K-State not that we're replacing LHC LHC Bill Snyder. If that's what he meant I have a problem with that mentality. Every single program in America is one good hire from glory or a bad one from obscurity.

That makes sense and I agree with it 100%. Bill is/was a freak, we shouldn't expect a repeat of that, but he's built a foundation that any decent coach should be able to build off of. Heck, if Prince was able to get out of his own way, he may have very well been successful here judging by his original staff.

Man, James Franklin and Raheem Morris was great.  Unfortunately, there is some risk to this that also could produce a Tim Tibesar.

And Scott Frost was a GA on that original staff!

But yeah, when everyone realized Prince had a gigantic ego for no reason they took off.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2017, 01:17:22 PM
yeah and if TCU and OSU can have runs like they've had with Gundy and Patterson, there's no reason to think ISU couldn't have something similar with a guy like Campbell.

Perhaps, but can they pay him? I know there were some other parts to it, but they couldn't even keep their home grown fantastic basketball coach. Patterson is top 10 ($5+ mil) and Gundy top 20 (4+ mil) in salary, ISU isn't paying that type of money.

Why do you think ISU won't shell out 4 million a year to keep a football coach?

I have my doubts that they can. Despite the first that their stadium is 10,000 seats bigger they don't nearly produce the football revenue that we do. Yesterday was perhaps the biggest home game in program history and they had tickets on Groupon.

Also keeping him in the face of the big programs who will come after him also means having the ability to also pay the assistants what Tennessee or Nebraska can. In fact this is probably the biggest and most overlooked factor in coaching moves. If school A wants to double the salary of your assistants, how in the world can you look them in the face if you turn that down?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 12, 2017, 01:18:48 PM
yeah and if TCU and OSU can have runs like they've had with Gundy and Patterson, there's no reason to think ISU couldn't have something similar with a guy like Campbell.

Perhaps, but can they pay him? I know there were some other parts to it, but they couldn't even keep their home grown fantastic basketball coach. Patterson is top 10 ($5+ mil) and Gundy top 20 (4+ mil) in salary, ISU isn't paying that type of money.

Why do you think ISU won't shell out 4 million a year to keep a football coach?

I have my doubts that they can. Despite the first that their stadium is 10,000 seats bigger they don't nearly produce the football revenue that we do. Yesterday was perhaps the biggest home game in program history and they had tickets on Groupon.

Also keeping him in the face of the big programs who will come after him also means having the ability to also pay the assistants what Tennessee or Nebraska can. In fact this is probably the biggest and most overlooked factor in coaching moves. If school A wants to double the salary of your assistants, how in the world can you look them in the face if you turn that down?

Yeah, its hard to see ISU stepping up. I mean, wasn't Hoi complaining about not allowing his team to stay in a hotel an extra night just a couple of years ago?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on November 12, 2017, 01:20:52 PM
Blitzing Duke on the long pass play to white on west virginia's first touchdown. Left adams in single coverage

But then people complain that we never blitz and play 10 yards off all the time. If anything, we've blitzed poorly way too much this year as we seem to constantly end up with safeties or linebackers one on one on receivers. The biggest issue is our front 7 has an incredible ability to not make plays at the point of attack as we saw over and over yesterday. I'd say that Hayes has done a much better job putting his defense in position to make plays (especially compared to Dimel and the offense), just way too often our guys don't when they get to the QB.

I agree with this, the main issue is that there is a huge lack of a pass rush by the defensive linemen.  And when they do finally get into the backfield, they somehow whiff so badly that the QB just easily spins off of them and heave a 50+ bomb.

Basically put, the D-Line isn't athletic as it once used to be.  And it's hard to expect Walker and Geary to get anything done when the offense know they can just double both of them while singling up everyone else.

Our run defense, for the most part, is OK, and that's what this D-line is built on.  But when they sub out Dishon and Geary, the subs aren't very good on getting any pass rush at all.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 12, 2017, 01:21:32 PM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.

My issue with WB's comments, and I'm sure others feel the same, is there isn't an acknowledgement that LHC LHC Bill Snyder is a unicorn and would be no matter where he was. If we were to step back it wouldn't be because we're Kansas State but because we're replacing one of the greatest coaches who's ever lived. It reads like whisker biscuit is saying the bigger issue is that we're K-State not that we're replacing LHC LHC Bill Snyder. If that's what he meant I have a problem with that mentality. Every single program in America is one good hire from glory or a bad one from obscurity.

That makes sense and I agree with it 100%. Bill is/was a freak, we shouldn't expect a repeat of that, but he's built a foundation that any decent coach should be able to build off of. Heck, if Prince was able to get out of his own way, he may have very well been successful here judging by his original staff.

Man, James Franklin and Raheem Morris was great.  Unfortunately, there is some risk to this that also could produce a Tim Tibesar.

And Scott Frost was a GA on that original staff!

But yeah, when everyone realized Prince had a gigantic ego for no reason they took off.

I was able to have some drinks with James Franklin at the national coaching convention the year after Ron was canned and he was adamant Ron got a raw deal at KSU.  It was just he and I talking so there was no ulterior motive or any reason for him to "lie".  Maybe that's just coaches towing the line but regardless, he seemed to really like Ron and thought he should have still been KSU's coach.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on November 12, 2017, 01:23:10 PM
I'm not going to lie, my thoughts on this whole thing are probably similar to WB. I suppose that makes me a loser too. That's why this season has been so disappointing; I wasn't even thinking Big 12 title necessarily, but I thought 9-3 was likely and a nice season for Snyder to go out.

I know its going to be difficult after he's done and that's coming soon. I don't hold any illusions that we're going to find another 25-30 year guy with the same levels of success (especially Snyder 1.0), but I'm hopeful we make the best hire possible and can continue with consistent winning 7-8 games per year and pushing toward competing for a league title every 5 years or so.

My issue with WB's comments, and I'm sure others feel the same, is there isn't an acknowledgement that LHC LHC LHC Bill Snyder is a unicorn and would be no matter where he was. If we were to step back it wouldn't be because we're Kansas State but because we're replacing one of the greatest coaches who's ever lived. It reads like whisker biscuit is saying the bigger issue is that we're K-State not that we're replacing LHC LHC LHC Bill Snyder. If that's what he meant I have a problem with that mentality. Every single program in America is one good hire from glory or a bad one from obscurity.

That makes sense and I agree with it 100%. Bill is/was a freak, we shouldn't expect a repeat of that, but he's built a foundation that any decent coach should be able to build off of. Heck, if Prince was able to get out of his own way, he may have very well been successful here judging by his original staff.

Man, James Franklin and Raheem Morris was great.  Unfortunately, there is some risk to this that also could produce a Tim Tibesar.

And Scott Frost was a GA on that original staff!

But yeah, when everyone realized Prince had a gigantic ego for no reason they took off.

Yeah, initially, I was pissed to see Morris leave, but back then I didn't know why until after everything just went south at the end of RP's tenure, where I understood why.

Man, if only RP wasn't a dickhead and checked his ego, he potentially could have been a great coach.  But it is what it is.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 01:23:32 PM
I don't think the pass rush was terrible we just can't rough ridin' tackle
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2017, 01:30:53 PM
yeah and if TCU and OSU can have runs like they've had with Gundy and Patterson, there's no reason to think ISU couldn't have something similar with a guy like Campbell.

Perhaps, but can they pay him? I know there were some other parts to it, but they couldn't even keep their home grown fantastic basketball coach. Patterson is top 10 ($5+ mil) and Gundy top 20 (4+ mil) in salary, ISU isn't paying that type of money.

Why do you think ISU won't shell out 4 million a year to keep a football coach?

I have my doubts that they can. Despite the first that their stadium is 10,000 seats bigger they don't nearly produce the football revenue that we do. Yesterday was perhaps the biggest home game in program history and they had tickets on Groupon.

Also keeping him in the face of the big programs who will come after him also means having the ability to also pay the assistants what Tennessee or Nebraska can. In fact this is probably the biggest and most overlooked factor in coaching moves. If school A wants to double the salary of your assistants, how in the world can you look them in the face if you turn that down?

Yeah, its hard to see ISU stepping up. I mean, wasn't Hoi complaining about not allowing his team to stay in a hotel an extra night just a couple of years ago?

He forced them to sleep in the ballroom.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on November 12, 2017, 01:35:03 PM
I don't think the pass rush was terrible we just can't rough ridin' tackle

But it isn't exactly great either, it's just inconsistent.

The big issue is that they can't tackle in the backfield, like you said.  Why is that?  Is it because of either coaching or player athleticism?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Pett on November 12, 2017, 01:37:52 PM
Blitzing Duke on the long pass play to white on west virginia's first touchdown. Left adams in single coverage

But then people complain that we never blitz and play 10 yards off all the time. If anything, we've blitzed poorly way too much this year as we seem to constantly end up with safeties or linebackers one on one on receivers. The biggest issue is our front 7 has an incredible ability to not make plays at the point of attack as we saw over and over yesterday. I'd say that Hayes has done a much better job putting his defense in position to make plays (especially compared to Dimel and the offense), just way too often our guys don't when they get to the QB.

I am all for blitzing to keep the offense off guard but lets not do it on the opponent's quickest player and #1 downfield threat

jennings - possession receiver
white - speed/downfield threat
sills - redzone threat
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 12, 2017, 02:16:57 PM
It was incredibly frustrating how many times we whiffed trying to get to Grier. I know he's a great qb, but my goodness. Just laughable.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: DOD Take 2 on November 12, 2017, 02:44:01 PM
Sure Hayes might be putting guys in position to succeed more consistently than Dimel/the offense but there is issues with technique and developing guys that apparently aren’t getting fixed. Goolsby has been burned badly multiple times this year by being flat footed. There’s others but that’s the first and most obvious one for me personally
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on November 12, 2017, 02:56:15 PM
I don't think the pass rush was terrible we just can't rough ridin' tackle

But it isn't exactly great either, it's just inconsistent.

The big issue is that they can't tackle in the backfield, like you said.  Why is that?  Is it because of either coaching or player athleticism?
I'm gonna go with lack of athleticism. Jordan Willis and Meshak Williams were able to get close enough to get a hand on the QB. And when they got a hand on the QB, he went down. This year we get close but our guys can't hold on for dear life or are too slow to adjust to the QB's lateral movement.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2017, 03:13:51 PM
I don't think the pass rush was terrible we just can't rough ridin' tackle

But it isn't exactly great either, it's just inconsistent.

The big issue is that they can't tackle in the backfield, like you said.  Why is that?  Is it because of either coaching or player athleticism?
I'm gonna go with lack of athleticism. Jordan Willis and Meshak Williams were able to get close enough to get a hand on the QB. And when they got a hand on the QB, he went down. This year we get close but our guys can't hold on for dear life or are too slow to adjust to the QB's lateral movement.

That's strength, not athleticism. Meshak and Jordan were very skrong.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on November 12, 2017, 03:19:39 PM
I don't think the pass rush was terrible we just can't rough ridin' tackle

But it isn't exactly great either, it's just inconsistent.

The big issue is that they can't tackle in the backfield, like you said.  Why is that?  Is it because of either coaching or player athleticism?
I'm gonna go with lack of athleticism. Jordan Willis and Meshak Williams were able to get close enough to get a hand on the QB. And when they got a hand on the QB, he went down. This year we get close but our guys can't hold on for dear life or are too slow to adjust to the QB's lateral movement.

That's strength, not athleticism. Meshak and Jordan were very skrong.
Were they not athletic? Strength is absolutely a component of overall athleticism. Doesn't change my assessment.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2017, 03:21:19 PM
I don't think the pass rush was terrible we just can't rough ridin' tackle

But it isn't exactly great either, it's just inconsistent.

The big issue is that they can't tackle in the backfield, like you said.  Why is that?  Is it because of either coaching or player athleticism?
I'm gonna go with lack of athleticism. Jordan Willis and Meshak Williams were able to get close enough to get a hand on the QB. And when they got a hand on the QB, he went down. This year we get close but our guys can't hold on for dear life or are too slow to adjust to the QB's lateral movement.

That's strength, not athleticism. Meshak and Jordan were very skrong.
Were they not athletic? Strength is absolutely a component of overall athleticism. Doesn't change my assessment.

Sure, absolutely; but the problem yesterday wasn't getting to Grier, it was getting him down when they got hands on him.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 03:30:11 PM
I don't think the pass rush was terrible we just can't rough ridin' tackle

But it isn't exactly great either, it's just inconsistent.

The big issue is that they can't tackle in the backfield, like you said.  Why is that?  Is it because of either coaching or player athleticism?
I'm gonna go with lack of athleticism. Jordan Willis and Meshak Williams were able to get close enough to get a hand on the QB. And when they got a hand on the QB, he went down. This year we get close but our guys can't hold on for dear life or are too slow to adjust to the QB's lateral movement.

That's strength, not athleticism. Meshak and Jordan were very skrong.
walkers was simple lack of wrapping up which I tend to blame on coaches but he hit him so hard he probably assumed he went down
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: wetwillie on November 12, 2017, 03:37:55 PM
Expect some news today, not sure what but seems like a big deal

:impatient:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2017, 05:31:25 PM
Expect some news today, not sure what but seems like a big deal

:impatient:

Oh, here you go
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 12, 2017, 05:58:07 PM
Expect some news today, not sure what but seems like a big deal

:impatient:

Oh, here you go
sorry, sounds like a several prominent defensive players were announcing transfers but all is cool as of now, safe to say the locker room was ugly yesterday
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Steffy08 on November 12, 2017, 05:59:49 PM
If you've ever cried for 3 days because a cfb coach retired, you might be too invested, IMO. I love the cats, but i can assure you I will never shed tears over it.

I probably will but I'm not too invested. LHC LHC Bill Snyder football became a thing for me when I was 18 years old. I'm now 41 with two kids who have had season tickets since they were in utero. My youngest looks for Bill when he comes onto the field, not Willie. That's the thing about Bill, my story is far from unique.

Same. In the fall, my facebook memories thing is me and my sons at games every week during Snyder 2.0. And celebrations of great wins in 11 and 12 and a few others in other seasons.

Kstate football is the tie that binds for my family, and Snyder is a huge part of that.  So many happy memories.  From my grandparents to my kids.

When he hangs it up, it will be very hard for me.  I’ve got tics for the whole family in two weeks, just in case that is it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 12, 2017, 06:18:52 PM
If you've ever cried for 3 days because a cfb coach retired, you might be too invested, IMO. I love the cats, but i can assure you I will never shed tears over it.

I probably will but I'm not too invested. LHC LHC Bill Snyder football became a thing for me when I was 18 years old. I'm now 41 with two kids who have had season tickets since they were in utero. My youngest looks for Bill when he comes onto the field, not Willie. That's the thing about Bill, my story is far from unique.

Same. In the fall, my facebook memories thing is me and my sons at games every week during Snyder 2.0. And celebrations of great wins in 11 and 12 and a few others in other seasons.

Kstate football is the tie that binds for my family, and Snyder is a huge part of that.  So many happy memories.  From my grandparents to my kids.

When he hangs it up, it will be very hard for me.  I’ve got tics for the whole family in two weeks, just in case that is it.

My family plans our family get-togethers (like my entire family flies/drives from all over the US) around the KSU bowl game and have since the 97 Cotton Bowl.  So many great memories.  It's probably the reason i bristle so much when this topic comes up.  Yes i can see the writing on the wall.....no I am not happy about it.  It will give me no joy to see him hang it up.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on November 12, 2017, 08:34:09 PM
Expect some news today, not sure what but seems like a big deal

:impatient:

Oh, here you go
sorry, sounds like a several prominent defensive players were announcing transfers but all is cool as of now, safe to say the locker room was ugly yesterday

Is this from Duke referring to transferring?
?s=17


Are they wanting to transfer due to the coaches or the fact that our dogshit offense can only score 3 points on four turnovers?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 12, 2017, 08:48:25 PM
I wouldn't worry about a starter transferring before his senior year.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 13, 2017, 05:43:44 AM
I wasn’t given any details, could be I have no clue. Timeline fits tho
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on November 13, 2017, 08:03:15 AM
Expect some news today, not sure what but seems like a big deal

:impatient:

Oh, here you go
sorry, sounds like a several prominent defensive players were announcing transfers but all is cool as of now, safe to say the locker room was ugly yesterday

Is this from Duke referring to transferring?
?s=17


Are they wanting to transfer due to the coaches or the fact that our dogshit offense can only score 3 points on four turnovers?

Duke just saved 15% or more on his car insurance by switching to GEICO
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 13, 2017, 08:34:14 AM
I think the whole team finna give up on this coaching staff
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Joker on November 13, 2017, 10:39:07 AM
Maybe Duke is just tired of playing like it's 1989?

Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ChiCat on November 13, 2017, 10:43:43 AM
I wouldn't worry about a starter transferring before his senior year.

Also, announcing it with 2 games and a potential bowl yet to go
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: everyone shut up on November 13, 2017, 11:20:57 AM
Maybe Duke is just tired of playing like it's 1989?


Gundy still has 1989 hair
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 13, 2017, 11:54:04 AM
Maybe Duke is just tired of playing like it's 1989?


Oh my God! I seriously cannot think of something more damming to say about a coaching staff. College football offenses have evolved at least three times since then.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Big Sam on November 13, 2017, 01:04:08 PM
I have not watched the WVU game as of yet.  It is sitting their on my DVR, just waiting for me.  I don't know if I can bear to watch it without losing my ever-loving-S.

Should I watch it, or would it be best not to do so and pretend it never happended?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: NeverII on November 13, 2017, 01:08:54 PM
I have not watched the WVU game as of yet.  It is sitting their on my DVR, just waiting for me.  I don't know if I can bear to watch it without losing my ever-loving-S.

Should I watch it, or would it be best not to do so and pretend it never happended?

Almost half of our possessions started in WVU territory. Six points  :blindfold:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: PIPE on November 13, 2017, 01:39:05 PM
I'm not watching it either.  Heard all I needed from my son who was there.  He's a senior in high school and he can't believe some of the stuff this coaching staff does..... :ROFL:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on November 13, 2017, 01:52:40 PM
I have not watched the WVU game as of yet.  It is sitting their on my DVR, just waiting for me.  I don't know if I can bear to watch it without losing my ever-loving-S.

Should I watch it, or would it be best not to do so and pretend it never happended?

If you like snuff films then I'd say you're in for a real treat.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: john "teach me how to" dougie on November 13, 2017, 02:27:43 PM
Running the wildcat with Warmack on first and goal from the 2.

Just pound it up the middle 4 times with Barnes, IT"S 2 YARDS!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 13, 2017, 03:19:38 PM
Running the wildcat with Warmack on first and goal from the 2.

Just pound it up the middle 4 times with Barnes, IT"S 2 YARDS!

Or just run a FB dive to Dimel.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: NeverII on November 13, 2017, 06:05:57 PM
Running the wildcat with Warmack on first and goal from the 2.

Just pound it up the middle 4 times with Barnes, IT"S 2 YARDS!

Or just run a FB dive to Dimel.

I've been shocked by the amount of touches Meathook has been given this season. He's got 14 carries and just 5 receptions. I'm assuming he's got some sort of nagging shoulder injury. Can't imagine him wearing that weird brace if he was healthy. There have been times this season where I felt like Dana was deterred by some of the nepotism remarks... and then the GD fullback screen happens :facepalm:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on November 13, 2017, 06:40:16 PM
Running the wildcat with Warmack on first and goal from the 2.

Just pound it up the middle 4 times with Barnes, IT"S 2 YARDS!

Or just run a FB dive to Dimel.

But then Barnes will be mad and transfer
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on November 13, 2017, 07:30:30 PM
Running the wildcat with Warmack on first and goal from the 2.

Just pound it up the middle 4 times with Barnes, IT"S 2 YARDS!

Or just run a FB dive to Dimel.


But then Barnes will be mad and transfer
And then Silmon will carry the rock until he wiffs on a block in the backfield and gets sat for a few game. He'll then elect to enter the draft. Then we'll go with McCoy until he scores a touchdown and fails to properly hand the ball to the referee after crossing the goal line and gets benched for the next several games and then transfers. After that we're screwed.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 13, 2017, 09:12:38 PM
Warmack though?

And Dimel's brace is absolutely what someone typically wears with major shoulder issues.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on November 14, 2017, 04:25:47 AM
Maybe Duke is just tired of playing like it's 1989?


 :ROFL: God, never thought I'd like Gundy. I hope they rough ridin' kill us on Saturday. Like, just total epic embarrassment.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on November 14, 2017, 06:47:48 AM
Warmack though?

And Dimel's brace is absolutely what someone typically wears with major shoulder issues.
Warmack was 'brained two games in a row running the Wildcat and decided to hang it up instead of participate further in the battering ram offense.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: PIPE on November 14, 2017, 08:36:06 AM
Expect some news today, not sure what but seems like a big deal

:impatient:

Oh, here you go
sorry, sounds like a several prominent defensive players were announcing transfers but all is cool as of now, safe to say the locker room was ugly yesterday

My source just told me that things are not good, players threatening to transfer, and players are tired of Snyder.  Says Snyder does not even come talk with the players one on one anymore.  He is just there. He said this offseason could get bad if Snyder returns.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: wetwillie on November 14, 2017, 08:40:18 AM
Someone call Shannon Spradling in to facilitate the mutiny!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 14, 2017, 08:53:41 AM
This makes some sense. I think many on the staff, especially defense, were thinking this was the final year going into the season. Hayes, Mo, and Fabris aren't in this for the long haul, so I can see as the season continues to turn south that the attitude within the locker room will as well.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on November 14, 2017, 09:39:34 AM
I thought mo retired with del
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: chum1 on November 14, 2017, 09:46:43 AM
Sean can fix it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 14, 2017, 09:55:36 AM
I thought mo retired with del

No, he's still on staff.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Sandstone Outcropping on November 14, 2017, 12:13:19 PM
I thought mo retired with del

No, he's still on staff.
Can you become Interior Defensive Line Coach Emeritus?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: manpow5 on November 14, 2017, 12:51:35 PM
Someone call Shannon Spradling in to facilitate the mutiny!

 :ROFL:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: LickNeckey on November 14, 2017, 01:07:26 PM
I thought mo retired with del

No, he's still on staff.

it is quite possible that both statements are true
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 14, 2017, 01:20:37 PM
Okay, I in no means am posting this to back track on the point of this thread, but....

Sometimes kids mess up in a major way...

Case in point; here is our last TD drive, 2 back formation and Warmack breaks off his biggest run of the day. https://youtu.be/d0wbL4MYub4?t=4798

Note, its a nice inside zone with the FB going left while the oline zone steps right. Warmack has the option to read the defense and follow his FB left or cut back to the right. He makes the correct decision and breaks off a great run.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Warmack-1.png)

Now, let's fast forward to our next drive, the ill fated drive to end the first half. The first play here is the same running game concept, though the formation is different. Last time we ran the ball to the TE side with twin receivers opposite. This time the run is the twins side, with another split receiver opposite. https://youtu.be/d0wbL4MYub4?t=5330

Regardless, we get nearly the same blocks by the front, with the FB going opposite. Plus, we have the 2 receivers to help seal a LB and the CB.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Warmack-2.png)

For some reason Warmack decides to cut back with the FB, when the oline again has the defensive front sealed. It may not have broken for another long run, but probably gains at least 5 yards.

Now, none of that excuses the final play. https://youtu.be/d0wbL4MYub4?t=5362

To me it looks pretty clear that not everyone got the play call, and Risner definitely didn't. First, even though its a screen, Risner locks out and looks to be blocking in regular pass protection.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/INT-1.png)

Clearly, Risner's look toward Thompson afterwards shows he did not know what the play was.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/int-2.png)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: _33 on November 14, 2017, 01:54:49 PM
Why are we the only team that can't run a "pick" play without getting penalized?  Poor coaching?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 14, 2017, 03:06:45 PM
Because we do it on damn near every pass play.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 14, 2017, 03:11:30 PM
Because we do it on damn near every pass play.

I need to find it in the youtube video, the one we got called for seemed pretty suspect to me, but its hard to tell at the game. It certainly didn't seem any more like interference than the one at Tech.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 14, 2017, 03:12:15 PM
Okay, I in no means am posting this to back track on the point of this thread, but....

Sometimes kids mess up in a major way...

Case in point; here is our last TD drive, 2 back formation and Warmack breaks off his biggest run of the day. https://youtu.be/d0wbL4MYub4?t=4798

Note, its a nice inside zone with the FB going left while the oline zone steps right. Warmack has the option to read the defense and follow his FB left or cut back to the right. He makes the correct decision and breaks off a great run.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Warmack-1.png)

Now, let's fast forward to our next drive, the ill fated drive to end the first half. The first play here is the same running game concept, though the formation is different. Last time we ran the ball to the TE side with twin receivers opposite. This time the run is the twins side, with another split receiver opposite. https://youtu.be/d0wbL4MYub4?t=5330

Regardless, we get nearly the same blocks by the front, with the FB going opposite. Plus, we have the 2 receivers to help seal a LB and the CB.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/Warmack-2.png)

For some reason Warmack decides to cut back with the FB, when the oline again has the defensive front sealed. It may not have broken for another long run, but probably gains at least 5 yards.

Now, none of that excuses the final play. https://youtu.be/d0wbL4MYub4?t=5362

To me it looks pretty clear that not everyone got the play call, and Risner definitely didn't. First, even though its a screen, Risner locks out and looks to be blocking in regular pass protection.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/INT-1.png)

Clearly, Risner's look toward Thompson afterwards shows he did not know what the play was.

(http://goEMAW.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/int-2.png)

Good breakdown, when did you go back and watch? I normally rewatch games I attend in person but I couldn't do it this time.

Are Dimel and Risner both ahead of the LOS on that "screen?" Why are there only three visible lineman? Did the others get that far up field?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 14, 2017, 03:17:32 PM
Because we do it on damn near every pass play.

I need to find it in the youtube video, the one we got called for seemed pretty suspect to me, but its hard to tell at the game. It certainly didn't seem any more like interference than the one at Tech.

I'm having a hard thumbs remembering which was which but I saw one of them and agreed with it the other I didn't see. The one I think I remember was on Gruntley and it was about 15 yards downfield. It's tough to tell whether or not he was running a rub but he definitely made contact with both DBs, you can't really judge intent. And like I said we run so many rubs that we aren't going to get the benefit of the doubt if the opposing coaches are always chirping about it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on November 14, 2017, 03:27:42 PM
It's been called on our opponents a few times this year too, we aren't the only team who gets caught
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 14, 2017, 03:32:48 PM
It's been called on our opponents a few times this year too, we aren't the only team who gets caught

No one said we were. I remember one called against our opponent. It was a point of emphasis either two or three years ago.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: libliblibliblibliblib on November 14, 2017, 03:34:12 PM
It's been called on our opponents a few times this year too, we aren't the only team who gets caught

No one said we were. I remember one called against our opponent. It was a point of emphasis either two or three years ago.

Why are we the only team that can't run a "pick" play without getting penalized?  Poor coaching?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 14, 2017, 03:34:27 PM
Are Dimel and Risner both ahead of the LOS on that "screen?" Why are there only three visible lineman? Did the others get that far up field?

The center and both guards released to go block. They are all beyond the LOS, which is legal because Dimel is still behind the LOS. Risner should have been "blocking" but letting the DE get up field outside like Frantz does at the top, but again I don't think he got the play call correctly.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: EMAWzifried on November 14, 2017, 07:06:53 PM
So what do you think this means _fan? Warmack hasn't seen the field much for some reason. Maybe staff doesn't think he gets it as far as making good reads? The mixed signals on the screen: Is it on Risner or Thompson? Seems like Risner, and is that lack of overall team focus, which seems to have plagued the Cats this year. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 14, 2017, 09:42:36 PM
Risner was clearly confused as to what the hell was going on, that much was apparent during the play and after. It's understandable given the wtf play call that made absolutely no sense under the circumstances and could not have possibly put us into a position to score.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) on November 14, 2017, 09:45:52 PM
Honestly, the only way I can rationalize the play calling most of the time is to assume Dimel calls plays in some vacuum where down, distance, and time remaining are irrelevant, and there is no opposing team on the field, and the personnel are identical like the football guys from that old ass electric football game. If you do that, the plays start to make sense.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on November 14, 2017, 11:38:48 PM
Honestly, the only way I can rationalize the play calling most of the time is to assume Dimel calls plays in some vacuum where down, distance, and time remaining are irrelevant, and there is no opposing team on the field, and the personnel are identical like the football guys from that old ass electric football game. If you do that, the plays start to make sense.

HEADLINE: known racist scumbag who hates children with disabilities actually posts something resembling reason
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: _33 on November 15, 2017, 08:51:01 AM
It's been called on our opponents a few times this year too, we aren't the only team who gets caught

No one said we were. I remember one called against our opponent. It was a point of emphasis either two or three years ago.

Why are we the only team that can't run a "pick" play without getting penalized?  Poor coaching?

Well, it fits into my narrative better if I say that we're the only team that gets called.  Becaues my narrative is about Dana Dimel being a dumb idiot.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on November 15, 2017, 08:57:31 AM
The two opis I saw were pretty clear, db didn't give ground and Dalton Gruntley ran into them


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on November 15, 2017, 08:58:36 AM
I also think dimel has a predetermined set of calls and personnel and he has a very hard time deviating from the plan.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 18, 2017, 06:06:35 PM
Clearly this needs a bump.  Pretty sure i don't even have to type anything.  Everyone knows
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 18, 2017, 06:13:57 PM
What is wrong with our coaches?  Honest question.  Why were we running plays at the end of the game?  1:59 left.  4 downs, 40 seconds between each down = 120 seconds > 1:59.  What. In. The. World?  Victory formation, take a knee. 

I won't get into the pass play call.  I just can't do it right now.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: O-town Kat on November 18, 2017, 06:19:40 PM
I'm out of energy for this. We have a 78 yr old running this thing
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BostonPancake on November 18, 2017, 06:26:39 PM
Calling that pass play did not bother me.  They were stopping the run.  We were having success through the air.  It’s just unfortunate how it ended up. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: EMAWzifried on November 18, 2017, 06:28:58 PM
Calling that pass play did not bother me.  They were stopping the run.  We were having success through the air.  It’s just unfortunate how it ended up.
e
Would have been nice if the OL would have, you know, done its job.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 18, 2017, 06:33:08 PM
Calling that pass play did not bother me.  They were stopping the run.  We were having success through the air.  It’s just unfortunate how it ended up. 

This.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: SkinnyBenny on November 18, 2017, 06:35:41 PM
What is wrong with our coaches?  Honest question.  Why were we running plays at the end of the game?  1:59 left.  4 downs, 40 seconds between each down = 120 seconds > 1:59.  What. In. The. World?  Victory formation, take a knee. 

I won't get into the pass play call.  I just can't do it right now.


JFC. I was going absolutely apeshit at my TV at that point. How rough ridin' hard is it to do the calculations ONE TIME to determine that, when the other team has NO TIMEOUTS LEFT and you have the ball 1st and 10 with (what I believe was actually even less than Whisker Biscuit's statement of) 1:59 left, you can kneel it out 3 times and run out the clock? I mean, put a few scenarios into a chart, print out said chart, and have one coach keep it in their pocket during the game? Why on earth would we run it straight into the pile on first and second downs and risk getting it stripped (which they nearly succeeded at)? Especially because on 3rd down, we realized, "Ok, I guess the math works out after all, let's kneel it here and go to the lockerroom with the W."

Fire everyone. They are legitimate idiots sometimes.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Katdaddy on November 18, 2017, 06:39:33 PM
Well, it bothered the announcers!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BackPayne on November 18, 2017, 07:43:55 PM
Not kneeling...a play straight out of the Paul Rhoads (Rhodes?) playbook.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MadCat on November 18, 2017, 07:57:46 PM
Just more fuel for the ‘you actually use math irl’ argument with your kids.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 18, 2017, 07:59:16 PM
Calling that pass play did not bother me.  They were stopping the run.  We were having success through the air.  It’s just unfortunate how it ended up. 

This.

I mean they could have done a quick pass or play action or RPO and not run but no they did a straight five step drop for deep routes when the running clock was our best weapon. So like, it's one thing to be OK with a pass in that situation and an entirely different one to be OK with THAT pass play.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 18, 2017, 08:00:08 PM
Fair.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on November 18, 2017, 08:07:56 PM
did we have stupid play calls? will we forever with this staff? yeah. enjoy the win. it's football. drink your buffalo trace. eat some chicken wings, gentlemen. we won. we won. as 20 plus point dogs at o-state, where we hadn't won since 1999. i am old enough to recall that win. was awesome. so was today.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 18, 2017, 08:09:10 PM
You guys should listen to pvegs.  He's wise.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Dugout DickStone on November 18, 2017, 08:10:39 PM
Calling that pass play did not bother me.  They were stopping the run.  We were having success through the air.  It’s just unfortunate how it ended up. 

This.

I mean they could have done a quick pass or play action or RPO and not run but no they did a straight five step drop for deep routes when the running clock was our best weapon. So like, it's one thing to be OK with a pass in that situation and an entirely different one to be OK with THAT pass play.
He did that at the end of the half last week...
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on November 18, 2017, 08:12:32 PM
You guys should listen to pvegs.  He's wise.

:lol:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 18, 2017, 08:13:14 PM
did we have stupid play calls? will we forever with this staff? yeah. enjoy the win. it's football. drink your buffalo trace. eat some chicken wings, gentlemen. we won. we won. as 20 plus point dogs at o-state, where we hadn't won since 1999. i am old enough to recall that win. was awesome. so was today.

Good call. And I am.

BTW, I made the trip to Stillwater when we beat them in 95. And was at the 03 loss.

And yes, that 99 win was fantastic. The 2nd time we overcame a 21 point deficit that season. Crazy.

:cheers: fellow Cat fans.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on November 18, 2017, 08:24:38 PM
Not kneeling...a play straight out of the Paul Rhoads (Rhodes?) playbook.

Yes, we totally almost Iowa-stated that game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2017, 11:18:32 PM
What is wrong with our coaches?  Honest question.  Why were we running plays at the end of the game?  1:59 left.  4 downs, 40 seconds between each down = 120 seconds > 1:59.  What. In. The. World?  Victory formation, take a knee. 

I won't get into the pass play call.  I just can't do it right now.

This is the only one of these end of the game things that was dumb. If that pass worked everyone would have creamed their jeans. It's also worth noting that was the only time after the first quarter that Sky lost his pocket presence. The pocket collapsed and he put his head down and started chopping his feet, like he did last week. Earlier in the game when that happened he had the feel to shuffle up or get out.

I also saw people on twitter bitching about Sky coming in for those last three snaps. He had to, he's the only person on that sideline who has received a snap under center.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 18, 2017, 11:32:17 PM
I'm pretty sure I still would have questioned that pass call even if it was successful
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: tdaver on November 18, 2017, 11:42:03 PM
What is wrong with our coaches?  Honest question.  Why were we running plays at the end of the game?  1:59 left.  4 downs, 40 seconds between each down = 120 seconds > 1:59.  What. In. The. World?  Victory formation, take a knee. 

I won't get into the pass play call.  I just can't do it right now.


JFC. I was going absolutely apeshit at my TV at that point. How rough ridin' hard is it to do the calculations ONE TIME to determine that, when the other team has NO TIMEOUTS LEFT and you have the ball 1st and 10 with (what I believe was actually even less than Whisker Biscuit's statement of) 1:59 left, you can kneel it out 3 times and run out the clock? I mean, put a few scenarios into a chart, print out said chart, and have one coach keep it in their pocket during the game? Why on earth would we run it straight into the pile on first and second downs and risk getting it stripped (which they nearly succeeded at)? Especially because on 3rd down, we realized, "Ok, I guess the math works out after all, let's kneel it here and go to the lockerroom with the W."

Fire everyone. They are legitimate idiots sometimes.

Stanbot was getting worked up about this.  Even talked about how ISU gave us a game doing this.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BostonPancake on November 18, 2017, 11:51:55 PM
Calling that pass play did not bother me.  They were stopping the run.  We were having success through the air.  It’s just unfortunate how it ended up. 

This.

I mean they could have done a quick pass or play action or RPO and not run but no they did a straight five step drop for deep routes when the running clock was our best weapon. So like, it's one thing to be OK with a pass in that situation and an entirely different one to be OK with THAT pass play.

The deep passing game was working today.  I don't have an issue with trying it again when they were selling out to stop the run.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 18, 2017, 11:55:25 PM
I'm pretty sure I still would have questioned that pass call even if it was successful


In my head, when we got the ball I was trying to decide if we should throw on one of those downs and I thought we should. My rationale is that if we go 3 and out and punt OSU is scoring anyway because we were definitely staying in that prevent. In retrospect I wondered if we should have thrown on first down but that would have lessened the effect of killing the clock if we completed a pass on first, second was the time to do that.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 18, 2017, 11:57:04 PM
I'm pretty sure I still would have questioned that pass call even if it was successful


In my head, when we got the ball I was trying to decide if we should throw on one of those downs and I thought we should. My rationale is that if we go 3 and out and punt OSU is scoring anyway because we were definitely staying in that prevent. In retrospect I wondered if we should have thrown on first down but that would have lessened the effect of killing the clock if we completed a pass on first, second was the time to do that.
As I said, I don't have an issue with passing, I had an issue with THAT pass play. Was anyone open or anything?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 18, 2017, 11:58:03 PM


Calling that pass play did not bother me.  They were stopping the run.  We were having success through the air.  It’s just unfortunate how it ended up. 

This.

I mean they could have done a quick pass or play action or RPO and not run but no they did a straight five step drop for deep routes when the running clock was our best weapon. So like, it's one thing to be OK with a pass in that situation and an entirely different one to be OK with THAT pass play.

The deep passing game was working today.  I don't have an issue with trying it again when they were selling out to stop the run.

Yeah it's like you didn't read my post. Wouldn't a play action be great when they're selling out against the run?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BostonPancake on November 19, 2017, 12:09:18 AM


Calling that pass play did not bother me.  They were stopping the run.  We were having success through the air.  It’s just unfortunate how it ended up. 

This.

I mean they could have done a quick pass or play action or RPO and not run but no they did a straight five step drop for deep routes when the running clock was our best weapon. So like, it's one thing to be OK with a pass in that situation and an entirely different one to be OK with THAT pass play.

The deep passing game was working today.  I don't have an issue with trying it again when they were selling out to stop the run.

Yeah it's like you didn't read my post. Wouldn't a play action be great when they're selling out against the run?

Sure, I'd be fine with that play as well.  I would have been fine with a lot of pass plays.  I didn't think the one they called was bad either.  I felt like we were playing not to lose at that time, so I was begging for any type of passing route.  In the end, it didn't work out.  OSU made a good play.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on November 19, 2017, 04:43:07 AM
did we have stupid play calls? will we forever with this staff? yeah. enjoy the win. it's football. drink your buffalo trace. eat some chicken wings, gentlemen. we won. we won. as 20 plus point dogs at o-state, where we hadn't won since 1999. i am old enough to recall that win. was awesome. so was today.

Good call. And I am.

BTW, I made the trip to Stillwater when we beat them in 95. And was at the 03 loss.

And yes, that 99 win was fantastic. The 2nd time we overcame a 21 point deficit that season. Crazy.

:cheers: fellow Cat fans.

Nice. Is there any chance you recall the Cardiac Cats of 1993 in bball? We came back on the road and beat O-State like 75-62 in overtime. Probably in January. And my godfather in Milford taped it and mailed it to us. We had just moved from Kansas to North Carolina and I was going through major culture shock. Watched that like a week after the fact when the tape arrived. Made my damn week and school/rural North Carolina tolerable.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on November 19, 2017, 04:47:07 AM
You guys should listen to pvegs.  He's wise.

:lol:

you're not the only won lol'ing at pvegs being called "wise" tbt. so am i. but sometimes i do know things.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: yoga-like_abana on November 19, 2017, 09:02:57 AM
I'm pretty sure I still would have questioned that pass call even if it was successful


In my head, when we got the ball I was trying to decide if we should throw on one of those downs and I thought we should. My rationale is that if we go 3 and out and punt OSU is scoring anyway because we were definitely staying in that prevent. In retrospect I wondered if we should have thrown on first down but that would have lessened the effect of killing the clock if we completed a pass on first, second was the time to do that.
As I said, I don't have an issue with passing, I had an issue with THAT pass play. Was anyone open or anything?
Did the cameras even show downfield? The pocket collapsed so damn quick I don't even remember them showing any of our wideouts


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 19, 2017, 09:18:55 AM
We tried to run the same rub/pick play that got Pringle wide open earlier in the game. However, Pringle's man was playing off him, so Zuber couldn't run his guy into the defender. You can tell that looking to Pringle is his primary look and its not there; at that point Thompson has to just throw the ball away, especially since OSU brought 6.

Yes, play action is a good call when you are a run down, but we had been burning their man defense all day, regardless of play action. We also knew we were going to get man free or maybe man with 1 free (which is what OSU played) in that down and distance. I'm sure the rationale was that OSU simply couldn't cover Pringle and we got man coverage against him so we took the shot. Plus we were already around mid field. I don't have a problem with the call.

https://youtu.be/3RvbrLugurk?t=8326
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 19, 2017, 09:22:26 AM
Here is the earlier play that Pringle scored on. Different formation and we used motion to adjust the safety, but we still got the same coverage and used the same wheel route concept. OSU covered it better the 2nd time.

https://youtu.be/3RvbrLugurk?t=5839
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 19, 2017, 09:27:35 AM
This was the most frustrating play for me down the stretch. It was an absolutely great play call vs the defense, but I have no idea why Zuber comes off of his block and then he and Dimel end up blocking the same guy down field. There is no one else on that side of the field for OSU and Thompson likely ends up with at least a 20+ yard run. This should have been a huge play.

https://youtu.be/3RvbrLugurk?t=7711
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 19, 2017, 09:36:06 AM
This was the most frustrating play for me down the stretch. It was an absolutely great play call vs the defense, but I have no idea why Zuber comes off of his block and then he and Dimel end up blocking the same guy down field. There is no one else on that side of the field for OSU and Thompson likely ends up with at least a 20+ yard run. This should have been a huge play.

https://youtu.be/3RvbrLugurk?t=7711

I rewatched this play several times when it happened.  Zuber clearly thinks Dimel is going to block the guy so he moves upfield to the next guy.   Such a small miscommunication that was a huge play.

On the pass play late, without a turnover or recovered onside kick, it was virtually impossible for OSU to win the game.  Run, punt, play defense, repeat.  There was no need to pass even if it was successful.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 19, 2017, 09:39:57 AM
This was the most frustrating play for me down the stretch. It was an absolutely great play call vs the defense, but I have no idea why Zuber comes off of his block and then he and Dimel end up blocking the same guy down field. There is no one else on that side of the field for OSU and Thompson likely ends up with at least a 20+ yard run. This should have been a huge play.

https://youtu.be/3RvbrLugurk?t=7711

I rewatched this play several times when it happened.  Zuber clearly thinks Dimel is going to block the guy so he moves upfield to the next guy.   Such a small miscommunication that was a huge play.

On the pass play late, without a turnover or recovered onside kick, it was virtually impossible for OSU to win the game.  Run, punt, play defense, repeat.  There was no need to pass even if it was successful.

Its got to be Zuber's in my opinion. Dimel does a great job setting it up by initially going inside the right tackle, which pulls OSU's LBs inside to eliminate pursuit. Zuber already has the angle on OSU's corner to take him inside and is right there, leaving Dimel to loop around and block the safety.

I get why people are upset with the pass call, but here we have our staff finally calling plays to put OSU away and it doesn't work. The worst possible scenario happened; even if Thompson just falls down and takes the sack without the fumble we're fine. I like that we were still attacking.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Cire on November 19, 2017, 10:08:36 AM
Zero problem with the pass play.  Agree it should have been a quick out or screen. Rather than long developing, you knew they were bringing pressure


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Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 19, 2017, 11:30:26 AM
Good breakdown fan but one issue, Thompson absolutely shouldn't have thrown the ball away, just not fumble it, fall down, take a knee, anything to keep the clock running.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 19, 2017, 11:41:16 AM
Good breakdown fan but one issue, Thompson absolutely shouldn't have thrown the ball away, just not fumble it, fall down, take a knee, anything to keep the clock running.

Yes. It was kind of a freak hit from (I believe) the OSU defender's knee into his shoulder/side that caused the fumble. I was just saying throwing the ball away is a better option than a fumble (which I admit is simplistic) and OSU did a good job of delay blitzing their two backers which may have confused Thompson a bit. On the earlier throw, OSU did not send their backers so Thompson had a very clean pocket and plenty of time.

I do like that it is a fairly simple look for the QB given OSU's coverage. Its not quite a quick bubble screen, but still a fairly quick release if the throw is there. Granted, there probably needs to be better coaching of what to do if that initial throw isn't there, especially in that situation, but a lot of players probably only learn those things with the actual experience in a game.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: EMAWzifried on November 19, 2017, 11:54:32 AM
I shouted loudest at the TV during the Cats' last scoring drive. Once we got in the IH, we quit passing against OSU's porous pass defense. I understand wanting to run the clock, but 7 points there more or less seals it. And we had the wind behind us, which benefitted both QBs all day.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 19, 2017, 01:35:01 PM
hayes called a pretty good game until the second half, they took every bit of what we gave them on the out routes. our dbs moving up a yard or two would have led to at least 1 pick if not more yet here we are same crap different week
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 19, 2017, 01:39:36 PM
hayes called a pretty good game until the second half, they took every bit of what we gave them on the out routes. our dbs moving up a yard or two would have led to at least 1 pick if not more yet here we are same crap different week

the only criticism of Hayes should be they blitz too much in the 4th. They did amazing before that.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: BIG APPLE CAT on November 19, 2017, 03:30:43 PM
I really don't understand anyone criticizing the call for a pass play. Even had we not fumbled and bled as much clock as possible... OSU still gets the ball back with over 2 minutes to go which they demonstrated numerous times was more than enough time to score. Either way if we don't get the first down we leave then plenty of time to score so why not run a play that at least has a chance to pick up the first down and all but ice it.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 19, 2017, 04:10:52 PM
hayes called a pretty good game until the second half, they took every bit of what we gave them on the out routes. our dbs moving up a yard or two would have led to at least 1 pick if not more yet here we are same crap different week

The only job we had on defense in the second half was to not get beat deep. Best way to do that, drop the DBs and send the linebackers to force the ball out of Rudolph's hand quickly, then tackle.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: kslim on November 19, 2017, 04:33:40 PM
hayes called a pretty good game until the second half, they took every bit of what we gave them on the out routes. our dbs moving up a yard or two would have led to at least 1 pick if not more yet here we are same crap different week

The only job we had on defense in the second half was to not get beat deep. Best way to do that, drop the DBs and send the linebackers to force the ball out of Rudolph's hand quickly, then tackle.
yeah I’m not saying to jam them or even to play man up but stop giving such a cushion. duke has proved he is fast enough to recover, never got to see Parker’s speed
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 23, 2017, 08:14:48 PM
One last point on the end of half, non-timeout call.  There is no way KU was going for it on 4th and 14...and for all those saying they would have had we called timeout i ask this:  why didn't KU call timeout immediately?  If they would have gone for it had we called timeout, whey wouldn't they have called timeout themselves and gone for it if that's what was their plan?

Bottom line, it was a horrible decision to not call timeout and allow KU a free shot.

Nobody with a brain actually think ku was going to go for it on 4th and 14 from midfield. Not even Beatty is that stupid.

Remember this discussion? This nearly exact scenario just happened in The Egg Bowl.

Mississippi State had a 4th and 7 from the Ole Miss 45 or so. There was about 35 seconds left in the half and the clock was running. Mississippi State let the clock run and were going to let the clock run out to throw a hail mary. Ole Miss inexplicably didn't let the clock run out or call a time out right away, they called one with 15 seconds left. Instead of throwing the hail mary Mississippi State got the first down then kicked a field goal to end the half.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: catastrophe on November 23, 2017, 09:08:23 PM
Similar situation in the Cowboys game. Cowboys were letting clock run at the end of the half and Chargers called s timeout to discourage the Cowboys from trying a Hail Mary to end the half. They punted.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: fun muffin on November 25, 2017, 03:59:40 PM
Dimel must think Skylar can't throw anymore.     :confused: :confused: :confused:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 25, 2017, 04:32:40 PM
We need to run more dive plays and Skylar dropping back then running for his life
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 25, 2017, 04:34:48 PM
54 total yards midway thru the 3rd quarter...against IOWA STATE.  Let that sink in.    12 yards passing.  FML
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksuchris2000 on November 25, 2017, 04:44:27 PM
Lolz at 4th and 2 play call
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Muldoon on November 25, 2017, 04:44:34 PM
Heh. The ol' line em up five yards off the LOS and go for it thinking it will work. Classic Dimmel right there folks.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 25, 2017, 04:47:29 PM
we had a blitz work once (first successful blitz of the year?), let's do it alllllll game
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 25, 2017, 04:54:44 PM
The deepest pass i can recall us throwing this game was about 9 yards...the one that should have been intercepted but the sun.  Am i misremembering?  WTF.  Even if we lose, the ineptitude of our offense cannot be overemphasized.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: EMAWzifried on November 25, 2017, 06:20:18 PM
Clearly the strategy was "keep it close, win at the horn ... someway. It's Iowa State. It will work out.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 25, 2017, 08:15:55 PM
Dimel must think Skylar can't throw anymore.     :confused: :confused: :confused:

Bill roasted Dimel's ass for this in the post game, press conference
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: IPA4Me on November 25, 2017, 08:19:33 PM
Hotel elevator talk this morning... Old dude was telling me Sean has been bitching about play calls in-game over the headsets. Sean's pushing Dimel out the door.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: michigancat on November 25, 2017, 08:20:32 PM
Hotel elevator talk this morning... Old dude was telling me Sean has been bitching about play calls in-game over the headsets. Sean's pushing Dimel out the door.

obvious a lie because I've never seen Sean wearing headphones that weren't around his neck
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sys on November 25, 2017, 08:45:27 PM
Hotel elevator talk this morning... Old dude was telling me Sean has been bitching about play calls in-game over the headsets. Sean's pushing Dimel out the door.

sean is fighting his ass off to save the program.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 25, 2017, 09:05:34 PM
Hey just so Dimel's ass doesn't skate on this, but that 4th and 2 call was without a doubt the worst call of the year and that says a lot.

1. We have no fuckin QBs left what the eff are we doing running the one we have left in an empty backfield?
2. Did the [redacted] forget about Delton not getting a 4th & 2 on a similar play at KU?
3. Did I mention he ran our last scholarship QB on a run down with no lead blocker?

Let's be real, there's a fair amount of Dana hate is hysteria, but this was so unbelievably stupid, it done should have cost him his job.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 25, 2017, 09:19:11 PM
Dimel must think Skylar can't throw anymore.     :confused: :confused: :confused:

Bill roasted Dimel's ass for this in the post game, press conference

It was awesome. The first 3 quarters were as miserable watching K-State football offense as I can remember.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: The Big Train on November 25, 2017, 09:22:36 PM
Dimel must think Skylar can't throw anymore.     :confused: :confused: :confused:

Bill roasted Dimel's ass for this in the post game, press conference

It was awesome. The first 3 quarters were as miserable watching K-State football offense as I can remember.

Yeah it was a terrible game the first 3 quarters. I turned to the people I was with and made the comment that it was super boring.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sys on November 25, 2017, 09:35:48 PM
the note that sean gave bill right after the game ended.  talking points for the presser?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Chingon on November 25, 2017, 09:36:18 PM
Xmas wish list
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 25, 2017, 09:40:48 PM
I don't think Bill will fire Dana but I'd be stunned if he's back. Apparently he harbored a delusion that he had a shot at the job here after Bill left. That clearly isn't happening. I do think he may have a shot at a group of 5 or FCS job if he wants one. Maybe he can catch on with another one of these staffs that will have openings all over the P5. Other head coaches and ADs aren't as close to this as we are and being LHC Bill Snyder's long time OC will have some weight.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sys on November 25, 2017, 09:42:27 PM
Xmas wish list

could be both.   :crossfingers:
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 25, 2017, 10:43:32 PM
The first 3 quarters made Dimel trying to call an offense against Nebraska during Snyder 1 look like a work of art.

He is awful and is only bailed out by ballers.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: DOD Take 2 on November 26, 2017, 07:16:38 AM
Hey just so Dimel's ass doesn't skate on this, but that 4th and 2 call was without a doubt the worst call of the year and that says a lot.

1. We have no fuckin QBs left what the eff are we doing running the one we have left in an empty backfield?
2. Did the [redacted] forget about Delton not getting a 4th & 2 on a similar play at KU?
3. Did I mention he ran our last scholarship QB on a run down with no lead blocker?

Let's be real, there's a fair amount of Dana hate is hysteria, but this was so unbelievably stupid, it done should have cost him his job.

Don’t forget that the Skylar has a hip pointer and clearly wasn’t as mobile as he was in previous games
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 26, 2017, 09:00:04 AM
Al of this talk about Sky’s ability...irrelevant if dimel is back.  WatchIng the creativity of other offenses makes me sad.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Joker on November 26, 2017, 09:25:19 AM
For those who watched on TV what did the pass coverage look like during the first 3 quarters when Thompson dropped back?

I couldn't tell from where I was sitting but it seemed like he was reluctant to pull the trigger.  Not sure if that was due to tight coverage or Skyler being overly cautious.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Whisker Biscuit on November 26, 2017, 09:39:02 AM
I was never a big fan of Del Miller, but how much do we miss him?  I didn't like our play calling the past few years but this year seems like it's significantly worse than anytime in recent memory.

My guess is that Bill's solution will be to add the "co-OC" title to CK.  I'm not sure how much that will help.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 26, 2017, 09:45:49 AM
I can't defend Dimel this year, but his offenses have mostly been solid during his career. My understanding from talking to some former players was that Dimel has always called the majority of the offense during 2.0, Miller was mainly involved in obvious passing situation. The injuries haven't helped, but this year Dimel never seemed to find a rhythm or figure out what to do with this team. We've had two of the worst offensive games I can remember (Vandy and TCU) and yesterday was on that path for 3 quarters.

If he does stay, I think we'll build the offense to look much more like we used with Waters, especially considering Thompson's skills and the returning receivers. This year's team with Ertz was built much more like the Klein teams and I don't know that we could completely adjust mid season with the injury situation at QB.

(numbers below don't include the ISU game)
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 26, 2017, 10:36:00 AM
For those who watched on TV what did the pass coverage look like during the first 3 quarters when Thompson dropped back?

I couldn't tell from where I was sitting but it seemed like he was reluctant to pull the trigger.  Not sure if that was due to tight coverage or Skyler being overly cautious.

I thought he didn't have the poise early that he did late. I thought he had happy feet and didn't keep his head up. ISU was getting decent push but he wasn't buying himself any time before the play broke down.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 26, 2017, 10:39:58 AM
We came out as conservative as I've seen in quite some time, probably mainly to protect Thompson. I think its clear we were hoping to just keep the game close until the 4th quarter. Granted, I think we thought we could get more push from the offensive line, but our 2 back delayed power got destroyed by ISU. We tried a few passes and the typical play action with 2 back, but we usually only had 2 WRs on the field so its tough to get anyone open. In the 4th we finally opened it up.

Of course, none of that explains the absolutely moronic 4th down run call to Thompson, but for the most part that's that the game plan looked like IMO.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: EMAWzifried on November 26, 2017, 10:40:25 AM
Not the right thread probably, but did Valentine play yesterday?
Title: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 26, 2017, 10:42:58 AM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 26, 2017, 10:51:55 AM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.

FINALLY A SUCCESSFUL TWO MINUTE DRIVE
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Joker on November 26, 2017, 10:52:11 AM
For those who watched on TV what did the pass coverage look like during the first 3 quarters when Thompson dropped back?

I couldn't tell from where I was sitting but it seemed like he was reluctant to pull the trigger.  Not sure if that was due to tight coverage or Skyler being overly cautious.

I thought he didn't have the poise early that he did late. I thought he had happy feet and didn't keep his head up. ISU was getting decent push but he wasn't buying himself any time before the play broke down.

That was my initial assumption.

He admitted in the post game that he's not going to take any chances throwing the ball into tight coverage.  I think part of the reason he plays so well in the clutch is because he's forced to sling it and make plays.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: sonofdaxjones on November 26, 2017, 10:53:10 AM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.

FINALLY A SUCCESSFUL TWO MINUTE DRIVE

Yes!
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: pvegs on November 26, 2017, 10:55:33 AM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.

this is pleasing news. HIRE KLIFF
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: MakeItRain on November 26, 2017, 11:01:41 AM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.

this is pleasing news. HIRE KLIFF

1. He has a job
2. Gross, I hate that offense, I would never want that for us.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: ksu_FAN1 on November 26, 2017, 11:18:34 AM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.

this is pleasing news. HIRE KLIFF

1. He has a job
2. Gross, I hate that offense, I would never want that for us.

Yes, that's not going to happen.

I will say that I do enjoy how ISU employs some HUNH and then at times will take their time with check with me. They only possess the ball 45 less seconds per game than we do. They do run about 8 more plays per game, but are 2nd to last to us in plays per game in the Big 12. To me it makes sense to add some HUNH because it puts a lot of pressure on defenses.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Clevey No Mo on November 27, 2017, 11:41:01 AM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.

this is pleasing news. HIRE KLIFF

1. He has a job
2. Gross, I hate that offense, I would never want that for us.

Kliff just barely kept his job by beating a mediocre Texas team. That's not a sign of future success, considering Kliff has had time to show us who he really is. People were so high on him several years ago, did he turn down any other offers so he could stay and die in Lubbock?
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Rage Against the McKee on November 27, 2017, 02:27:06 PM
the note that sean gave bill right after the game ended.  talking points for the presser?

Probably Bill's diagonal hand-written letter to Allen Lazard.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: Dlew12 on November 27, 2017, 03:31:59 PM
I think given our offensive makeup (solid stable of running backs, good line, talented quarterback, capable wide receivers), a pro style offense moving forward makes a lot of sense.

We don't need to employ the risky "run the qb 25+ times a game" strategy.  It's an unnecessary risk. 
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on November 27, 2017, 03:34:45 PM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.

this is pleasing news. HIRE KLIFF

1. He has a job
2. Gross, I hate that offense, I would never want that for us.

Agreed, not a fan of Kliff's offense anyways.
Title: Re: Terrible KSU Coaching Decisions Thread
Post by: WildcatPower on November 27, 2017, 03:37:26 PM
Dana is reportedly being a lil bitch about developments internally.   That’s as big of a call out on coaching I have ever heard from Snyder in a negative light.

Reportedly Sean and Dana are at odds and Sean is openly questioning the play calling.

Sky is an up tempo player, not a slow roll read the sideline check with me QB. Our RB’s are upfield runners and defenses are maintaining gap discipline and contain, eliminating the “patient” runs.

this is pleasing news. HIRE KLIFF

1. He has a job
2. Gross, I hate that offense, I would never want that for us.

Yes, that's not going to happen.

I will say that I do enjoy how ISU employs some HUNH and then at times will take their time with check with me. They only possess the ball 45 less seconds per game than we do. They do run about 8 more plays per game, but are 2nd to last to us in plays per game in the Big 12. To me it makes sense to add some HUNH because it puts a lot of pressure on defenses.

Just to make sure I understand this, HUNH - Hurry Up No Huddle?  If so, I'm okay with the HUNH depending on the situation, but I do agree that it should be implemented in our offense.

I don't have a problem with our offensive scheme, none at all.  It's a good fit.  The issue that I just have is how they utilize it, mainly using the QB as a battering ram.