Author Topic: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff  (Read 56040 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Katpappy

  • I got my eye on you
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 12809
  • Party on gE
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #325 on: April 16, 2014, 12:25:46 AM »
Report States Market Value for College Football Player Is $178,000 Per Year

 By Brian Leigh , Featured Columnist
 Apr 14, 2014
Report States Market Value for College Football Player Is $178,000 Per Year

A March 2014 study conducted by Drexel University and the National College Players Association has found that the annual fair market value of an average college football player between 2011 and 2015 is $178,000, per Mark Coba of NBC News:

The March survey, from the National College Players Association and Drexel University, said that the projected fair market value of the average college football player is $178,000 per year from 2011 to 2015, while the projected market value for the average college basketball player for the same time is $375,000.

The report also said that football players with the top 10 highest estimated fair market values, like Texas A&M quarterback Johnny Manziel, might be worth as much as $547,000, during the year 2011 to 2012.

The NCPA was founded by Ramogi Huma, who joined forces with Kain Colter to form the College Athletes Players Association earlier this year and recently won a huge victory when the National Labor Relations Board deemed Northwestern football players were employees of—not just students at—the university, according to ESPN.com.

However, it is important to note that pay-for-play is not one of CAPA's primary, explicit goals. The organization argued in January for "cost of attendance" stipends and the right to "be compensated for commercial sponsorships consistent with evolving NCAA regulations," per Teddy Grenstein of the Chicago Tribune.

"A lot of people will think this is all about money; it’s not,” Colter said at the time. "We’re asking for a seat at the table to get our voice heard."

These newly published numbers are staggering, however, and given Huga's connection to both the NCPA and CAPA, it is reasonable to think they might be used in pro-compensation arguments in the near future.

Here are some other important findings from the report, published on the NCPA's official website:
•The average full athletic scholarship at an FBS school left “full” players with a scholarship shortfall (out-of-pocket expenses) of $3285 during the 2011-12 school year.
•FBS football and men’s basketball players would receive full athletic scholarships plus an additional $6 billion between 2011-15 if not for the NCAA’s prohibition of a fair market.
•The lost value over a four-year career for the average FBS football and men’s basketball player is $456,612 and $1,063,307, respectively.
•The lost value over a four-year career for the average football and men’s basketball player in the six BCS conferences is $715,000 and $1.5 million, respectively.
•University of Texas football players will be denied approximately $2.2 million, incur scholarship shortfalls of over $14,000, and live below the federal poverty line by $784 per year between 2011-15.

Like so many developments since the formation of CAPA in late-January, it remains to be seen how, exactly, these numbers will be used. The association is still in its early phases, teaching itself how it will operate and whom it will preside over.

Still, it seems like the days of unpaid college athletes are just about numbered. The earning potential is too big to ignore.

"The bidding war for athletes would likely be in the millions," said Ellen Staurowsky, a professor of sports management at Drexel University and co-author of the report, according to Coba's story.

For how long can we not address those numbers?

Follow Brian Leigh on Twitter: @BLeighDAT
Hot time in Kat town tonight.

Online star seed 7

  • hyperactive on the :lol:
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 63983
  • good dog
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #326 on: April 16, 2014, 12:31:02 AM »
what a fantastic twitter handle
Hyperbolic partisan duplicitous hypocrite

Offline DQ12

  • PCKK7DC Survivor
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *******
  • Posts: 22246
  • #TeamChestHair
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #327 on: April 16, 2014, 01:26:15 AM »
Those numbers are absurd.  I'd like to see how they were reached.


"You want to stand next to someone and not be able to hear them, walk your ass into Manhattan, Kansas." - [REDACTED]

Offline Katpappy

  • I got my eye on you
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 12809
  • Party on gE
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #328 on: April 16, 2014, 12:50:43 PM »
Those numbers are absurd.  I'd like to see how they were reached.
Maybe this quote from an artical about FSU might help:
It would be difficult to overstate the importance of football to Florida State and its hometown. In Tallahassee, rooting for the Seminoles is a matter of identity and economy. The 2013 championship season generated millions of dollars for the athletic department and city businesses, and favorable publicity beyond measure.
Hot time in Kat town tonight.

The Big Train

  • Guest
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #329 on: April 16, 2014, 08:55:13 PM »
Those numbers are absurd.  I'd like to see how they were reached.
Maybe this quote from an artical about FSU might help:
It would be difficult to overstate the importance of football to Florida State and its hometown. In Tallahassee, rooting for the Seminoles is a matter of identity and economy. The 2013 championship season generated millions of dollars for the athletic department and city businesses, and favorable publicity beyond measure.

This could be said about every major college in a pretty densely populated town.

Offline MakeItRain

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 44880
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #330 on: April 16, 2014, 09:27:31 PM »
Those numbers are absurd.  I'd like to see how they were reached.

comically so, like a number that would be used in an Onion article

Offline Katpappy

  • I got my eye on you
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 12809
  • Party on gE
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #331 on: April 18, 2014, 07:14:41 PM »
 :lol: AT THIS S.O.B.!!!  :curse:


NCAA President Mark Emmert Held #AskEmmert Q&A, and It Didn't Go so Well


 By Brian Leigh , Featured Columnist
 Apr 18, 2014
 

NCAA President Mark Emmert appeared on ESPN's Mike & Mike radio show Friday morning, ostensibly to help clean up some of the comments he's made about college unionization over the past month.

The highlight (lowlight?) of the interview was Emmert's response to Northwestern University football players, who were recently deemed employees of the school by the National Labor Relations Board, according to Brian Bennett of ESPN.com.

In Emmert's own words:

On discussing the new change to the NCAA's food policy, whereby players can now enjoy free meals without restriction, Emmert also had a flippant reply to Connecticut basketball player Shabazz Napier, who claimed there were some hungry nights were he "goes to bed starving," per Darren Rovell of ESPN.com:

Interviews like these do not endear Emmert to the public, which is troubling because, in that respect, he is digging himself out of a perpetual hole. Perhaps, as Bill Connelly of SB Nation suggests, we've reached the point where he should stop granting interview requests altogether:

Ridiculous as those two comments were, the rest of Emmert's morning didn't go so well either. Mike & Mike prompted viewers to tweet questions for the president with the hashtag #AskEmmert, but the exercise predictably devolved into ridicule (h/t Deadspin):

Is this the last time we'll see Emmert give a candid interview? No, but it might be his farewell for a while.

Taking him off-book like this has only made the situation worse for the NCAA. However, with so much change appearing to be imminent in college athletics, now is not an ideal time for the face of the organization to disappear.

Regardless of how the NCAA manages Emmert's availability in the coming months, it's clear that the man has a difficult job. He is the public face of a disliked organization, and his duty to placate the gluttonous college presidents makes him an easy target of scorn. Because of his position, he's the easiest and most convenient NCAA figurehead to attack.

But, hey. You have to earn that $1.7 million somehow.

AND HERE'S HIS COMMENTS:  :bang:

"If I can hire someone to play football for me why would I hire an 18 year old? Why not someone who plays in the CFL?" Emmert on unions

Mark Emmert on @MikeAndMike on deregulating food rules: If UConn wants to feed Shabazz breakfast in bed, they can.“

Note: You can listen to the full, 26-minute interview here.
http://cdn16.castfire.com/audio/303/2117/7825/2161632/audiomikeandmike_2014-04-18-084132-3953-0-0-0.32.mp3?cdn_id=33&uuid=5301b65709332cb06131b6fd1b0aff42&referer=http%3A%2F%2Ft.co%2FiHwpr3WEc5

Hot time in Kat town tonight.

Offline DQ12

  • PCKK7DC Survivor
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *******
  • Posts: 22246
  • #TeamChestHair
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #332 on: April 18, 2014, 11:39:16 PM »
Those numbers are absurd.  I'd like to see how they were reached.

comically so, like a number that would be used in an Onion article
I'm trying to find a copy of that report to see how they reached their numbers.  None of the stories provide a link to the report and I doubt that any of the authors actually read the damn thing -- they seem to be all running the same/substantially similar wire report.

The 178k number has to be ignoring practically the entire institutional cost of running an athletic department and just taking gross revenue divided by however many scholarship players there are in the country, which if so, is psychotic.


"You want to stand next to someone and not be able to hear them, walk your ass into Manhattan, Kansas." - [REDACTED]

Offline kim carnes

  • chingon!
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 13558
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #333 on: April 19, 2014, 12:28:47 AM »
players shouldn't be paid dumbasses

Offline kim carnes

  • chingon!
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 13558
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #334 on: April 19, 2014, 12:30:29 AM »
no one cares about college football outside of the southeast united states and the midwest.  and no one cares about either of those areas of the country. 

Offline eastcat

  • Racist Piece of Shit
  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 2502
  • Labeled by children.
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #335 on: April 19, 2014, 12:51:21 AM »
no one lives there to care either

Offline kim carnes

  • chingon!
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 13558
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #336 on: April 19, 2014, 12:58:18 AM »
hi my name is eastcat and my posts don't make any sense and i'm a racist

Offline DQ12

  • PCKK7DC Survivor
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *******
  • Posts: 22246
  • #TeamChestHair
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #337 on: April 19, 2014, 05:59:31 PM »
OK i found it.  I tweeted at the belieghdat guy and he cited the report, which you can find here: http://www.ncpanow.org/news/articles/body/6-Billion-Heist-Study_Full.pdf

Quote
Method...

(4) College Athlete Market Value

At present, there is no formula to determine the fair market value of a revenue-producing college athlete in the sports of football and men's basketball.  In an attempt to experiment with such a model, we theorized that the revenue-sharing models that exist in the NFL and NBA, which have been arrived at through a collective bargaining process and with the aid of player representation, would provide a starting point on an estimation of what the value of revenue-producing college athletes in their programs.  In 2011, the NFL reached an agreement with players that they would share at least 46.5% of the revenue generated by the league, while the NBA owners agreed to a 50% revenue-sharing standard for its players.  Those standards were applied to the revenue reported by colleges' and universities' football and basketball revenues to better gauge the value of the college players that participate in these sports.

So essentially she made the following calculation: Football player's FMV=((total football revenue)(0.465)/(85)).

I'm still very skeptical about how she reached her findings (avg. player is worth 178k) and the capability of smaller FBS programs to fund an endeavor like this, when practically all teams already operate in the red.

Plus she's also completely ignoring the variables that allow NFL players to leverage for 46.5%.


"You want to stand next to someone and not be able to hear them, walk your ass into Manhattan, Kansas." - [REDACTED]

Online wetwillie

  • goEMAW Poster of the WEEK
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *****
  • Posts: 30386
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #338 on: April 19, 2014, 06:11:01 PM »
OK i found it.  I tweeted at the belieghdat guy and he cited the report, which you can find here: http://www.ncpanow.org/news/articles/body/6-Billion-Heist-Study_Full.pdf

Quote
Method...

(4) College Athlete Market Value

At present, there is no formula to determine the fair market value of a revenue-producing college athlete in the sports of football and men's basketball.  In an attempt to experiment with such a model, we theorized that the revenue-sharing models that exist in the NFL and NBA, which have been arrived at through a collective bargaining process and with the aid of player representation, would provide a starting point on an estimation of what the value of revenue-producing college athletes in their programs.  In 2011, the NFL reached an agreement with players that they would share at least 46.5% of the revenue generated by the league, while the NBA owners agreed to a 50% revenue-sharing standard for its players.  Those standards were applied to the revenue reported by colleges' and universities' football and basketball revenues to better gauge the value of the college players that participate in these sports.

So essentially she made the following calculation: Football player's FMV=((total football revenue)(0.465)/(85)).

I'm still very skeptical about how she reached her findings (avg. player is worth 178k) and the capability of smaller FBS programs to fund an endeavor like this, when practically all teams already operate in the red.

Plus she's also completely ignoring the variables that allow NFL players to leverage for 46.5%.

Also the small problem of paying all players the same regardless of contribution. 
When the bullets are flying, that's when I'm at my best

Offline DQ12

  • PCKK7DC Survivor
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • *******
  • Posts: 22246
  • #TeamChestHair
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #339 on: April 19, 2014, 06:22:17 PM »
Yeah good point.  Using the mean really skews some of the numbers.  The super revenue generating Johnny Footballs of the world will likely be making significant $$$ a year out of college anyways.  I, for one, feel no sympathy for the group of people that are going to be making millions regardless.

The median FMV number would be much more interesting -- but that number is impossible to determine because it's impossible to determine an exact player's exact FMV. 

Also, that report was made in 2012.  It strikes me as odd that it is being widely reported on now, considering that this "should players be paid" issue isn't exactly unique to 2014.


"You want to stand next to someone and not be able to hear them, walk your ass into Manhattan, Kansas." - [REDACTED]

Offline kim carnes

  • chingon!
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 13558
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #340 on: April 19, 2014, 07:24:27 PM »
If you think about it, athletics have no place in a collegiate environment.  they should be banished.  but for the players to think they should get paid tho i mean wtf.  its college, you don't get paid to play sports.

Offline eastcat

  • Racist Piece of Shit
  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 2502
  • Labeled by children.
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #341 on: April 19, 2014, 08:12:24 PM »
How about $7.25 an hour?

Offline Katpappy

  • I got my eye on you
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 12809
  • Party on gE
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #342 on: April 19, 2014, 10:10:26 PM »
no one cares about college football outside of the southeast united states and the midwest.  and no one cares about either of those areas of the country.
Several billion cares, Kimmy.
Hot time in Kat town tonight.

Offline bucket

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 9553
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #343 on: April 19, 2014, 10:14:21 PM »
The only ones who care are the ones who get rich

Offline bucket

  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 9553
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #344 on: April 19, 2014, 10:16:18 PM »
The only ones who care are the ones who get rich. Athletes not athletic directors.

Offline Katpappy

  • I got my eye on you
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 12809
  • Party on gE
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #345 on: April 19, 2014, 10:25:59 PM »
The only ones who care are the ones who get rich. Athletes not athletic directors.
the NCAA knows they effed up by hoarding all the money.  They could have avoided all this if they would have split up the major conferences from the smaller ones that don't make the bucks like the big schools.  They'll do this now, but will it be in time before it all goes to pot.
Hot time in Kat town tonight.

Offline ydarg2012

  • Baller on a Budget
  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 1116
  • Snyder 4 President
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #346 on: April 21, 2014, 10:46:40 AM »
The only ones who care are the ones who get rich. Athletes not athletic directors.
the NCAA knows they effed up by hoarding all the money.  They could have avoided all this if they would have split up the major conferences from the smaller ones that don't make the bucks like the big schools.  They'll do this now, but will it be in time before it all goes to pot.

If they pay the athletes this is exactly where the money will go.

Offline Clevey 2 Times

  • Katpak'r
  • ***
  • Posts: 1260
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #347 on: April 24, 2014, 02:38:39 PM »
I can't help but think that if the NCAA would've gotten in front of this long ago and paid, at least, cost of attendance, then this whole situation would never have happened (the NLRB, unionization stuff). Now, if we take Colter and friends at their word, this was all just leverage to get cost of attendance and voice at the table. Even if he is approaching this with the best of intentions, opening up the unionization can of worms really creates the possibility that this may change college athletics in some fundamental ways. Hopefully, not for the worse.

Offline Katpappy

  • I got my eye on you
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 12809
  • Party on gE
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #348 on: April 24, 2014, 09:11:18 PM »

April 24, 2014 | By Michelle Brutlag Hosick
 

DI Board of Directors endorses restructuring process, seeks feedback

New structure could be approved as early as August

Highlights


Board members Kirk Schulz, president of Kansas State University, and Michael Drake; chancellor of the University of California, Irvine; discuss Division I’s restructuring process.

WHAT HAPPENED: At its meeting Thursday, the Division I Board of Directors, composed of university presidents, endorsed a restructuring process that will be more agile to adapt to changes in the division, give student-athletes a greater voice in decision-making and provide more autonomy to the five major conferences.

WHAT’S NEXT: The board members are soliciting feedback from member schools this spring and plan to adopt a new Division I structure in August.

The Division I Board of Directors is one step closer to approving a new governance system in August.

The board endorsed the restructuring process, which is aimed at allowing the division to be more nimble, streamlined and responsive to needs – particularly the needs of student-athletes – during its meeting Thursday in Indianapolis. The Steering Committee on Governance, made up of university presidents, drafted the restructuring plan.

“The model we sent to the membership today is not a final product,” said Wake Forest President Nathan Hatch, chair of the board and the steering committee. “Some aspects of the model remain under discussion, and we hope the membership will provide us further input.”

Under the proposal, the division would still be led by a Board of Directors composed primarily of university presidents. However, new voices would be added: the chair of the Division I Student-Athlete Advisory Committee; the chair of a new group tentatively called the Council; and the most senior Division I member of the Faculty Athletics Representatives Association’s executive committee. The council chair would always be an athletics director, giving that constituency an automatic spot on the board.

The Board would focus chiefly on oversight and strategic issues, while leaving much of the day-to-day policy and legislative responsibility to the council.

The council, composed of at least 60 percent athletics directors, would have 38 members: one from each conference plus two voting student-athletes and four commissioners (one from the five highest profile Football Bowl Subdivision conferences, one from the remaining FBS conferences, one from the Football Championship Subdivision conferences and one from the remaining conferences). The council would be the final voice on shared-governance rule-making decisions.

The steering committee suggests creating three bodies that would assist the council in its work and comprise the “working level” of Division I: an academics-focused group, a championships-focused group and a legislative group. Council members would determine implementation details, including what other groups are needed, how the groups will be populated and reporting lines. The steering committee also emphasized the need for a nomination process that is competency-based and diverse.

In order to allow the five highest-resource  conferences (the Atlantic Coast Conference, Big 12 Conference, Big Ten Conference, Pac-12 Conference and Southeastern Conference) to address their unique challenges, the model would grant them autonomy to make rules on specific matters affecting the interests of student-athletes.

The university presidents who serve on the steering committee continue to seek more clarity and specificity about these proposed areas of autonomy. While retaining the concepts that were included in the “actionable” category, the board decided that the process it had identified as “actionable” -  requiring the conferences other than the highest-profile five to take a separate vote – would not be included in the proposal.

 The steering committee is seeking more feedback on the how the remaining 27 conferences would want to apply decisions made by the 65 schools in the five highest-profile conferences.

Areas in which the membership generally agrees on autonomy for the five conferences include:
•financial aid, including full cost of attendance and scholarship guarantees;
•insurance, including policies that protect future earnings;
•academic support, particularly for at-risk student-athletes; and
•other support, such as travel for families, free tickets to athletics events, and expenses associated with practice and competition (such as parking).

The steering committee continues to discuss other areas that could be included in the areas of autonomy, including the creation of mandatory time away from athletics for student-athletes; eliminating rules that prohibit student-athletes from pursuing careers outside of athletics while still competing (for example, making music and art or writing a book); recruiting; transfer issues; and athletics department personnel.

The board will seek feedback on some questions raised by members of governance bodies in recent days, including: the process by which items decided by the full division could become part of the list of autonomous areas; the voting, interpretation and enforcement processes within the five highest-profile conferences; and the core structure that separates not only the five highest-profile conferences into their own group but also continues a separation of the next five conferences (the American Athletic Conference, Conference-USA, Mid-American Conference, Mountain West Conference and Sun Belt Conference) from the remaining 22.
Hot time in Kat town tonight.

Offline Katpappy

  • I got my eye on you
  • Pak'r Élitaire
  • ****
  • Posts: 12809
  • Party on gE
    • View Profile
Re: people talk about atheletes and student loan stuff
« Reply #349 on: April 24, 2014, 09:12:31 PM »
The steering committee will seek broad membership feedback over the summer. More information about how to submit feedback will be distributed to members in the coming days. Feedback will be released to the membership at the conclusion of the comment period, expected to be in late June.

The board will vote on final recommendations in August. As part of Thursday’s action, the board members resolved to begin the transition to the new governance structure by fall 2014, with a new council and board beginning their terms at the 2015 NCAA Convention. In order to make the transition as smooth as possible, current councils and cabinets will be maintained through January 2015.

In other business, the board adopted a change to waiver policy for transfer student-athletes, which was recommended last week by the Leadership Council. Qualifying student-athletes who cannot transfer and play immediately without a waiver will be allowed a sixth year to complete their four years of eligibility.

The change primarily impacts student-athletes who play baseball, basketball, bowl subdivision football and men’s ice hockey, as well as those in other sports who already transferred once. These student-athletes would no longer be able to seek a waiver to transfer and compete immediately.

Also, at the close of Thursday’s meeting, all new rules adopted by the Legislative Council, including a rule lifting restrictions on feeding student-athletes, became final.
Hot time in Kat town tonight.