Author Topic: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)  (Read 7971 times)

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Offline Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!)

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #25 on: March 14, 2017, 02:26:57 PM »
Why wouldn't older sick people have to pay more for health insurance than younget not sick people?

Why the eff are we paying for anyone's health insurance at all?

Why has health insurance and healthcare been conflated?
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Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #26 on: March 14, 2017, 03:01:19 PM »
I'm a believer that you should get the same rate for life. The younger you join, the lower your rate. I don't like rates going up just because you get old.

Offline Phil Titola

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #27 on: March 14, 2017, 03:08:00 PM »
Why wouldn't older sick people have to pay more for health insurance than younget not sick people?

Why the eff are we paying for anyone's health insurance at all?

Why has health insurance and healthcare been conflated?

Agreed on last point.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #28 on: March 14, 2017, 03:13:19 PM »
I'm a believer that you should get the same rate for life. The younger you join, the lower your rate. I don't like rates going up just because you get old.

You pay more based on your risk in virtually every other insurance market right?
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Offline Phil Titola

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #29 on: March 14, 2017, 03:22:18 PM »
But you don't have to own a car....

Need to be working on better healthcare, not within the constructs of insurance companies.

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #30 on: March 14, 2017, 03:26:08 PM »
I'm a believer that you should get the same rate for life. The younger you join, the lower your rate. I don't like rates going up just because you get old.

You pay more based on your risk in virtually every other insurance market right?

Not necessarily for life insurance.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #31 on: March 14, 2017, 03:33:00 PM »
I'm a believer that you should get the same rate for life. The younger you join, the lower your rate. I don't like rates going up just because you get old.

You pay more based on your risk in virtually every other insurance market right?

Not necessarily for life insurance.

Oh?
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Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #32 on: March 14, 2017, 03:42:06 PM »
I'm a believer that you should get the same rate for life. The younger you join, the lower your rate. I don't like rates going up just because you get old.

You pay more based on your risk in virtually every other insurance market right?

Not necessarily for life insurance.

Oh?

Yeah, you can get whole life with a fixed premium. It just costs more.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #33 on: March 14, 2017, 04:38:01 PM »
But you don't have to own a car....

Need to be working on better healthcare, not within the constructs of insurance companies.

Healthcare is fantastic in this country

.... As long as you can afford it
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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #34 on: March 14, 2017, 10:00:16 PM »
i get tired of people blaming insurance companies.  they're just pass throughs, the problem is the doctors.
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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #35 on: March 14, 2017, 10:25:54 PM »
i get tired of people blaming insurance companies.  they're just pass throughs, the problem is the doctors.

Agreed if "doctors" meaning hospitals, pharma, etc. as well.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #36 on: March 14, 2017, 10:39:05 PM »
Do insurers have a strong audit presence in hospitals?  The amount of waste that I've anecdotally become aware of makes me think there isn't.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #37 on: March 14, 2017, 10:40:55 PM »
Well if you've heard anectdotes that's that then.

Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #38 on: March 14, 2017, 10:55:21 PM »
I think you just about have to start with reforming the FDA to lower healthcare costs. Congressmen also need to stop getting advice from the AMA but I don't see any good way to accomplish that.

Offline kim carnes

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #39 on: March 14, 2017, 10:58:30 PM »
i get tired of people blaming insurance companies.  they're just pass throughs, the problem is the doctors.

???

Offline ednksu

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #40 on: March 14, 2017, 11:03:15 PM »
Do insurers have a strong audit presence in hospitals?  The amount of waste that I've anecdotally become aware of makes me think there isn't.
Kinda, and they are there for pharmacies too, in a big way. 

I'm curious what you see as waste?
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Offline Rage Against the McKee

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #41 on: March 14, 2017, 11:04:33 PM »
Do insurers have a strong audit presence in hospitals?  The amount of waste that I've anecdotally become aware of makes me think there isn't.
Kinda, and they are there for pharmacies too, in a big way. 

I'm curious what you see as waste?

There are a lot of unnecessary tests run.

Offline ednksu

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #42 on: March 14, 2017, 11:04:58 PM »
i get tired of people blaming insurance companies.  they're just pass throughs, the problem is the doctors.
Not sure if you're joking, but this is amazingly wrong.  Insurance companies are becoming very vertically integrated in the healthcare industry with processing and bureaucracy.  They are driving up costs and forcing providers and customers into their networks.
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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #43 on: March 14, 2017, 11:06:25 PM »
Sys is right dude, we gots a problem on the supply side bros
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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #44 on: March 14, 2017, 11:10:06 PM »
What's the average w-2 income for a non-family practitioner m.d., like $600k per year?  Every hospital has like 40 "administrators" making $175k+. eff, an rna working 3 days per week doing mom chores makes like $80k. In every city the hospital is the largest employer. It's not hard to figure out why it's expensive. The insurance company is the only one keeping it from being 3x as expensive
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Offline kim carnes

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #45 on: March 14, 2017, 11:16:13 PM »
This thread is about blaming politicians.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #46 on: March 15, 2017, 12:35:01 AM »
What's the average w-2 income for a non-family practitioner m.d., like $600k per year?  Every hospital has like 40 "administrators" making $175k+. eff, an rna working 3 days per week doing mom chores makes like $80k. In every city the hospital is the largest employer. It's not hard to figure out why it's expensive. The insurance company is the only one keeping it from being 3x as expensive
Closer to 65k for a nurse with 20+ years experience in KS. In CA it can rise up to 80k for an RN.

I'm fairly sure family docs start at around 125k in KS. I do know a crna that made 30k I'm one night though.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #47 on: March 15, 2017, 06:40:10 AM »
It is Ryancare.  The Beloved could never come up with something like this.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #48 on: March 15, 2017, 08:13:29 AM »
i get tired of people blaming insurance companies.  they're just pass throughs, the problem is the doctors.
Not sure if you're joking, but this is amazingly wrong.  Insurance companies are becoming very vertically integrated in the healthcare industry with processing and bureaucracy.  They are driving up costs and forcing providers and customers into their networks.

No, sys is right.

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Re: CBO and Trumpcare (Ryancare?)
« Reply #49 on: March 15, 2017, 09:59:41 AM »
3rd party payers inflate prices, they enable the first party to charge more for their product or service than they could to cash or private finance buyers.  Consider what college tuition would cost without federally backed student loans, would real estate values have bubbled without poor underwriting practices?  Low deductible health plans also inflate the cost of healthcare.  People need skin in the game if you want to control the cost of anything.

Its even worse than that - we're subsidizing and/or masking (through employer co-funding) the cost to the "demand" side while letting the providers on the "supply" side run wild absorbing all that funding.  Medicare reimbursement rates are a partial check on that supply side, but generally inadequate overall.  Providers are still free to accept network contract/discount rates or not. Consider the hospital/provider in/out of network shell game that is popular at the moment - Purely providers gaming the setup: divide and conquer.

Pharma has no checks on what they can command.  And regarding pharma - pretty sure we're (the U.S.) holding the bag for capped prices in all the other price controlled nationalized medicine countries.

Quote
Quote from: ednksu on March 14, 2017, 11:04:58 PM
Quote from: sys on March 14, 2017, 10:00:16 PM
i get tired of people blaming insurance companies.  they're just pass throughs, the problem is the doctors.

Not sure if you're joking, but this is amazingly wrong.  Insurance companies are becoming very vertically integrated in the healthcare industry with processing and bureaucracy.  They are driving up costs and forcing providers and customers into their networks.

While they are becoming the gatekeeper, they're still just a middleman - albeit a very fat one - skimming their 20-30-40%.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2017, 10:12:30 AM by Woogy »