Author Topic: "Obamacare" (Read 317523 times)

catastrophe · « **Reply #2375 on:** April 19, 2016, 05:05:16 PM »

Yea, that sounds like pre-existing conditions to me. The only way you can realistically allow people with pre-existing conditions to participate is if you have a legitimate individual mandate forcing everyone to pay in from the beginning. Obamacare is really weak on the latter, making it pretty awful all around.

chum1 · « **Reply #2376 on:** April 19, 2016, 05:20:49 PM »

It's amazing how insurance companies overlooked all of these totally obvious problems. Conclusion: insurance companies are really dumb about making money.

ednksu · « **Reply #2377 on:** April 20, 2016, 09:48:44 AM »

Quote from: catastrophe on April 19, 2016, 05:05:16 PM

Yea, that sounds like pre-existing conditions to me. The only way you can realistically allow people with pre-existing conditions to participate is if you have a legitimate individual mandate forcing everyone to pay in from the beginning. Obamacare is really weak on the latter, making it pretty awful all around.

Yeah the law was doomed by not having a massive penalty that would have pushed people into the market.

But you guys are kinda right about prexisiting conditions. Previously they would target high risk things. Forinstance, when I was buying private insurance because my job didn't offer anything my left knee was excluded because of a surgery I had in HS. They also excluded my right knee just because. The other issue is lifetime caps, but that is only tangentially related. The problem from the old system is that insurance companies regularly invented prior conditions and killed your coverage. This is actually one of the best things about the ACA because people would always find a way to get their surgery or treatment. They would either get on medicaid, default, on the charges, or work out a payment plan. Most of the time though the payment for the already socialized costs would be pushed onto people with insurance.

chum1 · « **Reply #2378 on:** April 20, 2016, 10:00:44 AM »

I sure hope insurance companies learned their lesson about needing to account for pre-existing conditions!

wetwillie · « **Reply #2379 on:** April 20, 2016, 10:02:29 AM »

Single Payer please.

Ptolemy · « **Reply #2380 on:** April 20, 2016, 10:59:21 AM »

Quote from: wetwillie on April 20, 2016, 10:02:29 AM

Single Payer please.

Absolutely agree! Pay for your own damn health care. You pay for your own car repair, house repair, property upkeep, food, etc. Why is paying for your own health care any different?

wetwillie · « **Reply #2381 on:** April 20, 2016, 11:14:40 AM »

Exactly, just let the government be the insurance company and let's be done with it.

Ptolemy · « **Reply #2382 on:** April 20, 2016, 11:19:01 AM »

Quote from: wetwillie on April 20, 2016, 11:14:40 AM

Exactly, just let the government be the insurance company and let's be done with it.

Wrong. Making government pay for your health care is making me pay for your health care. You pay for you. I will pay for me.

star seed 7 · « **Reply #2383 on:** April 20, 2016, 11:30:15 AM »

Poor people should die in the streets

wetwillie · « **Reply #2384 on:** April 20, 2016, 11:49:25 AM »

Quote from: Ptolemy on April 20, 2016, 11:19:01 AM

Quote from: wetwillie on April 20, 2016, 11:14:40 AM
Exactly, just let the government be the insurance company and let's be done with it.

Wrong. Making government pay for your health care is making me pay for your health care. You pay for you. I will pay for me.

You already pay for my health care and I pay for your health care in the form of insurance companies.

Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) · « **Reply #2385 on:** April 20, 2016, 12:08:34 PM »

Why exactly should young healthy people be forced to insure old and unhealthy people who decided they didn't want to pay for health insurance until they got sick? That seems like an absolutely terrible policy.

star seed 7 · « **Reply #2386 on:** April 20, 2016, 12:16:14 PM »

Exactly, let's get rid of this insurance nonsense

Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) · « **Reply #2387 on:** April 20, 2016, 12:20:00 PM »

Quote from: libliblibliblibliblib on April 20, 2016, 12:16:14 PM

Exactly, let's get rid of this insurance nonsense

Same question, dumbfuck

Tobias · « **Reply #2388 on:** April 20, 2016, 12:20:50 PM »

straight cash homie ought to cleanse our gene pool to an acceptable level

ednksu · « **Reply #2389 on:** April 20, 2016, 01:00:58 PM »

I can't believe that people don't think basic healthcare should be a right as an American citizen. We are the most powerful country to ever exist on the face of the world and we can't take care of people who get the flu.

CNS · « **Reply #2390 on:** April 20, 2016, 01:09:30 PM »

Heard an interview with an Aussie guy a month or so ago. He said they have a combo system where the basics are covered by the govt, but there is a private market for anything you may wish in addition to the basics. He said he pays something like $600 a year and its great. When asked about access, he said that if you have some non emergency stuff, you may wait a couple weeks to a month. He said if you have an accident and need a surgery, you get it that day.

Fake Sugar Dick (WARNING, NOT THE REAL SUGAR DICK!) · « **Reply #2391 on:** April 20, 2016, 01:54:08 PM »

Quote from: ednksu on April 20, 2016, 01:00:58 PM

I can't believe that people don't think basic healthcare should be a right as an American citizen. We are the most powerful country to ever exist on the face of the world and we can't take care of people who get the flu.

Interesting fantasy you've contrived there.

Ptolemy · « **Reply #2392 on:** April 20, 2016, 02:03:00 PM »

Quote from: ednksu on April 20, 2016, 01:00:58 PM

I can't believe that people don't think basic healthcare should be a right as an American citizen.

From where would such a "right" emanate?

Ptolemy · « **Reply #2393 on:** April 20, 2016, 02:04:45 PM »

Quote from: wetwillie on April 20, 2016, 11:49:25 AM

You already pay for my health care and I pay for your health care in the form of insurance companies.

Wrong again. If I pay premiums for health insurance, I am paying a private corporation to insure my health care costs in accordance with the terms of the private contract between me and the insurance company.

Mrs. Gooch · « **Reply #2394 on:** April 20, 2016, 02:05:44 PM »

Quote from: Ptolemy on April 20, 2016, 02:03:00 PM

Quote from: ednksu on April 20, 2016, 01:00:58 PM
I can't believe that people don't think basic healthcare should be a right as an American citizen.

From where would such a "right" emanate?

Flying Spaghetti Monster

catastrophe · « **Reply #2395 on:** April 20, 2016, 02:07:25 PM »

Quote from: CNS on April 20, 2016, 01:09:30 PM

Heard an interview with an Aussie guy a month or so ago. He said they have a combo system where the basics are covered by the govt, but there is a private market for anything you may wish in addition to the basics. He said he pays something like $600 a year and its great. When asked about access, he said that if you have some non emergency stuff, you may wait a couple weeks to a month. He said if you have an accident and need a surgery, you get it that day.

I like the general sound of that. One of the biggest issues with Americans is that we tend to think if we didn't come up with the idea it is probably not that good. Our healthcare system is actually pretty far behind many other developed countries.

People also need to realize that everyone with insurance in this country is already subsidizing basic healthcare costs of the poor and uninsured. Hospitals typically just write off those expenses and pass them on to patients that actually pay.

Mrs. Gooch · « **Reply #2396 on:** April 20, 2016, 02:13:15 PM »

Quote from: catastrophe on April 20, 2016, 02:07:25 PM

Quote from: CNS on April 20, 2016, 01:09:30 PM
Heard an interview with an Aussie guy a month or so ago. He said they have a combo system where the basics are covered by the govt, but there is a private market for anything you may wish in addition to the basics. He said he pays something like $600 a year and its great. When asked about access, he said that if you have some non emergency stuff, you may wait a couple weeks to a month. He said if you have an accident and need a surgery, you get it that day.

I like the general sound of that. One of the biggest issues with Americans is that we tend to think if we didn't come up with the idea it is probably not that good. Our healthcare system is actually pretty far behind many other developed countries.

People also need to realize that everyone with insurance in this country is already subsidizing basic healthcare costs of the poor and uninsured. Hospitals typically just write off those expenses and pass them on to patients that actually pay.

What are considered "basics"? Is preventative care a "basic"?

catastrophe · « **Reply #2397 on:** April 20, 2016, 02:21:30 PM »

I'm not sure, but I would be pretty surprised if poor/uninsured people go to get preventative care in our system. Also don't know about the Aussie system but I would assume that's included in basic. There is a reason insurers want you to get preventative care.

Mrs. Gooch · « **Reply #2398 on:** April 20, 2016, 02:24:33 PM »

Quote from: catastrophe on April 20, 2016, 02:21:30 PM

I'm not sure, but I would be pretty surprised if poor/uninsured people go to get preventative care in our system. Also don't know about the Aussie system but I would assume that's included in basic. There is a reason insurers want you to get preventative care.

No, but if they did have coverage to get preventative care it would save a bunch of money later, so in this "Basics Only" system it should be covered.

wetwillie · « **Reply #2399 on:** April 20, 2016, 02:32:32 PM »

Quote from: Ptolemy on April 20, 2016, 02:04:45 PM

Quote from: wetwillie on April 20, 2016, 11:49:25 AM
You already pay for my health care and I pay for your health care in the form of insurance companies.

Wrong again. If I pay premiums for health insurance, I am paying a private corporation to insure my health care costs in accordance with the terms of the private contract between me and the insurance company.

do you pay more than me in premiums since I'm younger and never get sick?