Author Topic: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University  (Read 40435 times)

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Offline DQ12

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #25 on: December 15, 2017, 02:47:07 PM »
LHC Bill Snyder is the girlfriend you get when you are down but she's still there for you and supports you and all that. then things start clicking and you get super successful and make a ton of money. while she's cute, extremely hot gold diggers are in your league now. at this point the right thing to do is convince yourself that she's holding you back and break it off with her.

kstate is bigger than bill now.

This is brilliant and I think I just had an epiphany.

I wonder if the anti-seanites/pro Venzy crowd represents this that you propose. Sean, at best, is more of Bill 2.0, an eight win program with an occasional run at a conference title. While Brent could mean a shot at something bigger. High risk, high reward.

How you feel about Sean is directly related to how you feel about the current state of the program. Am I on the right track here? @Shooter Jones @Dlew12
Sure.  If our ceiling under sean is more of the same that we've seen over the last 5 seasons then I'll pass.  That said, I don't view Brent as any more "high risk" than Sean, which is where i'm guessing we'd disagree? 

Sean, to me, is a guy with a ton of question marks, outside of, hey, he does a bang up job in the return game.  At least with Brent, we have a guy who has proven that he can coach defense to the highest level and recruit.  I concede that neither is a "sure thing" -- "sure things" are virtually nonexistent in these circumstances.  But I prefer Brent's proven track record versus Sean's, which presumably consists of some intimate father-son time wherein Bill share's all of his secrets to success.


"You want to stand next to someone and not be able to hear them, walk your ass into Manhattan, Kansas." - [REDACTED]

Offline BackPayne

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #26 on: December 15, 2017, 03:00:53 PM »
Hey 4*/5* recruit, would you rather play for HC Sean, who has coached ST and almost got to the NC game in 1998 or a HC Brent who has been a DC for two NC teams and a continual Top 5/10 team?

Easy choice.

Offline Joker

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #27 on: December 15, 2017, 03:07:06 PM »
Hey 4*/5* recruit, would you rather play for HC Sean, who has coached ST and almost got to the NC game in 1998 or a HC Brent who has been a DC for two NC teams and a continual Top 5/10 team?

Easy choice.

I don't think anyone is disputing the fact that Brent is a far superior recruiter.  If recruiting prowess is your only criterion for choosing a HC then, yeah, Brent all the way.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #28 on: December 15, 2017, 03:10:12 PM »
LHC Bill Snyder is the girlfriend you get when you are down but she's still there for you and supports you and all that. then things start clicking and you get super successful and make a ton of money. while she's cute, extremely hot gold diggers are in your league now. at this point the right thing to do is convince yourself that she's holding you back and break it off with her.

kstate is bigger than bill now.

This is brilliant and I think I just had an epiphany.

I wonder if the anti-seanites/pro Venzy crowd represents this that you propose. Sean, at best, is more of Bill 2.0, an eight win program with an occasional run at a conference title. While Brent could mean a shot at something bigger. High risk, high reward.

How you feel about Sean is directly related to how you feel about the current state of the program. Am I on the right track here? @Shooter Jones @Dlew12
Sure.  If our ceiling under sean is more of the same that we've seen over the last 5 seasons then I'll pass.  That said, I don't view Brent as any more "high risk" than Sean, which is where i'm guessing we'd disagree? 

Sean, to me, is a guy with a ton of question marks, outside of, hey, he does a bang up job in the return game.  At least with Brent, we have a guy who has proven that he can coach defense to the highest level and recruit.  I concede that neither is a "sure thing" -- "sure things" are virtually nonexistent in these circumstances.  But I prefer Brent's proven track record versus Sean's, which presumably consists of some intimate father-son time wherein Bill share's all of his secrets to success.

Brent represents slightly higher risk because he doesn't seem to externally possess any qualities you'd want in someone you'd want to run a program. He connotes winning, not leadership, like nothing about him does.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #29 on: December 15, 2017, 03:11:28 PM »
Hey 4*/5* recruit, would you rather play for HC Sean, who has coached ST and almost got to the NC game in 1998 or a HC Brent who has been a DC for two NC teams and a continual Top 5/10 team?

Easy choice.

Is life really this simplistic?

Offline DQ12

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #30 on: December 15, 2017, 03:11:49 PM »
Brent represents slightly higher risk because he doesn't seem to externally possess any qualities you'd want in someone you'd want to run a program. He connotes winning, not leadership, like nothing about him does.
No clue what you're basing this on. 


"You want to stand next to someone and not be able to hear them, walk your ass into Manhattan, Kansas." - [REDACTED]

Offline meow meow

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #31 on: December 15, 2017, 03:19:21 PM »
he yells and needs someone to hold him back on the sideline = awful leader

Offline LickNeckey

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Re: LHC LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #32 on: December 15, 2017, 03:44:18 PM »
id tell you to eat a dick but you already have bill's in your mouth

i stand corrected

you are stupid

Offline Shooter Jones

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #33 on: December 15, 2017, 04:20:09 PM »
LHC Bill Snyder is the girlfriend you get when you are down but she's still there for you and supports you and all that. then things start clicking and you get super successful and make a ton of money. while she's cute, extremely hot gold diggers are in your league now. at this point the right thing to do is convince yourself that she's holding you back and break it off with her.

kstate is bigger than bill now.

This is brilliant and I think I just had an epiphany.

I wonder if the anti-seanites/pro Venzy crowd represents this that you propose. Sean, at best, is more of Bill 2.0, an eight win program with an occasional run at a conference title. While Brent could mean a shot at something bigger. High risk, high reward.

How you feel about Sean is directly related to how you feel about the current state of the program. Am I on the right track here? @Shooter Jones @Dlew12
Sure.  If our ceiling under sean is more of the same that we've seen over the last 5 seasons then I'll pass.  That said, I don't view Brent as any more "high risk" than Sean, which is where i'm guessing we'd disagree? 

Sean, to me, is a guy with a ton of question marks, outside of, hey, he does a bang up job in the return game.  At least with Brent, we have a guy who has proven that he can coach defense to the highest level and recruit.  I concede that neither is a "sure thing" -- "sure things" are virtually nonexistent in these circumstances.  But I prefer Brent's proven track record versus Sean's, which presumably consists of some intimate father-son time wherein Bill share's all of his secrets to success.

Brent represents slightly higher risk because he doesn't seem to externally possess any qualities you'd want in someone you'd want to run a program. He connotes winning, not leadership, like nothing about him does.

And Sean does possess the qualities you'd want? I'd honestly like to know what you think.

I guess I just think some people are convinced Sean is a Bill clone? Or at least a Kroger brand Bill? When I don't see any similarities and really don't think he has done anything to make me think he can lead this program, but I could be persuaded if someone wants to make some good points.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #34 on: December 15, 2017, 04:29:58 PM »
Brent represents slightly higher risk because he doesn't seem to externally possess any qualities you'd want in someone you'd want to run a program. He connotes winning, not leadership, like nothing about him does.
No clue what you're basing this on.

https://www.postandcourier.com/sports/brent-venables-had-opportunities-to-leave-clemson-nothing-was-too/article_2edd4898-e134-11e7-9f57-3b5351d9955d.html







Offline MakeItRain

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #35 on: December 15, 2017, 04:39:03 PM »
LHC Bill Snyder is the girlfriend you get when you are down but she's still there for you and supports you and all that. then things start clicking and you get super successful and make a ton of money. while she's cute, extremely hot gold diggers are in your league now. at this point the right thing to do is convince yourself that she's holding you back and break it off with her.

kstate is bigger than bill now.

This is brilliant and I think I just had an epiphany.

I wonder if the anti-seanites/pro Venzy crowd represents this that you propose. Sean, at best, is more of Bill 2.0, an eight win program with an occasional run at a conference title. While Brent could mean a shot at something bigger. High risk, high reward.

How you feel about Sean is directly related to how you feel about the current state of the program. Am I on the right track here? @Shooter Jones @Dlew12
Sure.  If our ceiling under sean is more of the same that we've seen over the last 5 seasons then I'll pass.  That said, I don't view Brent as any more "high risk" than Sean, which is where i'm guessing we'd disagree? 

Sean, to me, is a guy with a ton of question marks, outside of, hey, he does a bang up job in the return game.  At least with Brent, we have a guy who has proven that he can coach defense to the highest level and recruit.  I concede that neither is a "sure thing" -- "sure things" are virtually nonexistent in these circumstances.  But I prefer Brent's proven track record versus Sean's, which presumably consists of some intimate father-son time wherein Bill share's all of his secrets to success.

Brent represents slightly higher risk because he doesn't seem to externally possess any qualities you'd want in someone you'd want to run a program. He connotes winning, not leadership, like nothing about him does.
And Sean does possess the qualities you'd want? I'd honestly like to know what you think.

No idea. You guys keep wanting me to paint Sean in a positive light in comparison to Brent when, before today I've said over and over that to me they would represent similar hires.

I do know that Sean doesn't need a grown man to physically restrain him in the course of doing his job. I also know that Sean doesn't have public quotes shying away from the the responsibility of being K-State's head coach, if he did I'd turn my back on him too.

IMO there are things about both that you have to hold your nose and tolerate, it's just with each Venables quote my tolerance is being eroded. It's very possible that Sean would say similar things, but unlike Brent, Sean hasn't stripped the mystery of his mindset.

Offline meow meow

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #36 on: December 15, 2017, 04:53:54 PM »
 :lol:

Offline CHONGS

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #37 on: December 15, 2017, 05:47:02 PM »
Genuinely curious, what has changed since:

Anyone opposed to Snyder being on the interview panel? I think it would help the new coach to have that seal of approval with the fanbase.

I'm opposed. He wants his son who wants no part of the job to coach, his judgement is highly questionable.

What has convinced you that Sean wants the job now?

Offline Trim

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #38 on: December 15, 2017, 08:48:35 PM »
I do know that Sean doesn't need a grown man to physically restrain him in the course of doing his job.

He might not need one, but if he had one, it'd have prevented a 15-yard penalty.

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #39 on: December 15, 2017, 09:59:34 PM »
Genuinely curious, what has changed since:

Anyone opposed to Snyder being on the interview panel? I think it would help the new coach to have that seal of approval with the fanbase.

I'm opposed. He wants his son who wants no part of the job to coach, his judgement is highly questionable.

What has convinced you that Sean wants the job now?

I don't, I've hedged that about five times today alone. He's certainly not publicly shying away from the possibility though.

Offline CHONGS

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #40 on: December 16, 2017, 07:52:54 AM »
How did you know he wanted no part of the job if he didn't say anything publicly?

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Online catastrophe

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #41 on: December 16, 2017, 08:23:20 AM »
Sean is definitely high risk.

Offline IPA4Me

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #42 on: December 16, 2017, 08:40:51 AM »
How did you know he wanted no part of the job if he didn't say anything publicly?

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I honestly think that was in an interview somewhere in the past. Maybe I'm fusing message board with actual news.

Offline Whisker Biscuit

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #43 on: December 16, 2017, 09:20:17 AM »
Hey 4*/5* recruit, would you rather play for HC Sean, who has coached ST and almost got to the NC game in 1998 or a HC Brent who has been a DC for two NC teams and a continual Top 5/10 team?

Easy choice.

I don't think anyone is disputing the fact that Brent is a far superior recruiter.  If recruiting prowess is your only criterion for choosing a HC then, yeah, Brent all the way.

It's just hysterical how people judge "recruiting prowess" by the ability to sign recruits deemed 4 and 5 stars by people like Jeremy Crabtree who last wore a football helmet while riding his big wheel.  I love Jeremy but i couldn't give two shits about his thoughts about the football ability of a recruit.  A coaches recruiting ability should be judged by the number of players that are recognized at the end of the season for postseason accolades. 

EDIT:  Post season accolades is only one measure, a very important one, and infinitely more important than how the class is ranked by a website.  That's my point.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2017, 09:24:56 AM by Whisker Biscuit »

Offline MakeItRain

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #44 on: December 16, 2017, 10:43:55 AM »
How did you know he wanted no part of the job if he didn't say anything publicly?

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I honestly think that was in an interview somewhere in the past. Maybe I'm fusing message board with actual news.

Same, maybe conjecture, I don't know, that was nearly a year ago

Offline Joker

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #45 on: December 16, 2017, 10:51:17 AM »
Hey 4*/5* recruit, would you rather play for HC Sean, who has coached ST and almost got to the NC game in 1998 or a HC Brent who has been a DC for two NC teams and a continual Top 5/10 team?

Easy choice.

I don't think anyone is disputing the fact that Brent is a far superior recruiter.  If recruiting prowess is your only criterion for choosing a HC then, yeah, Brent all the way.

It's just hysterical how people judge "recruiting prowess" by the ability to sign recruits deemed 4 and 5 stars by people like Jeremy Crabtree who last wore a football helmet while riding his big wheel.  I love Jeremy but i couldn't give two shits about his thoughts about the football ability of a recruit.  A coaches recruiting ability should be judged by the number of players that are recognized at the end of the season for postseason accolades. 

EDIT:  Post season accolades is only one measure, a very important one, and infinitely more important than how the class is ranked by a website.  That's my point.

So, we're going down the "stars don't matter" road on this?

Offline BackPayne

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #46 on: December 16, 2017, 11:12:08 AM »
JFC, guys.  Why are we content with 3* and lower players?  We are OK with them and Bill, but if we want to consistently compete for a Big12 championship and even think of getting close to the National Championship it will take athletes with elite talent. 


Offline everyone shut up

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #47 on: December 16, 2017, 02:39:09 PM »
JFC, guys.  Why are we content with 3* and lower players?  We are OK with them and Bill, but if we want to consistently compete for a Big12 championship and even think of getting close to the National Championship it will take athletes with elite talent.
Barring our injuries, we would have done that this season, IMO.

Offline michigancat

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #48 on: December 16, 2017, 02:58:44 PM »
Hey 4*/5* recruit, would you rather play for HC Sean, who has coached ST and almost got to the NC game in 1998 or a HC Brent who has been a DC for two NC teams and a continual Top 5/10 team?

Easy choice.
Sean was in administration through all of Snyder 1.0. So he would be a liar in this scenario.

http://www.kstatesports.com/news/2005/12/9/5583dd8ae4b06b726e664288_131478204962256002.aspx

Offline SkinnyBenny

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Re: LHC Bill Snyder saved Kansas State University
« Reply #49 on: December 16, 2017, 03:02:54 PM »
JFC, guys.  Why are we content with 3* and lower players?  We are OK with them and Bill, but if we want to consistently compete for a Big12 championship and even think of getting close to the National Championship it will take athletes with elite talent.
Barring our injuries, we would have done that this season, IMO.

Hopefully you're including our coaches' injured brains in that assessment.
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