Smoke your cigars and enjoy the band while you can....

[TheHamburglar]

I also have gripes with pro leagues because non-division games count in who wins the division. A team that goes 6-10 in the nfl and undefeated in the division should be in the playoffs. Let out of division games determine wildcards.

The nfl has a balanced schedule.  All the teams in a division play roughly the same schedules.

The nfl is the gold standard for maintaining the importance of the regular season while settling the 'ship via playoff.

The NFL doesn't have a balanced schedule.  Win your division last year, you play all 3 other division champs in your conference.  Finish last in you division last year, play all 3 other last place finishers in your conference.

[scottwildcat]

All kidding and faux tough guy by me aside the proposed 8 team playoff with how the big 12 is currently set up would never get us in where the current 4 team playoff wouldn't

So we never get in?

In the current format we would have gotten in in both '98 and '12 as non champions

And again I stand by my statement I think there is a better chance we eventually find a way to win a national title by having a season where we are considered a top 4 team and winning two games, than not being considered a top 4 team, winning a CCG, winning a campus qtr final game, a bowl semi, and a national title.

This is literally true though of any team though.

that's fine. I was using that statement directly to refute the claim by others that moving to 8 would give us a better chance to win a national title.

[TheHamburglar]

We wouldn't have gotten in in 2012.  We lost by 28 to Baylor in mid-November.

It would have been Notre Dame, Alabama, Florida, and Oregon.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I don't get the "conference championship should be required" crowd at all.  If we want to make the OOC exhibition games, that's one thing, but if not, then OOC games should count just as much into the "resume" as conference games.

The regular season should mean something. Every team's goal to start the year is to win their conference. You shouldn't reward failure. In college football, the regular season is supposed to be the playoff.

[KITNfury]

I don't get the "conference championship should be required" crowd at all.  If we want to make the OOC exhibition games, that's one thing, but if not, then OOC games should count just as much into the "resume" as conference games.

The regular season should mean something. Every team's goal to start the year is to win their conference. You shouldn't reward failure. In college football, the regular season is supposed to be the playoff.

The biggest problem with the situation this year is that the Big 10 presents PSU as the best team as the conference, as settle as fairly as possible by actual on the field play.  But then the ice skating judges come in and declare,  arbitrarily,  that another team is better.

I'm not arguing that OSU or UM are better than PSU,  they likely are. However,  on the field play determined PSU was the best.  Sometimes,  nah eff that,  usually it shoudl be about earning what you get.  PSU earned it.  Conference champs earn it.  If some really good team drops the ball a time or two and that costs them a spot,  thems the breaks.

[Rage Against the McKee]

I agree. I think that OSU and Michigan are both better than Penn State, but the Big 10 says Penn State is their best team, so we should all respect their decision. None of us know better than they do about who their best team is.

[BW]

We wouldn't have gotten in in 2012.  We lost by 28 to Baylor in mid-November.

It would have been Notre Dame, Alabama, Florida, and Oregon.

http://picksixpreviews.com/2012-college-football-playoff-simulation.html

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk

[kim carnes]

I agree. I think that OSU and Michigan are both better than Penn State, but the Big 10 says Penn State is their best team, so we should all respect their decision. None of us know better than they do about who their best team is.

Ok man

[DQ12]

I don't get the "conference championship should be required" crowd at all.  If we want to make the OOC exhibition games, that's one thing, but if not, then OOC games should count just as much into the "resume" as conference games.

The regular season should mean something. Every team's goal to start the year is to win their conference. You shouldn't reward failure. In college football, the regular season is supposed to be the playoff.

If the regular season is to mean anything, then you shouldn't put a two loss team in over a one loss team.

[kim carnes]

I don't get the "conference championship should be required" crowd at all.  If we want to make the OOC exhibition games, that's one thing, but if not, then OOC games should count just as much into the "resume" as conference games.

The regular season should mean something. Every team's goal to start the year is to win their conference. You shouldn't reward failure. In college football, the regular season is supposed to be the playoff.

The reason penn st isn't in is bc they lost 2 games during the regular season you dumbass

[Rage Against the McKee]

We wouldn't have gotten in in 2012.  We lost by 28 to Baylor in mid-November.

It would have been Notre Dame, Alabama, Florida, and Oregon.

http://picksixpreviews.com/2012-college-football-playoff-simulation.html

Sent from my VS987 using Tapatalk

http://www.si.com/college-football/2012/11/29/college-football-playoff-mock-selection-committee

Stunningly, that meant Kansas State -- a recent No. 1 team and the presumptive 11-1 Big 12 champion -- did not make the committee's top eight. Most members could not get past the Wildcats' 52-24 drubbing by then 4-5 Baylor.

[KITNfury]

I don't get the "conference championship should be required" crowd at all.  If we want to make the OOC exhibition games, that's one thing, but if not, then OOC games should count just as much into the "resume" as conference games.

The regular season should mean something. Every team's goal to start the year is to win their conference. You shouldn't reward failure. In college football, the regular season is supposed to be the playoff.

The reason penn st isn't in is bc they lost 2 games during the regular season you dumbass

Kim likes ice skating.

[catastrophe]

One thing I think gets overlooked in an 8 team playoff is that it would encourage way more schools to play a tougher non-con. Schools like KSU could never get a playoff at large bid with 2 losses, so they are incentivized to schedule an easy non-con in the hope that they go undefeated.

However, if there are only 2-3 at large spots AND you can get in by winning your conference, schools would have no reason NOT to schedule much better non-con games.

[KITNfury]

One thing I think gets overlooked in an 8 team playoff is that it would encourage way more schools to play a tougher non-con. Schools like KSU could never get a playoff at large bid with 2 losses, so they are incentivized to schedule an easy non-con in the hope that they go undefeated.

However, if there are only 2-3 at large spots AND you can get in by winning your conference, schools would have no reason NOT to schedule much better non-con games.

......

And the added benefit of that is there is less risk to scheduling good/tough OOC games.  Losing in the OOC only hurts if you think you're going to A.  Lose your conference and B.  Still be good enough to get an at large.  If you fall into category B,  you're probably not scared of losing to very many teams. 8 team playoff has so many advantages.

Agreed

[michigancat]

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

[DQ12]

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

k-state could get in with 2 losses if k-state's resume relative to the field warranted it. 

[KITNfury]

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

That shouldn't matter,  but I think you know that.

[michigancat]

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

k-state could get in with 2 losses if k-state's resume relative to the field warranted it. 

Yeah. But I still think the "resume" is heavily influenced by preseason rankings, which are heavily influenced by prior season results. I think we're far from a CFP caliber program, but winning a bowl game would likely lead to a nice preseason ranking in 2017, which would be huge for final CFP rankings.

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

That shouldn't matter,  but I think you know that.

Except it always will as long as there are humans voting. It isn't unfair because the same rules pretty much apply to everyone - start with a high preseason ranking, win your games, and you'll be in much better shape than the team that started the season unranked and had similar wins.

[DQ12]

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

k-state could get in with 2 losses if k-state's resume relative to the field warranted it. 

Yeah. But I still think the "resume" is heavily influenced by preseason rankings, which are heavily influenced by prior season results. I think we're far from a CFP caliber program, but winning a bowl game would likely lead to a nice preseason ranking in 2017, which would be huge for final CFP rankings.

I don't think preseason rankings have any effect at all. 

[catastrophe]

Except it always will as long as there are humans voting. It isn't unfair because the same rules pretty much apply to everyone - start with a high preseason ranking, win your games, and you'll be in much better shape than the team that started the season unranked and had similar wins.

Yea, it's a sneaky thing that people don't realize, but if you (and teams in your conference) start out highly ranked, they're probably going to stay that way. If #5 OU loses to unranked KSU early in the season, OU probably falls to #20 and KSU -might- be ranked the next week.

If #5 OU loses to #10 KSU, they probably flip spots, which gives more teams in the conference an opportunity for top-10 wins and fewer opportunities for bad losses.

What Baylor's schedule was flipped in 2012 (win all their games leading up to KSU and lose the rest)? It's these kind of arbitrary things that actually make a difference.

[KITNfury]

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

k-state could get in with 2 losses if k-state's resume relative to the field warranted it. 

Yeah. But I still think the "resume" is heavily influenced by preseason rankings, which are heavily influenced by prior season results. I think we're far from a CFP caliber program, but winning a bowl game would likely lead to a nice preseason ranking in 2017, which would be huge for final CFP rankings.

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

That shouldn't matter,  but I think you know that.

Except it always will as long as there are humans voting. It isn't unfair because the same rules pretty much apply to everyone - start with a high preseason ranking, win your games, and you'll be in much better shape than the team that started the season unranked and had similar wins.

There are no rules.  Guidelines at best.  There simply is no reason to use "judgment"  for sports that compete against each other in a field of play.  Like has been said,  the conference schedule is a tournament of sorts.  It is there to determine who that conference declares as "the best".  And whether someone's opinion turns out to be right,  using subjective measure like "eyeball test"  or whatever makes the current playoff a joke.  It's way better than what the history of Cfb has provided us,  but still a joke. 

There simply is too strong of an argument to let each conference present their "best"  (however they determine that team is)  to be included in the championship picture.  I'd let the G5 decide on their own how they decide who their best is.  Then let a committee pick the other 2 teams.  And there will undoubtedly be teams that feel snubbed,  but they could have won their conference and didn't,  so too bad so sad.

[DQ12]

There are no rules.  Guidelines at best.  There simply is no reason to use "judgment"  for sports that compete against each other in a field of play.  Like has been said,  the conference schedule is a tournament of sorts.  It is there to determine who that conference declares as "the best".  And whether someone's opinion turns out to be right,  using subjective measure like "eyeball test"  or whatever makes the current playoff a joke.  It's way better than what the history of Cfb has provided us,  but still a joke. 

There simply is no strong argument to let each conference present their "best"  (however they determine that team is)  to be included in the championship picture.  I'd let the G5 decide on their own how they decide who their best is.  Then let a committee pick the other 2 teams.  And there will undoubtedly be teams that feel snubbed,  but they could have won their conference and didn't,  so too bad so sad.

So go ahead and make OOC equivalent to the NFL preseason then?  That's certainly an option, but it sounds boring AF. 

Your conference record should not weigh into the equation anymore than you OOC should.  That's how CFB works.  It's how it's always worked.  Winning the conference has always been a prize in and of itself.

[michigancat]

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

k-state could get in with 2 losses if k-state's resume relative to the field warranted it. 

Yeah. But I still think the "resume" is heavily influenced by preseason rankings, which are heavily influenced by prior season results. I think we're far from a CFP caliber program, but winning a bowl game would likely lead to a nice preseason ranking in 2017, which would be huge for final CFP rankings.

I don't think preseason rankings have any effect at all. 

It absolutely does. If not your own preseason ranking, the preseason ranking of the teams you play have a huge effect on the humans voting. But really both have an impact.

[michigancat]

There are no rules.  Guidelines at best.  There simply is no reason to use "judgment"  for sports that compete against each other in a field of play.  Like has been said,  the conference schedule is a tournament of sorts.  It is there to determine who that conference declares as "the best".  And whether someone's opinion turns out to be right,  using subjective measure like "eyeball test"  or whatever makes the current playoff a joke.  It's way better than what the history of Cfb has provided us,  but still a joke. 

There simply is too strong of an argument to let each conference present their "best"  (however they determine that team is)  to be included in the championship picture.  I'd let the G5 decide on their own how they decide who their best is.  Then let a committee pick the other 2 teams.  And there will undoubtedly be teams that feel snubbed,  but they could have won their conference and didn't,  so too bad so sad.

I agree. I personally think computers should choose and every team should know the formula being used.

[DQ12]

KSU could get in with 2 losses if they could show they were an elite program more than once every 15 years.

k-state could get in with 2 losses if k-state's resume relative to the field warranted it. 

Yeah. But I still think the "resume" is heavily influenced by preseason rankings, which are heavily influenced by prior season results. I think we're far from a CFP caliber program, but winning a bowl game would likely lead to a nice preseason ranking in 2017, which would be huge for final CFP rankings.

I don't think preseason rankings have any effect at all. 

It absolutely does. If not your own preseason ranking, the preseason ranking of the teams you play have a huge effect on the humans voting. But really both have an impact.

You may be right, I just can't think of an instance where it's occurred in the current model.  Can you?